Check those front balljoints..........

+1 with putting the Moogs in for the moment. They will get you down the road to work to make more $$$ to buy OEM ball joints to replace the Moogs in the future.

Glad you were not hurt; that must have been quite an eye opening experience.
 
Well while you are in there, go ahead and replace the Radiator too. If you missed the multitude of LBJ threads, there's a good chance you didn't see any about the strawberry Milkshakes either.

Glad you weren't hurt.

By the way. Moog is crap. Return them and buy OEM. too many members who used non-OEM LBJs have had them die in 20-30,000 miles.
Moog is crap? Lol since when ... ?
 
Moog is crap? Lol since when ... ?

Since the last couple years... Moog ball joint quality is decreasing. OP, if you are going to do ball joints then you are going to need an alignment. Save yourself the ass pain and do it right the 1st time.
 
Anecdotal Info

Tim,

Sorry for your experience but glad nobody was hurt.

Did you have any symptoms that in retrospect could have indicated an issue?

I replaced my LBJs at 145k miles thanks to info I obtained at this Site. Since the day I bought my 4runner brand new in July 98 there was a slight vibration/wobble in the steering wheel at certain speeds(65 - 70mph). I took it back to the dealer early and was told they could find no issue. Knowing nothing at that time that could be the cause I accepted the issue and moved on. Over the years the wobble had gotten more and more pronounced at the same speeds and even at lower speed and that's across many sets of tires, alignments, etc.

Three months ago I DIY replaced those LBJ's and OTRE's with Toyota parts and then took it in for alignment. I took it straight to the freeway after and the wobble was gone, completely, and it remains so now.

This leads me to believe that something about the original LBJ's was the root cause from day one and that I'm blessed not to have had a failure like yours.

And I wonder: did you have any symptoms like this?
 
Tim,

Sorry for your experience but glad nobody was hurt.

Did you have any symptoms that in retrospect could have indicated an issue?
SNIP

And I wonder: did you have any symptoms like this?

I did notice from the time I first got the truck that it had a shutter around 60-65
The only recent issue was the stiff steering I experienced yesterday that accompanied some PS Pump whine. Now I know it wasn't the PS Pump(Which is what I was worried about)
 
cant take it anymore!!! just ordered some (at 135k)

now i guess i can do the lift+LBJ at the same time


Parts and Accessories Order ID: ********
Qty Description Core Price
1 Collision Catalog - 2000 - Toyota - 4RUNNER
front suspension, suspension components, lower ball joint 4WD Left $0.00 $77.45
1 Collision Catalog - 2000 - Toyota - 4RUNNER
front suspension, suspension components, lower ball joint 4WD Right $0.00 $85.16
8 OEM Catalog - Toyota
BOLT, FLANGE $0.00 $6.80
Sub Total: $169.41
Tax $0.00
Free Fed Ex Ground Shipping - Shipping $0.00
Handling Fee $3.00
Total: $172.41



ordered from
https://parts.camelbacktoyota.com
soemone else said good price and shipped fast
 
Shudder

I did notice from the time I first got the truck that it had a shutter around 60-65
The only recent issue was the stiff steering I experienced yesterday that accompanied some PS Pump whine. Now I know it wasn't the PS Pump(Which is what I was worried about)

Shudder - that's a good description for what I was calling wobble.

The background scenery in your picture looks nice. What part of Phoenix?
 
Tim,

Sorry for your experience but glad nobody was hurt.

Did you have any symptoms that in retrospect could have indicated an issue?

I replaced my LBJs at 145k miles thanks to info I obtained at this Site. Since the day I bought my 4runner brand new in July 98 there was a slight vibration/wobble in the steering wheel at certain speeds(65 - 70mph). I took it back to the dealer early and was told they could find no issue. Knowing nothing at that time that could be the cause I accepted the issue and moved on. Over the years the wobble had gotten more and more pronounced at the same speeds and even at lower speed and that's across many sets of tires, alignments, etc.

Three months ago I DIY replaced those LBJ's and OTRE's with Toyota parts and then took it in for alignment. I took it straight to the freeway after and the wobble was gone, completely, and it remains so now.

This leads me to believe that something about the original LBJ's was the root cause from day one and that I'm blessed not to have had a failure like yours.

And I wonder: did you have any symptoms like this?
I have had the exact same issues with mine since I rolled it off the lot brand new! Also a 98! I had my front axles replaced after my lift and tore the boots and it went away dramatically....but there is still a lingering wobble although not as bad. I have not yet replaced my LBJ...but it would seem like I am way past due at just a hair shy of 300k.
 
cant take it anymore!!! just ordered some (at 135k)

now i guess i can do the lift+LBJ at the same time

Go for it, you'll be on Cloud 9 when it's done. I strongly recommend the writeup by SpongerX. It helped me greatly. I used two tie rod pullers. The HF one for the LBJ and the 'small' one from OReilly for the OTRE. Much better than a picklefork to me.
 
Small World

I have had the exact same issues with mine since I rolled it off the lot brand new! Also a 98! I had my front axles replaced after my lift and tore the boots and it went away dramatically....but there is still a lingering wobble although not as bad. I have not yet replaced my LBJ...but it would seem like I am way past due at just a hair shy of 300k.

Wow, that's a coincidence! As mentioned above see the SpongerX procedure and good luck.
 
How is the moog parts so bad? There top of the line aftermarket replacements on every other vehicle. Im a service manager at Tires Plus and all my years i or my techs either one have seen or heard of ball joint problems on Toyotas till i got on the forum. Im gonna check mine tomorrow at work and make sure there tight and boots arent busted. And Im not getting into a debate over moog or oem lbjs Im just curious. Thanks for the info ahead of time.
 
These are tough to check for play because of their orientation, they are constantly under tension. You need to lift them from under the ball joint to unload the joint and then use a pry bar to check play. In short, these joints are tight all the way up to the point they pop out of the socket. From reading posts of people where the joint failed, they said the steering was notchy just before it failed. Not much warning at all.

Moog use to have a good rep but the quality isn't there anymore. Made in China I believe.

On a previous van we owned, I would have to replace the ball joint every 20,000 miles. The moog LBJs failed in 12,000 miles. After searching the web, it looks like a common theme for moog parts. Anyway, OEM is the better choice.
 
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How is the moog parts so bad? There top of the line aftermarket replacements on every other vehicle. Im a service manager at Tires Plus and all my years i or my techs either one have seen or heard of ball joint problems on Toyotas till i got on the forum. Im gonna check mine tomorrow at work and make sure there tight and boots arent busted. And Im not getting into a debate over moog or oem lbjs Im just curious. Thanks for the info ahead of time.

None of us can give you definitive evidence that Moog is worse than OEM because none of us have assembled reliability data of a large enough sample size to to give a conclusions with statistical certainty.

but......... you don't need statistical evidence to draw a "likely" conclusion. Check out this thread: http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/129971-ball-joints-whered-ya-getem-how-much.html. Izzard links to a couple other threads of Moog vs OEM, etc. and I give some reasons to go with only OEM. There has been lots of discussion here about it, so search on it and read up.

Overall though, general rule (at least for high reliability vehicles like Toyota, Honda, or German cars, Subaru, etc) is that OEM is higher quality than aftermarket. Most things, aftermarket is cheaper, and there's a reason they're cheaper; cheaper materials, less testing/qualification, less engineering design time, fewer design iterations. Not a recipe for quality.

Some aftermarkets do only 1 thing, and could potentially get better at something than OEM's, like for example the audio companies. What happened in that market? Eventually those aftermarket companies that were better than the OEM (and more expensive, like Bose, Infinity, Kenwood, Alpine, Sony, etc.) struck deals with OEM to provide their product stock. Now, most vehicles other than very base low cost models have a name-brand stereo system.
 
I am getting more and more confused on what is a quality ball joint versus crap.
I looked at the Moogs I'd bought six months ago and the have a '555' casting, and the ball joint it self says 'Made in Japan' with a '555' stamping.
Kit comes with the nut and cotter, which is what I understand the OEM kit contains.

From everything I can find it appears as though the ball joints I have are made by the same company that makes them for Toyota, as they are not remans, but new.

I also stopped by a Toyota dealer that a friend works at(as a mechanic) to pick up some OEM parts (water pump, timing belt, etc); and chatted with him a bit. The did not have the Ball joints in stock, so I didn't get them.

Just unsure of what to do now. The fact is that I already have them (the Moogs) and would be looking at spending another hundred or so on OEMs, even getting my friends employee discount. And because the Moogs are past the point of returning them, I'd be looking at losing that money.

My thought right now is that I am just going to have to start doing a ball joint check every time I do my oil if I use the Moogs.
 
Put a new MOOG ball joint with the 555 casting in one hand, and put an OEM ball joint in the other. Tell us what feels stronger. The OEM ball joints are SOLID and the rubber boot around the joint is much more durable.
 
Well while you are in there, go ahead and replace the Radiator too. If you missed the multitude of LBJ threads, there's a good chance you didn't see any about the strawberry Milkshakes either.

Glad you weren't hurt.

By the way. Moog is crap. Return them and buy OEM. too many members who used non-OEM LBJs have had them die in 20-30,000 miles.

Agreed. Life is short enough to risk Moog. I've been accused of being thrifty, but I'm OEM all the way on LBJs.
 
Dammit.

Decided to do the timing belt while waiting of the last of the suspension parts came in.
Upper idler bolt snapped in half while putting it back in.

Any idea on where to get this bolt? The online vendors don't list it. and it is not a regular bolt as it has a step for the idler built into it.
 
oh man! :repuke:'

i just replaced the right side LBJ because of stories like this..... mine was the ORIGINAL OEM with 239k miles on it!!!!s my truck drive so much straighter now it was immediately noticeable how she handles better! thanks for informing my ignorant arse guys! i bought RAYBESTOS from rock auto.com, they seam to be on par with the OEM's, feeling and thickness of medals and such....

so about the Upper Ball Joints (UBJ), i think mine are OEM also (with 239k miles on them) is replacing them about the same work as the LBJ's? threads like this scare the bejesus out of me....
 
always a bad day. and this was 3 houses down from mine.
 

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