Clutch pedal being weird
- Thread starter Difflock
- Start date
endgame56
New member
This sounds like your master cylinder is shot and probably has an internal leak that's preventing it from building and holding pressure effectively. Just went through this with the GFs Accord, though it failed in a much more spectacular manner.
Let us know how it goes, but I think you're spot on in replacing the cylinders.
Difflock
New member
Thanks man, hearing that will help me sleep better until my cylinder comes
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St Runner
Member
A spongy feel is either air in the line or a master/slave that is going bad. If you had to put fluid in I would double check the hardline for any leaks after you replace the master/ slave. A late engagement could be a worn disk or improper adjustment. The fsm says to adjust the pedal 6 3/4" off the floor before you adjust the rod through the firewall. That adjustment is done with the clutch cancel switch at the top of the pedal. Also make sure the little plastic button that the clutch cancel switch hits is not broken. There are three of those buttons. One at the clutch cancel one at the clutch start and one on the brake light switches
endgame56
New member
If it's hydraulics, in the absence of any visible leaks, it's the master. If the seals on the slave are shot, you'll see hydraulic fluid leaking around the pushrod. There's no reservoir for the fluid to flow back to so it goes somewhere.
An internal MC leak won't necessarily have any visible symptoms since the fluid can just flow back into the reservoir. MC can also leak externally, but I feel like if that was the case OP would've mentioned it.
St Runner
Member
As a rule of thumb if you are replacing the master clutch you replace the slave at the same time. If one is going the other is not far behind. It also make you replace all the fluid so everything starts fresh. I agree that the clutch spring is a problem with a lot of clutch problems and taking it out will remove that factor. Then you can decide how you want to correct it. Once again even though no one really wants to hear it, adjust your pedal height BEFORE you adjust anything on the rod to the master cylinder
Difflock
New member
Does not ever slip. Drive up hill with stops and starts to work every day. Never has it ever slipped. Can you just pop out the spring? That wont hurt anything?
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Difflock
New member
Yessir! I will be updating in a few weeks once my new mc and sc come in. Im. Ot touching it again till that in fear of making it undrivable as I daily my runner
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Difflock
New member
Another thing ive noticed is that my pedal is worn quite a bit. Where the link to the MC touched the pedal, through the hole on the pedal and that brass pin through the forks on the mc plunger is worn by a good 1/8th of an inch, probably will take the pedal off, fill it full of weld and drill a new hole
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Tyler James Inc
Senior Member
May or may not be related to your pedal feel, but I would inspect all your fitting connections for wetness before throwing parts at it. Where did you get the new MC from?
Difflock
New member
I went through some minor issues with my clutch recently.
Started off by replacing the clutch itself a couple of months ago. Probably not related, since I never opened the system up, just unbolted the slave and tucked it off to the side while the trans came out. 213K miles, the clutch itself wasn't really totally worn out, but it had always squealed a little on take off (glazed?) and it had lost a little bit of 'grab' power.
Anyhow, got that all back together and all was well for a couple of months until the pedal started acting funny. At first it would just occasionally stick an inch or so down, which was weird. I'd jsut slide my toe under and tug it back. No huge issue. The fluid looked a little dirty so I decided to bleed fresh fluid through it. The clutch worked about as good after as it did before.
The stickign got slightly worse, happening more often, and then one morning on the way to work, it stuck all the way down on the floor, and I wasn't able to get my toe under it. Lol, embarrasing. Had to open the door, hop out, reach down with my hand, pop it back. The malfunctions got worse at that point, sometimes it would stick down with the clutch released, sometimes with the clutch not released. Yeah, time to park it.
No external fluid leaks, not using up any fluid, but the fact that the pedal could be all the way down and the clutch could be not released meant that the MC was having issues. So I replaced it. $25 at RockAuto, a couple of days later, new MC. Swapping it went quickly. When I drained the old MC after reoving it, I saw all sorts of black sludge coming out of the hole in the bottom of the reservoir. Not entirely sure what was wrong with it, I didn't bother taking it apart.
When I put the new one in, I didn't adjust the pusher rod length. I probably should have. The pedal never stuck down, but the next few times I drove it it did not feel right at all. The pedal sat a bit low, it would occasionally stick an inch or two down (again!), the release point was somewhat inconsistent feeling and usually lower than it should have been. I was starting to suspect something strange going on with the slave or PP/clutch fork, but when I noticed the cruise control didn't work I know that the pedal just wasn't adjusted correctly (there's a switch that enables CC only when the pedal is all the way up).
So I spent about 5 minutes adjusting the push rod length, until the pedal came up and closed that switch all the way. Drove around afterward and... everything was 100% right feeling again.
Started off by replacing the clutch itself a couple of months ago. Probably not related, since I never opened the system up, just unbolted the slave and tucked it off to the side while the trans came out. 213K miles, the clutch itself wasn't really totally worn out, but it had always squealed a little on take off (glazed?) and it had lost a little bit of 'grab' power.
Anyhow, got that all back together and all was well for a couple of months until the pedal started acting funny. At first it would just occasionally stick an inch or so down, which was weird. I'd jsut slide my toe under and tug it back. No huge issue. The fluid looked a little dirty so I decided to bleed fresh fluid through it. The clutch worked about as good after as it did before.
The stickign got slightly worse, happening more often, and then one morning on the way to work, it stuck all the way down on the floor, and I wasn't able to get my toe under it. Lol, embarrasing. Had to open the door, hop out, reach down with my hand, pop it back. The malfunctions got worse at that point, sometimes it would stick down with the clutch released, sometimes with the clutch not released. Yeah, time to park it.
No external fluid leaks, not using up any fluid, but the fact that the pedal could be all the way down and the clutch could be not released meant that the MC was having issues. So I replaced it. $25 at RockAuto, a couple of days later, new MC. Swapping it went quickly. When I drained the old MC after reoving it, I saw all sorts of black sludge coming out of the hole in the bottom of the reservoir. Not entirely sure what was wrong with it, I didn't bother taking it apart.
When I put the new one in, I didn't adjust the pusher rod length. I probably should have. The pedal never stuck down, but the next few times I drove it it did not feel right at all. The pedal sat a bit low, it would occasionally stick an inch or two down (again!), the release point was somewhat inconsistent feeling and usually lower than it should have been. I was starting to suspect something strange going on with the slave or PP/clutch fork, but when I noticed the cruise control didn't work I know that the pedal just wasn't adjusted correctly (there's a switch that enables CC only when the pedal is all the way up).
So I spent about 5 minutes adjusting the push rod length, until the pedal came up and closed that switch all the way. Drove around afterward and... everything was 100% right feeling again.
Difflock
New member
By push rod your talking about the linkage between the pedal and the MC? Doesnt make any sense that your pedal would hit the floor all the way and to have that still be connected, that would only happen if that got disconnected
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Tyler James Inc
Senior Member
That is incorrect. Your pedal should go all the way to the floor during normal operation.
I also agree with [MENTION=166771]verbutani[/MENTION] on removing the torsion spring. As I said earlier- I removed mine because it was squeaking. My clutch/pedal works great with no spring.
Difflock
New member
Update, I was driving home and the pedal it the floor, Id pull it back up and push it. But theres no pressure, Drove home with no clutch. Checked, fluid is still all there and theres no leaks anywhere. My clutch master has finally gone I feel. I still wait for my new one to arrive but I feel pretty confident in my diagnosis
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Yes, the part that connects to the pedal and goes into the MC.
There was no issue with the length adjustment on the old MC, the MC itself was just failing. I think the seal that holds pressure at the end of the MC piston had partially failed. So pressurized fluid could leak out past the piston. But the seal at the back end of the MC was still good, so fluid wouldn't leak outside into the floor, but just back into the reservoir.
The new MC came with a new pushrod, and the length was not set, the lock nut was loose. I just snugged the nut up and installed it. And proceeded to have the clutch feel and act a bit strange. When I adjusted the length (so it closed the cruise control switch fully) it felt 100% perfect.
