Crawford Eco Block

[Quirt]

Here are some dyno graphs for you guys to ponder. I know that none of them are from one of your trucks, but the results will be the similar as they all use a MAF sensor for tuning.

These graphs are from gasoline and turbo Diesel engines as well as from different brands of vehicles. They also come from different parts of the world.

This Tuesday we are supposed to have three trucks here for us to dyno, as soon as I have the graphs they will be posted here for you to compare

 

[Monkeymenno]

Thank you

Thank you David... I gave up on forums long ago because of the rudeness from the Trolls and their better than thou attitude.

There is a wise saying that goes something like this "respect is earned, not given"

You guys are right - I have been rude, but a troll I am not. I have not called names, or insulted you personally. It does appear that Crawford Performance makes pretty nice turbocharged cars, mostly dealing in Subaru. When I read about devices that offer increased fuel economy, I have red flags go off - articles like these are why.
http://www.motorweek.org/features/goss_garage/fuel_economy_scams
http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/a310/1802932/ http://www.fraudguides.com/cars/gas-saving-devices/
http://www.aarp.org/money/scams-fraud/info-06-2011/gas-saving-gizmos-scam-alert.html

I am, and will remain, extremely skeptical of any $40 product claiming to give fuel economy without side effects. Your product may do exactly as claimed, but unfortunately the track record of all of the false claims made by other companies about fuel economy gadgets mean Crawford Performance has to work that much harder to overcome the other's dishonesty. Third party testing though a reputable magazine would be a great start.

 

[Quirt]

Thank you

And don't ask me how it works on the Toyota turbo Diesel over in Asia... I have no idea

 

[JeremyB]

Here are some dyno graphs for you guys to ponder. I know that none of them are from one of your trucks, but the results will be the similar as they all use a MAF sensor for tuning.

In the above cases, did you allow time for the fuel trims to adjust once the MAF spacer was installed? The 2014 STI dyno shows a stock lambda of 0.714, and a MAF spacer lambda of 0.804 - which is 12.6% leaner. Depending on the ECU, once you've driven for a while, you may or may not get any WOT lambda change with the spacer.

 

[Quirt]

In the above cases, did you allow time for the fuel trims to adjust once the MAF spacer was installed? The 2014 STI dyno shows a stock lambda of 0.714, and a MAF spacer lambda of 0.804 - which is 12.6% leaner. Depending on the ECU, once you've driven for a while, you may or may not get any WOT lambda change with the spacer.

Fuel trims in closed loop adjust as soon as the o2 sensor is hot, like a couple minuets. There is really no waiting time.

All the dyno runs were made at full throttle so the ECU is in the open loop fueling mode where there are no trims added.

 

[Randyman...]

All the dyno runs were made at full throttle so the ECU is in the open loop fueling mode where there are no trims added.

So Open Loop does still reference the reported (adjusted/reduced) MAF input data, and that is what ultimately allows a lean condition @ WOT (apparently proper stoic, not actualy "Lean") - but the "learned/corrected" (trimmed) conditions as reported from the O2 sensor in Closed loop conditions are ignored in WOT/Open Loop.

I'm still wrapping my head around why the VVTi and Timing are affected - but I feel I'm closing in on more ECU comprehension I'm a Drummer/Audio Dude/Broadcast Guy

 

[Quirt]

Guys, I just went to their website to look at what ever data I could find. There was a little note at the bottom of the page -

"* Please see www.crawfordperformance/ecoblockguarantee for information on returning your Eco Block if you are unsatisfied within the first year. Basic terms and conditions apply including proof of purchase."

There is no link provided and when you enter the text directly to your browser it doesn't take you anywhere - just to google search.

This REEKS of scam. There are no returns. There are no guarantees. Same deal with them not being a vendor on this site. How are you advertising products in the forums on this site without being a vendor? No patents provided upon request because there are no patents. If you follow the event links on their webpage, they are full of broken links. Their event results have not been updated in 5 years.

Not only this, but among their dealer list, every dealer in Canada has a dyno, lots of dealers in the US have dynos. How can there not be data?

The biggest question is this - why wouldn't I just make it myself? It's 5mm thick with 4 holes. Can't be that hard.

Long and the short is that any company serious about doing business would not put together such a shoddy website. And if they are real, do you really want to trust your engine with them considering they cannot keep a website halfway functional?

Sorry about that typo, the .com was missing from the our guaranty link.

Thanks for pointing that out and our IT guy has already fixed it... now if he can get the rest fixed in a timely manner.

 

[Quirt]

Thank you



You guys are right - I have been rude, but a troll I am not. I have not called names, or insulted you personally. It does appear that Crawford Performance makes pretty nice turbocharged cars, mostly dealing in Subaru. When I read about devices that offer increased fuel economy, I have red flags go off - articles like these are why.
Fuel Economy Scams | MotorWeek
Looking For A Miracle: We Test Automotive 'Fuel Savers' Gas-Saving Devices - Fraud Guides
Products Promise to Improve Gas Mileage, Fuel Efficiency - Scam Alert- AARP B...

I am, and will remain, extremely skeptical of any $40 product claiming to give fuel economy without side effects. Your product may do exactly as claimed, but unfortunately the track record of all of the false claims made by other companies about fuel economy gadgets mean Crawford Performance has to work that much harder to overcome the other's dishonesty. Third party testing though a reputable magazine would be a great start.

It's all good.... I would have done the same in your shoes.

There are so many scams out there and my product appears to be exactly the same at first glance... sadly I have actually lost a few friends in the performance industry because of this product

 

[Quirt]

So Open Loop does still reference the reported (adjusted/reduced) MAF input data, and that is what ultimately allows a lean condition @ WOT (apparently proper stoic, not actualy "Lean") - but the "learned/corrected" (trimmed) conditions as reported from the O2 sensor in Closed loop conditions are ignored in WOT/Open Loop.

I'm still wrapping my head around why the VVTi and Timing are affected - but I feel I'm closing in on more ECU comprehension I'm a Drummer/Audio Dude/Broadcast Guy

Open loop fueling pulls the math right off the open loop table which uses "load" and RPM for its two axis parameters. The Load axis is offset by our Eco Block which causes the ECU to do its math based off of a different load cell within the table. To be honest, the AFR is no where close to stoic at full throttle, it will actually be a few points richer.

The timing is affected exactly the same as the fuel, by offsetting the "load" point in the output table.

 

[Saker]

[MENTION=121742]Quirt[/MENTION]

Simple request.

Please post the patent or patent # and the white paper for this ECO-BLOCK.

I also read thru every post on TW website, very interesting read!

Thanks....

 

[Quirt]

[MENTION=121742]Quirt[/MENTION]

Simple request.

Please post the patent or patent # and the white paper for this ECO-BLOCK.

I also read thru every post on TW website, very interesting read!

Thanks....

Sorry, our patent attorney has advised against doing this so please don't expect it to happen. Is their another way that I can satisfy this curiosity of yours?

That was one long read on TW!! Committed you are

 

[Saker]

[MENTION=121742]Quirt[/MENTION]

Simple request.

Please post the patent or patent # and the white paper for this ECO-BLOCK.

I also read thru every post on TW website, very interesting read!

Thanks....

Sorry, our patent attorney has advised against doing this so please don't expect it to happen. Is their another way that I can satisfy this curiosity of yours?

That was one long read on TW!! Committed you are

[MENTION=121742]Quirt[/MENTION],

Thanks for your speedy answer.

I too as others have seen LOTS of products over the years, yes that is my real age under my avatar, so as I watch this thread unfold, I too am looking for some answers.

I asked for the above information because it was discussed that there was a patent etc.....

So excuse me if I seem confused here.
I read on your website in the description the following for the Eco-Block (Q2) quoted word for word so now I'm confused or is this something your IT guy hasn't fixed too!?!?
See the BOLD type:

The Eco Block
Increase fuel economy and power as much as +8% in minutes with the patented Eco Block from Crawford Performance.
◦Installation is simple and only requires a screwdriver
◦Satisfaction is guaranteed: if you aren’t satisfied, simply return the Eco Block to Crawford Performance for your money back.*
◦Increase fuel mileage, decrease exhaust emissions, and provide an improvement in horsepower

How is this possible?
Crawford Performance engineered the Eco Block based on 35 years of automotive racing experience. Most cars sold do not take full advantage of their potential by design, leaving up to 20% on the table. This is extra safe for the manufacturer, but it is not optimized for you, the owner.

This patented technology safely unlocks that potential. The manufacturer’s tune of the engine only utilizes 80% of its capability leaving room for improvement of both fuel economy and performance. The Eco Block has been tested on the racetrack and the street since 2011. By utilizing the basic principles of engine tuning, the Eco Block actually gives a greater benefit the more aggressively you drive.

Is it safe?
After years of testing, Crawford Performance is confident that you will be satisfied by the Eco Block. The patent pending technology is so good we offer a money back guarantee from Crawford Performance*.

Who is Crawford Performance?
Crawford Performance designs and manufactures premier aftermarket performance products in the USA and has been recognized with factory support from top International race teams. Crawford’s mission is to continue to push performance while ensuring the highest standards of quality and reliability.
Try the Eco Block, it will increase your fuel mileage, decrease your exhaust emissions and provide an improvement in horsepower.

* Please see our Eco Block Guarantee for information on returning your Eco Block if you are unsatisfied within the first year. Basic terms and conditions apply including proof of purchase.

 

[ceyese]

crawford eco block

so ,is good for our trucks or is just another snake oil

 

[Quirt]

[MENTION=121742]Quirt[/MENTION],

Thanks for your speedy answer.

I too as others have seen LOTS of products over the years, yes that is my real age under my avatar, so as I watch this thread unfold, I too am looking for some answers.

I asked for the above information because it was discussed that there was a patent etc.....

So excuse me if I seem confused here.
I read on your website in the description the following for the Eco-Block (Q2) quoted word for word so now I'm confused or is this something your IT guy hasn't fixed too!?!?
See the BOLD type:

The Eco Block
Increase fuel economy and power as much as +8% in minutes with the patented Eco Block from Crawford Performance.
◦Installation is simple and only requires a screwdriver
◦Satisfaction is guaranteed: if you aren’t satisfied, simply return the Eco Block to Crawford Performance for your money back.*
◦Increase fuel mileage, decrease exhaust emissions, and provide an improvement in horsepower

How is this possible?
Crawford Performance engineered the Eco Block based on 35 years of automotive racing experience. Most cars sold do not take full advantage of their potential by design, leaving up to 20% on the table. This is extra safe for the manufacturer, but it is not optimized for you, the owner.

This patented technology safely unlocks that potential. The manufacturer’s tune of the engine only utilizes 80% of its capability leaving room for improvement of both fuel economy and performance. The Eco Block has been tested on the racetrack and the street since 2011. By utilizing the basic principles of engine tuning, the Eco Block actually gives a greater benefit the more aggressively you drive.

Is it safe?
After years of testing, Crawford Performance is confident that you will be satisfied by the Eco Block. The patent pending technology is so good we offer a money back guarantee from Crawford Performance*.

Who is Crawford Performance?
Crawford Performance designs and manufactures premier aftermarket performance products in the USA and has been recognized with factory support from top International race teams. Crawford’s mission is to continue to push performance while ensuring the highest standards of quality and reliability.
Try the Eco Block, it will increase your fuel mileage, decrease your exhaust emissions and provide an improvement in horsepower.

* Please see our Eco Block Guarantee for information on returning your Eco Block if you are unsatisfied within the first year. Basic terms and conditions apply including proof of purchase.

You are welcome Saker, and I see from your profile that we are close in age.

I understand your concern about the validity of our claimed benefits and rightly so. That said, fire away and I will do my best to answer your questions.

And no, that is not a typo from our IT guy. It is a fact.

 

[Quirt]

so ,is good for our trucks or is just another snake oil

There are many on the forums who will call it snake oil... but the owners of our Eco Block are 100% convinced that it is a viable product.

 

[Saker]

So [MENTION=121742]Quirt[/MENTION], is it patent pending, as your website states or is it patented?

Thanks!

 

[Randyman...]

And no, that is not a typo from our IT guy. It is a fact.

So no patent granted yet (not "Patented"), but "Patent Pending"? Stating as much would likely add credence to your reluctance to post your patent request IMNSHO. Just sayin' - full disclosure goes a long way with a persnickety group like us...

 

[Quirt]

So [MENTION=121742]Quirt[/MENTION], is it patent pending, as your website states or is it patented?

Thanks!

We have a Provisional patent as well as a PCT, the Utility patent is pending.

 

[RedSled]

There are many on the forums who will call it snake oil... but the owners of our Eco Block are 100% convinced that it is a viable product.

I should be getting mine tomorrow or the next day, i will let you know what i think. Thank you for your time.

 

[Saker]

So [MENTION=121742]Quirt[/MENTION], is it patent pending, as your website states or is it patented?

Thanks!

We have a Provisional patent as well as a PCT, the Utility patent is pending.

[MENTION=121742]Quirt[/MENTION],

Thanks for the clarification!