Daddy's girl's first car is a what...? Am I crazy?

[snivilous]

I agree with [MENTION=90701]Ark[/MENTION]Master, I would buy a used older 4Runner which will be a million times more versatile than a Mustang (especially if she takes it to college) as well as being safer. I mean you have some decent points on the Mustang, but arguing for it as a safe platform is more of trying to convince yourself it's a good buy I think. If it was me I would buy her something in nice shape but that won't be a big deal if it gets trashed. Almost everyone I knew in high school destroyed their vehicle when they got their license--one guy forgot to put oil back in and ruined the engine, another slid into a tree, another hit got in a wreck, hell my mom's 4th gen got hit by my sisters friend when my sister was borrowing it. Unless she's super into cars she's probably not gonna really care what she has as long as it gets her to her friends place.

I wouldn't get her a new car until she can afford to fix the inevitable things that will happen so she won't rely on you for everything, and she gets a sense of respect for the car instead of thinking that she just got a free ride from her dad and all she has to do is pay for gas.

 

[ddnww]

when i was 16 my stepdad bought a 95 gt 5.0. He paid the car note,
i paid the insurance. If she is a good driver, i dont see a problem. I had already been driving and racing since a kid. If shes like my daughter and doesnt really have the natural talent of driving, then i would put her in something with a lot less power and easier to drive.

 

[Ask10]

you mentioned resale value, but then aren't concerned with "door dings"?

that car will be very expensive to repair, even the small dents/dings they collect over the years. resale will be out the window if its not kept in good condition.

i.e. Financial comparison. I had a Camry (06) before I got my 4th gen and when I had the body work done to bring it into "good" condition, I paid around $1,500 (mostly dings, LOTS of scratches and the rear bumper cover needing to the replaced). Had the car for 2 years and barely lost anything (paid $11,000 in 2011 and sold it for $10,200) because I bought it with all the dents and dings, then put the $1,500 into the body work. However, I have an 8th gen Civic Si as my current 2nd car (probably going to sell), and body work is going to cost $200 only since I was always careful with it (bought new). However, I paid $27,000 for it after taxes and right now, it's worth maybe $14,500-16,000.

So, I'd rather spent $13k on the Mustang and spend $1.5-3k on body work that will need out of pocket, than eat another $10k + in depreciation. Likewise, I'd rather spend $13k on a Mustang than a Focus/Civic/Mazda3 etc. and then have that car be worth less than half that in 3 years, not to mention living through those 3 years without something as "nice".

That was my reasoning, I just hate depreciation, but body work not so much. At least it's going to someone who is working and doing a job. Depreciation just simply makes money disappear.

I also do plan to set rules, should I pull the trigger on the deal. She will be responsible for damage to the car and maintenance work if she uses it a lot, and even if she does blow up the motor, it's be a really good lesson in responsibility in my eyes. Just my opinion on things though.

If you have the financial means, and she's a good student with a good sense of morals, why not treat her to something nice?

And let's not get ahead of ourselves. It's a 2008 Mustang. He's not asking if he should buy her a McLaren P12.

That's what I was thinking too, I don't really see anything wrong with getting my girl something nice, although I do understand that it's potentially asking for trouble. But as mentioned, if I spent $10-15k on a something like a "nice" economy car, I think that money would be nearly gone in 3 years, or at least a big chunk of it, so that's why I thought...hey, why not get something "worth" the money instead of throwing it away?

And true, the GT I'm looking at is an 07 with 26k miles (silver on black). It's 8 years old (manufactured in 06), so it's far from a new car. Much as I love my girl, I'd never think of getting her a new GT, or even a new V6.

I agree with [MENTION=90701]Ark[/MENTION]...arguing for it as a safe platform is more of trying to convince yourself it's a good buy I think.... Unless she's super into cars she's probably not gonna really care what she has as long as it gets her to her friends place.

I agree, I do feel a part of me is saying "This would be so cool!" if I was a teenager. I am trying to justify it honestly, I'm just trying to draw the line now between over justification and actual useful outside the box thinking.

There's an important point I forgot to mention. She's kind of a tinkerer with things and likes mechanical things, so while she's not a totally car freak per se, she does like doing things like oil changes and spark plugs etc when I let her, so I thought to myself, a car that she likes the look of would be kind of cool to work on. I know I loved working on my Supra when I was a teenager, so I kind of wanted to pass that on, hoping the gearhead flame stays alight so to speak. My wife and son couldn't be less interested in cars so...


Anyway, we'll see what happens, she still thinks she's inheriting the Corolla next week so there's time.

Thanks all for the feedback so far, helps me out, really.

 

[ben550]

Buy her a subaru....

If i had a daughter i'd buy her a safe car too. My son on the other hand, he will be buying his own car. I plan to "match" his savings similar to an employer matching 401k contributions... If he works and saves up 3 grand to buy a car I will match that and add 3 grand so he can buy a 6 grand car. Insurance on me till he leaves the house/18yrs old (so long as his driving record stays clean), tickets on him, gas on him, tires on him, repairs we will DIY together in the garage.

I dunno seems reasonable to me.

 

[AZrunner11]

I think you can trust your girl in the Mustang, however, her 16-17 year old boyfriend not so much

 

[philsey]

Buying a 15YO a car? You've got to be shitting me! Bad idea.

Buying a 15YO a 300 hp MT Mustang? Now that's just plain stupid.
Dude, you're just justifying what you want.

Do you REALLY not remember being 15? Really? Wow.

EDIT:

/cite: http://safety.trw.com/texting-while-driving-now-leading-cause-of-us-teen-deaths/0710/

"Texting while driving is now the leading cause of death among teenagers – surpassing (not including) drinking and driving, according to a study by Cohen Children’s Medical Center. Disturbing statistics from the report include:
■More than 3,000 teens die each year in crashes caused by texting while driving
■Approximately 2,700 teens are killed in drunk driving accidents"

 

[Antman]

My first car was a 1969 Mustang Fastback (built 302) my Dad and I restored.

I was a pretty responsible kid- almost straight A's, worked 3 jobs, no drinking/drugs all that stuff.

I did things in that car that should've killed me. Many, many times.

No way in hell I would EVER let my girls have a manual 5.0 as a first car. The power will always be there, the skills to manage the power will not.

My 2 cents.

 

[Net4n6]

If you have the financial means, and she's a good student with a good sense of morals, why not treat her to something nice?

It's your choice, Ask10. No one here knows your daughter or your financial situation. Being her father, I imagine you're capable of making the best choice.

And let's not get ahead of ourselves. It's a 2008 Mustang. He's not asking if he should buy her a McLaren P12.

Agree with A.Wilson013 ^^^^
I was surprised that there was another thread like mine. Being a father, you always want the best thing for your kids. Others wanted to teach the kids a lesson of value but there are other ways. You can sit down and talk. No one know your kids as you do. Why do we work hard? We work hard for our family to have better "things"/life. If I can afford to get my kids $50-$60 car, I would. I know my kids. I never get my kids a "powerful" car if I know he/she going to be drag racing in the street. My 2 cents are done.

 

[1engineer]

Alright, let the flaming begin.

So...suppose that you hear a dad is thinking about buying their 15 year old daughter (16 very soon), a Mustang. Worse off, a 2007 GT (300 hp, manual). I know I know I know :wtf: Seriously though, I've been giving this a lot of thought, over and over and over...believe me, it's tougher than I thought. Here's the reasoning though.

**Firstly, I'm planning on buying for "myself" as a "toy", and then letting her use it as her high school car. Then if she takes good care of it and is a good driver, I'll give it to her when she heads for college.

Anyway, the reasons I'm thinking it's a wise decision on my part...

One, I am forcing (yes forcing) her to learn stick shift. The Si probably needs a new clutch now since training has commenced, but it's okay. I strongly believe that manual drivers pay much more attention to the road and are much better drivers. So, if she has a manual transmission car, she'll be more alert.

Two, the Mustang has a huge ass nose and tail, which means a whole lot of crumple zone between her and whatever idiot plows into her (or who she hits...). Laws of physics, more stuff to shield you = better. Also, the GT is nearly 4,000 lbs, and heavier is better.

Three, while I pay for insurance (it's not too bad actually with a good student discount and me as the primary), she pays for gas whenever she wants to use it for going out. Hopefully it'll help her realize the value of money and what it takes to run a vehicle with it's 16-18 mpg fuel economy.

Four, the GT stangs' really seem to hold their value well. Even my Si (bone stock, 30k miles, adult driven, meticulously kept), is worth HALF what I paid 3 years ago for it. $13,000 down the drain...and that's a "valuable" car With $13,000 I can get a very nice 06-08 car and in 3 years it'll still probably be worth at least $10k.


But...

Now that does beg the question, can I trust a 16 year old girl with a 300 horsepower muscle car? Well, that's kind of what I am wanting to ask you "gear heads" about. So far everyone tells me I am the dumbest guy in the world for even thinking about it (except my wife, she agrees with my reasons, but she wants to give her my 4th gen T4R instead...(Nooooo!!!!).

In all fairness, my girl loves Mustangs and has done so for a long time. I'm thinking in my head, if I get one and let her drive it, she'll take care of it and be a better driver in the long run because she'll be careful not to crash "daddy's" car. She's also a good student, really observant about things around her, and a pretty bright girl if you ask me (although I'm heavily biased). I think she deserves a treat, and at the same time it's a great way to teach her how to be sensible about cars and money. Sensible with a Mustang...I know... But you know, when you like something and care about something (like how she likes Mustangs), then you tend to be "better" at it and take more interest in what you're doing, in this case, driving. If she likes driving, she'll be better at it, and if she's happy AND a better driver, then I can relax more easily at night.


Anyway, sorry, I've been pouring over this over and over to the point where my brain is quiet fried. Everyone thinks I'm crazy (probably true), but I figured I'd ask a group who does know a thing or two about vehicles. Maybe I might get more useful feedback than from the office ladies, lol.


Thanks in advance for any opinions.

-Ask10

You have seriously flawed logic and no understanding of physics. Your statement "Laws of physics, more stuff to shield you = better. Also, the GT is nearly 4,000 lbs, and heavier is better" is not a law, a rule, a thought or anything else in our world. Example: I give you a roll of toilet paper to wrap yourself in for your "shield." You jump off a 30 ft building. Let me know how that works out lol. The most important real law you should be concerned with is F=MA and all the derivations of that formula. Not going to say anything else as it's your choice to raise them like you want but I just got through raising a daughter. She's 21 now and is working as a RN after finishing her BSN so I know a bit about daughters. Buy her what you want but don't use some imaginary logic and rule to justify it. A Mustang is a good choice in responsible hands and you will have to live with the consequences of any decision you make. FWIW my daughter started buffing and waxing cars in my driveway in the summers when she was 14. She had $6K saved when she was 16 to help buy her first car. She was also Homecoming Queen so she was not the typical tomboy girl either. The best gift you could give her is learning the value of hard work.

 

[Hepar]

In my high school experience, we had kids who's parents bought them all sorts of varying valued vehicles to parents who made their kids pay for their own. Let me just say that there wasn't ONE kid I can think of who's parents bought them their first car who treated it well. My best friend in high school probably came from one of the wealthier families at our school and he had to pay for his first car. We worked our butts off to earn the money for them. We both treated them like gold even though they weren't far from big turds.

I'd say IF you're going to buy her something. Make her earn it somehow. Maybe match the money she can bring to the table. Or tell her you'll pay for the insurance until the first ticket. Then after that, she'll have to pay it to be able to drive it.

 

[Ask10]

**Revised Plan**​

Alright, I've been reading and contemplating all the comments made (honestly) as well as other friend's advice, and here's the newly revised, and hopefully much more sensible plan.

Long story short: after two days of shopping around
-No Mustang (of any type) While I still truly believe that my girl is smart enough to appreciate the car as well as be careful (in my best non-biased opinion), I'm also VERY young myself to have a teenage girl, so I'm willing to listen to others' with more years on me.

**For the record though, at 16 I had a Supra, and I never got a ticket or abused it (not even a burnout, hand on heart). So for you doubting parents, there are responsible teens out there,

-No hand me down 3rd gen. (Failed safety for frame corrosion) :'(

-No hand me down Corolla (wife is keeping it because dealer tried to screw us over on the car she wanted :frusty

Out of frustration and over a morning coffee, here's my idea that I've come up with as a compromise.

Before you say "make her buy her own"...: Please note that I already promised her I'd provide a vehicle (not buy for her to have) with paid insurance, maintenance, and a gas allowance, if she kept her name on the honor roll from Jr. High to now (turning 16 next week). However, she's made 4.0 every semester (except one) since she was 12, so I really would like to treat her to something.

Also to add, she is a mechanical tinkerer and knows cars somewhat already. For example, she knows how VTEC works and what a torque converter is. That's a big reason I've been "pushing" to get her a car that has "value" to mechanical kind of person. As much as I respect the GM 3800 motor, I'd rather work on an LS1, if you know what I mean and that's the original basis for why the GT originally came into consideration (over a V6). Btw, I know the 3800 and LS1 are not Ford motors, it's a metaphor.

Here's the compromise...

I'm giving her my work truck (1st gen Pre-Runner Tacoma) and I'll move my toolbox into my slightly more air conditioned 4th gen. I pay insurance, maintenance and a fuel allowance, and the rest she pays.

BUT... the compromise is this, what I plan to bring up with my girl this evening.

I'm going to sell my Civic Si, and with the money I get from that I'm setting aside for a daddy/daughter project car that SHE gets to pick. Anything she wants to build, restore, modify, she can choose. We'll map out her project and discuss her ideas together, and while I'm the funds behind it originally, she'll be the director of the project so to speak. Plans for the build, goals, etc, all done by her.

To add to the incentive to do well in school, every semester (from now until graduation) she earns an A, I'll add money to her project car fund, and every straight A semester she'll get an extra bonus. When she graduates high school, she gets the title of the car.


Through this, I think everyone wins. Dad gets to treat his daughter to something she'll hopefully love (reward for good grades), she gets a safe, SLOW, and ordinary daily driver to learn in (work truck), and we'll have a blast together (I hope) in the next few years to come before she grows up, leaves the house, gets married...:wow: anyway.

Hopefully this seems more sensible. Thanks for the feedback so far, I really have been reading it.

 

[02SE]

As far as I'm concerned, you don't need to justify anything to anyone outside of your Family. You know your Daughter better than any of us.

My personal goal would be the safest vehicle I can find, for a teenage Daughter.

 

[A.Wilson013]

Obviously you need to build the pre-runner...

 

[Ask10]

As far as I'm concerned, you don't need to justify anything to anyone outside of your Family. You know your Daughter better than any of us.

I think you're right. However, had I stuck with my original idea without listening, I wouldn't have thought of the project car idea to be honest which I like a lot more than a Mustang, so I believe there's merit in listening as well.

For safety, I agonized over it for a long time, and I ultimately figured the best way would be to not provide her the means of speed temptation, and to spend more time teaching her how to drive. Crash tests are irrelevant when you don't hit anything. The Pre-runner is a 4 star crash test truck though, so that's alright by me.

 

[02SE]

Crash tests are irrelevant when you don't hit anything.

That's very true.

The problem then becomes all of the brain-dead, cellphone-talking, texting, makeup-applying, etc. drivers out there, that can run into you. I've been in a couple accidents, both times were distracted drivers plowing into me.

I can't even guess at the number of times I've avoided being hit by or hitting zoned-out morons, because I was paying attention, and they weren't. This becomes second nature if you're a Motorcyclist with a sense of self preservation.

Anyway, I wish you and your Daughter the best as she takes to the roads.

 

[broncosi]

If there is power there it will be used. By her boyfriend or her period.

Does no one else see the pun here? Destroyed by her period? I'll show myself out.

 

[VolcanoT4R]

[MENTION=108285]Ask10[/MENTION]...sounds like you are searching for a vehicle with
1) Manual transmission
2) Safety
3) Reliability
4) "Buildability"

Sounds like you just described a 1st, 2nd, or 3rd gen 4Runner to me. You could even create a build thread to let us all follow her progress, and she would get PLENTY of excellent advice from members on the forum. And, bonus, you get a "play toy" as well.

Just my $.02. Keep us posted.

 

[BigNuge]

**Revised Plan**​

Alright, I've been reading and contemplating all the comments made (honestly) as well as other friend's advice, and here's the newly revised, and hopefully much more sensible plan.

Long story short: after two days of shopping around
-No Mustang (of any type) While I still truly believe that my girl is smart enough to appreciate the car as well as be careful (in my best non-biased opinion), I'm also VERY young myself to have a teenage girl, so I'm willing to listen to others' with more years on me.

**For the record though, at 16 I had a Supra, and I never got a ticket or abused it (not even a burnout, hand on heart). So for you doubting parents, there are responsible teens out there,

-No hand me down 3rd gen. (Failed safety for frame corrosion) :'(

-No hand me down Corolla (wife is keeping it because dealer tried to screw us over on the car she wanted :frusty

Out of frustration and over a morning coffee, here's my idea that I've come up with as a compromise.

Before you say "make her buy her own"...: Please note that I already promised her I'd provide a vehicle (not buy for her to have) with paid insurance, maintenance, and a gas allowance, if she kept her name on the honor roll from Jr. High to now (turning 16 next week). However, she's made 4.0 every semester (except one) since she was 12, so I really would like to treat her to something.

Also to add, she is a mechanical tinkerer and knows cars somewhat already. For example, she knows how VTEC works and what a torque converter is. That's a big reason I've been "pushing" to get her a car that has "value" to mechanical kind of person. As much as I respect the GM 3800 motor, I'd rather work on an LS1, if you know what I mean and that's the original basis for why the GT originally came into consideration (over a V6). Btw, I know the 3800 and LS1 are not Ford motors, it's a metaphor.

Here's the compromise...

I'm giving her my work truck (1st gen Pre-Runner Tacoma) and I'll move my toolbox into my slightly more air conditioned 4th gen. I pay insurance, maintenance and a fuel allowance, and the rest she pays.

BUT... the compromise is this, what I plan to bring up with my girl this evening.

I'm going to sell my Civic Si, and with the money I get from that I'm setting aside for a daddy/daughter project car that SHE gets to pick. Anything she wants to build, restore, modify, she can choose. We'll map out her project and discuss her ideas together, and while I'm the funds behind it originally, she'll be the director of the project so to speak. Plans for the build, goals, etc, all done by her.

To add to the incentive to do well in school, every semester (from now until graduation) she earns an A, I'll add money to her project car fund, and every straight A semester she'll get an extra bonus. When she graduates high school, she gets the title of the car.


Through this, I think everyone wins. Dad gets to treat his daughter to something she'll hopefully love (reward for good grades), she gets a safe, SLOW, and ordinary daily driver to learn in (work truck), and we'll have a blast together (I hope) in the next few years to come before she grows up, leaves the house, gets married...:wow: anyway.

Hopefully this seems more sensible. Thanks for the feedback so far, I really have been reading it.

That's a solid plan!!

Great incentive idea man!!

 

[Ask10]

[MENTION=108285]Ask10[/MENTION]...sounds like you are searching for a vehicle with .....

It's out of my hands now, she's thrilled to pieces with the project car idea. She's been online all day looking for cars and is diligently searching for VW Golf TDI. Apparently she's always wanted one, so it seems like she'll not be getting a 4Runner as a project. Sorry everyone, no build threads coming soon, not here anyway.

 

[541joseph]

Ahhhhhh stay away from vw(Audi,Volvo,BMW,)!!! There will be no money left!!!! They suck to work on and are expensive!!!