Dash looks like Christmas Tree...tech says oil control valve

[PalmettoMud]

I wanted to know if anyone had any experience with this or if any one has ever heard of this before (specs are in my signature). I was driving & got a little "bogged down" feeling with the motor, almost like the motor was struggling up a hill. My RPMs were roughly 2-3k. About a mile down the road, the check engine, VSC Off, traction control, & VSC OFF lights all came on.

When I took it to the stealership today, the tech said that the code (P0022) was for "Camshaft position A- Timing Over Retarded (Bank 2). The tech said the fix to this problem MIGHT BE to replace the oil control valve for that cylinder. He said he wasn't sure but that this MIGHT fix the problem.

Also, & no correlation with the dash lights, but my AC has for two weeks now, has not held any pressure. Last week I had it refilled & today at the dealership (5 days later) it has lost a full pound of pressure. The tech is guessing that we need to replace the evaporator core. Shocking that this is the most expensive thing to replace in the AC system. He also said, wow, this never happens in Toyotas. Does everyone agree that this is the part that actually needs to be replaced? They refilled it today with dye to see if they could find the actual leak. So I guess we'll see.

Thoughts?

 

[PalmettoMud]

Also, the cost for the oil control valve = $350 & the cost for the Evaporator Core is $1200. Taking the truck back tomorrow for the OCV repair, does anyone have a solution to the $1200 cost. I can get the part for $100 from Denso. Is finding a shade tree mechanic a good idea for this?

Thanks!

 

[preacher35]

Also, & no correlation with the dash lights, but my AC has for two weeks now, has not held any pressure. Last week I had it refilled & today at the dealership (5 days later) it has lost a full pound of pressure. The tech is guessing that we need to replace the evaporator core. Shocking that this is the most expensive thing to replace in the AC system. He also said, wow, this never happens in Toyotas. Does everyone agree that this is the part that actually needs to be replaced? They refilled it today with dye to see if they could find the actual leak. So I guess we'll see.

Thoughts?

First off, I would NOT take anyone's "GUESS" when it comes to a $1,200.00 A/C repair. Did your guy run dye through the system to check for leaks in the engine compartment? Assuming that you all have ruled out a leak ancillary to the evaporator core, then YES, you might have a leak in the evaporator, behind the dash. This happened to me a couple of months ago..... and you could smell a slight "musty" smell in the cabin. I paid my guy about $900.00 to do the entire replacement. It sucks that you have to strip out the entire dash, down to the bare firewall to get to the evaporator core, but it was either that, or ride with the windows down in 97 degree Texas heat. So, YES, it can go bad. Good luck!

 

[PalmettoMud]

Preacher35, I have been getting a musty smell, not sure if it's the normal 100k mile Toyota smell or a crapped out Evap Core.

Tomorrow they are going to look for the leak with the dye. Hopefully it isn't the evap core, but chances are ...it is. With that being said, finding someone to put it in "on the side" to save money, might be tough. Can't waste too much time here in Charleston, SC...gets pretty warm.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

I would presume the reason the technician is guessing its probably the Oil Control Valve is because it could just as well be the VVTi Cam Phaser (we've had occasional issues with them in various VVTi equipped engines), though the Oil Control Valve controls oil flow to the cam phaser and could cause similar issues to a failed cam phaser.

As for the A/C issue, if they ran dye through the system (which more than likely they did if they charged it up as all our machines at work have dye in them already out of habit) and it is leaking that bad, you should be able to take a black light and see for your self where its leaking.

 

[PalmettoMud]

$350 later, the oil control valve problem is "fixed." Knock on wood! The dash lights haven't come back on in ~30-40 miles. So, we'll see.

As for the AC problem...the tech said the dye is 100% coming from the evap core. To fix the problem, the stealership wants $1257.53 to install a new evap core & expansion valve. $770 of that is labor. They will however allow me to bring in the parts my which I can get for $143 shipped from RockAuto (Denso parts with 1 year warranty. The same warranty dealership would give on the part).

Essentially, I'm looking at $770/labor + $143/parts= $913 total using RockAuto & the dealership to install (I'm saving ~$350 I guess). I unfortunately can't find a smaller shop in my area (trying to save money), that will install parts they did not furnish.

I've used RockAuto in the past for smaller things (ie. bulbs, wipers, filters etc) but never anything like an evap core & expansion valve. Thoughts anyone? :noidea:

 

[PalmettoMud]

Well, $150ish later. I have a new expansion valve & evaporator core from RockAuto. Toyota quoted me $770 to put the parts in tomorrow. Hopefully this fixes the problem.

 

[PalmettoMud]

Evaporator core

 

[RPS13]

Have you checked any independent garages around that area? Pulling the dash isn't exactly rocket science, nor is pulling a vacuum and charging the R-134a. It just takes time, so paying an independent garage's lower labor rates might save you a ton.

Making the evap a dash removing item is something that happened in the late 90's, and IMO is a sign of lazy ass engineering. Early 90's cars by and large you could remove the evap core in about 5-10 mins.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

Have you checked any independent garages around that area? Pulling the dash isn't exactly rocket science, nor is pulling a vacuum and charging the R-134a. It just takes time, so paying an independent garage's lower labor rates might save you a ton.

Making the evap a dash removing item is something that happened in the late 90's, and IMO is a sign of lazy ass engineering. Early 90's cars by and large you could remove the evap core in about 5-10 mins.

I don't know if its lazy engineering. Between the proliferation of SRS, complicated dual climate systems, and the integration of everything into these giant HVAC assemblies I can see how it'd be difficult to make the EVAP or Heater core removable without the dash. Most of those HVAC assemblies just cannot be taken apart properly without the unit out of the vehicle and they take up so much space under the dash.

The independent shop is a good idea for labor reduction.

 

[RPS13]

You'd be surprised at how accessible you can make stuff if it's a requirement. The simple fact is that post-sale component replacement is not even on the design requirement list when it comes to many components outside of the usual wear items.

I did lots of engineering on fighter jets, and you'd be surprised at how quickly you can design stuff to be removed when you've got a requirement to be able to turn the jet around in 8 hrs 99.99% of the time. It's all a lot more complex than a HVAC distribution box on a car.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

You'd be surprised at how accessible you can make stuff if it's a requirement. The simple fact is that post-sale component replacement is not even on the design requirement list when it comes to many components outside of the usual wear items.

I did lots of engineering on fighter jets, and you'd be surprised at how quickly you can design stuff to be removed when you've got a requirement to be able to turn the jet around in 8 hrs 99.99% of the time. It's all a lot more complex than a HVAC distribution box on a car.

I can definitely believe that, but is it fair to compare a 30k vehicle with an intended 100k-ish "life expectancy" and a few million dollar fighter jet with the government footing the repair bill?

 

[RPS13]

The engineering is all the same. I just think vehicle designers have bought in a little too much on the "throw away" mentality instead of designing for serviceability. Not every component needs to be easy to remove, but comparing 80's and 90's vehicles to those of today, you can see that serviceability has taken a backseat to so many other factors.

And modern fighter jets are like $100 mil+ these days! They also probably have more parts in a few square feet than an entire modern vehicle has, so the serviceability requirements can be a real PITA.