Did 1Engineer mention to you guys that the 2016 4Runner broke 100k in Sales?

[Wasatch]

All 4Runner gens representing here in Utah and quite a few PROS around. Probably 10 4Runners in my company parking lot including a bone stock MGM Trail that I like to park next to, to show them the possibilities haha. Also a brand new Cement Tundra Pro that the site boss drives.

 

[Donovan1]

I've definitely noticed a bunch if new 4runners lately. If nothing else, bodes well for the 4runner continuing for the foreseeable future.

FJ is gone as is the Xterra. Pathfinder has turned into a minivan and Landcruiser is way out of the price range. Hence 4Runner.

 

[Donovan1]

<---- #Oneupper

#temptagwheeling

Nice.. But 265s? I must be in the 1% who bought my 275s and cut the front bumper in under a week...

 

[Wasatch]

FJ is gone as is the Xterra. Pathfinder has turned into a minivan and Landcruiser is way out of the price range. Hence 4Runner.

AWD Pilots seem to be the next gen soccer mom SUVs as well as the MDX.

 

[Yukon4Runner]

That pond in the Serengeti is certainly drying up...only the strong will survive!

FJ is gone as is the Xterra. Pathfinder has turned into a minivan and Landcruiser is way out of the price range. Hence 4Runner.

 

[Donovan1]

Yup ... around here it's black LE ... female driver. Seriously, I seldom see a man driving a 5th ... some days I have to check my junk.

3rd and 4th Gens, conversely, are always men.

I see the mamas in Tundras a lot. 4Runners are slightly less popular here. I do have I think four 5th gens in my hood and a GX. My wife drives out TEP mainly at my coaxing but she does say the stock rigs look sad. That's my girl! I drive my FJ which she claims to hate but she sure is aggressive when she's behind the wheel of the beast...

 

[Donovan1]

That pond in the Serengeti is certainly drying up...only the strong will survive!

It's sad. It's great that the 4Runner is really one of the last of the true SUVs (Jeep Unlimited is close but I feel more directed at pure 4Wheelers) but of course when you're standing alone in a segment with no competition, there is a tendency towards complacency in regards to improvement and innovation.

 

[1engineer]

so basically, if looking at a 6-year trend, the 4th gen did much better than the 5th gen is doing

do you have 3rd gen figs?

You're bang on...you'd have to normalize the data with economic indicators like GDP change, unemployment or something like that.

Just look how the 4Runner 2009 numbers tanked when the subprime housing market cratered the economy.

You would think, but back then there was not nearly as much competition. Not direct competition but SUV competition in general. Even within Toyota itself the Highlander sold around 120K units in '04, compared to the 4Runner sales of 114K. Now in 2016 the 4Runner looks like the run rate will take it to around 110K units, whereas the Highlander is going to come in around 180K. Looking at the Rav4 is even more staggering - 70K units in '04 and estimated sales in '16 of 340K!

So yeah, economics I'm sure play a part but remember, the buying "pool" of people wanting SUV's is finite. When you add more or better choices (using "better" as a better fit to lifestyle - CUV's - , not better as far as quality) then all vehicle sales in that segment will suffer.

 

[zefram47]

<---- #Oneupper
Nice.. But 265s? I must be in the 1% who bought my 275s and cut the front bumper in under a week...

I wanted to do 275s, but the Falkens didn't come in that size. Also, in the LT spec, the 265s are rubbing on brake dive and with the wheel at full-lock. I need to get a heat gun and take care of the front mud flaps.

 

[blakjack23]

It would be interesting to see sales figures by state.

 

[amalik]

[MENTION=66316]1engineer[/MENTION] did you just say 340k for the Rav4!? wow. That's YTD 2016?

According to this link, the Camry was the best selling 2015 vehicle at 361k:

http://www.caranddriver.com/flipboo...e-the-bestselling-cars-in-america-for-2015#11

 

[Yukon4Runner]

When you start looking around you see those babys everywhere...I got up to take a leak in the middle of the night and there was one squatting on my toilet taking a dump!

[MENTION=66316]1engineer[/MENTION] did you just say 340k for the Rav4!? wow.

 

[amalik]

When you start looking around you see those babys everywhere...I got up to take a leak in the middle of the night and there was one squatting on my toilet taking a dump!

I didn't understand your comment. At all.

 

[ToyoDriver]

You would think, but back then there was not nearly as much competition. Not direct competition but SUV competition in general. Even within Toyota itself the Highlander sold around 120K units in '04, compared to the 4Runner sales of 114K. Now in 2016 the 4Runner looks like the run rate will take it to around 110K units, whereas the Highlander is going to come in around 180K. Looking at the Rav4 is even more staggering - 70K units in '04 and estimated sales in '16 of 340K!

So yeah, economics I'm sure play a part but remember, the buying "pool" of people wanting SUV's is finite. When you add more or better choices (using "better" as a better fit to lifestyle - CUV's - , not better as far as quality) then all vehicle sales in that segment will suffer.

I don't think the economy had nearly as much to do with it as gas prices. I think the chart supports that with a huge uptick in sales in the last 2~ years...right when oil tanked.

I sure as shit know I wouldn't have bought my '16 if I was paying $4.20 a gallon...

 

[Fidgets]

You would think, but back then there was not nearly as much competition. Not direct competition but SUV competition in general. Even within Toyota itself the Highlander sold around 120K units in '04, compared to the 4Runner sales of 114K. Now in 2016 the 4Runner looks like the run rate will take it to around 110K units, whereas the Highlander is going to come in around 180K. Looking at the Rav4 is even more staggering - 70K units in '04 and estimated sales in '16 of 340K!

So yeah, economics I'm sure play a part but remember, the buying "pool" of people wanting SUV's is finite. When you add more or better choices (using "better" as a better fit to lifestyle - CUV's - , not better as far as quality) then all vehicle sales in that segment will suffer.

I suspect styling/design as well as gas prices have an impact on vehicle sales, or rather the mix of vehicles sold.

 

[1engineer]

[MENTION=66316]1engineer[/MENTION] did you just say 340k for the Rav4!? wow. That's YTD 2016?

According to this link, the Camry was the best selling 2015 vehicle at 361k:

Car and Driver

Toyota RAV4 Sales Figures - GOOD CAR BAD CAR

I don't think the economy had nearly as much to do with it as gas prices. I think the chart supports that with a huge uptick in sales in the last 2~ years...right when oil tanked.

I sure as shit know I wouldn't have bought my '16 if I was paying $4.20 a gallon...

I suspect styling/design as well as gas prices have an impact on vehicle sales, or rather the mix of vehicles sold.

Gas prices ARE a part of the economic equation, and gas prices do make a difference, it's just a part of the equation. In reality [MENTION=144979]ToyoDriver[/MENTION], gas prices don't really come into play much for someone driving a new 4Runner. However, mentally gas prices matter. Quick exercise:

Drive 15K/yr
Gas prices: Either $2.50/gal or $4.50/gal

If you pay $2.50/gal your gas expense will be $36.06/week
If you pay $4.50/gal your gas expense will be $64.90/week

So the real difference for someone who drives $15K/yr will be $28.84 a week. Will that break you? Of course not and it won't really matter to anyone unless unfortunately they are near poverty or living on an extremely fixed income. The big deal about gas prices is the perceived expense, not the real expense. People think that "Gosh! Gas is so expensive I can't afford that!" They can of course, they just choose not to pay that.

I have a friend (nice guy, not real smart) who decided to trade his "gas guzzler" Pilot for a CRV the last time gas prices went up. He assured me he would make it back on gas savings. So he traded and got a higher payment ($100/month) but got a four year newer and nicer vehicle. He went from 20 mpg to 28 mpg. He bragged to me how much he was saving. I showed him the math. Turns out he was spending $300 more a year to drive a more efficient vehicle lol.

 

[Yukon4Runner]

You hit the nail right square on the head with that one...it's gas expense perception, not reality.

Last time the gas prices had spiked, I saw this sales dude on TV convincing people to spend $50k on a car to save money. I just shook my head.

If most people didn't have an epileptic seizure when confronted with basic math, the new car sales landscape would look way different.

Hey, you wanna new car because you wanna new car, go with God I say. You don't need to justify it with phony reasoning...it's your money, have fun.

The big deal about gas prices is the perceived expense, not the real expense. People think that "Gosh! Gas is so expensive I can't afford that!".

 

[ToyoDriver]

Toyota RAV4 Sales Figures - GOOD CAR BAD CAR

Gas prices ARE a part of the economic equation, and gas prices do make a difference, it's just a part of the equation. In reality [MENTION=144979]ToyoDriver[/MENTION], gas prices don't really come into play much for someone driving a new 4Runner. However, mentally gas prices matter. Quick exercise:

Drive 15K/yr
Gas prices: Either $2.50/gal or $4.50/gal

If you pay $2.50/gal your gas expense will be $36.06/week
If you pay $4.50/gal your gas expense will be $64.90/week

So the real difference for someone who drives $15K/yr will be $28.84 a week. Will that break you? Of course not and it won't really matter to anyone unless unfortunately they are near poverty or living on an extremely fixed income. The big deal about gas prices is the perceived expense, not the real expense. People think that "Gosh! Gas is so expensive I can't afford that!" They can of course, they just choose not to pay that.

I have a friend (nice guy, not real smart) who decided to trade his "gas guzzler" Pilot for a CRV the last time gas prices went up. He assured me he would make it back on gas savings. So he traded and got a higher payment ($100/month) but got a four year newer and nicer vehicle. He went from 20 mpg to 28 mpg. He bragged to me how much he was saving. I showed him the math. Turns out he was spending $300 more a year to drive a more efficient vehicle lol.

Let's just clarify that I was giving a reason why sales decreased. I was not justifying that reason as a smart one.

If you think the majority of vehicle buyers (you know, the same guys who buy a $35k vehicle without even knowing it has nav) are doing math calculations RE: Fuel Economy @ variable prices....well, I don't need to say anything else because I know you know they aren't

As you said, it is a perceived issue but a big enough one to halt sales. And I would argue that the economy has not improved significantly from 2013, however gas prices sure as hell took a steep dive and SUVs are flying off the shelf.

I also don't think weekly in terms of anything - but monthly. Gas going from $4.50 to $2.50 using your math is over $130 month increase. That's like getting my car insurance for free.

 

[gm350reratliff]

All 4Runner gens representing here in Utah and quite a few PROS around. Probably 10 4Runners in my company parking lot including a bone stock MGM Trail that I like to park next to, to show them the possibilities haha. Also a brand new Cement Tundra Pro that the site boss drives.

Ugh, I'm still waiting for my cement tundra to come in. It's only been 2.5 months since I jumped on the waiting list.

AWD Pilots seem to be the next gen soccer mom SUVs as well as the MDX.

I agree, those are truly all over. My mom has a pilot. While it's been a good car for her, it completely feels like a minivan behind the wheel. She sure likes it though and that's all that matters.

 

[1engineer]

Let's just clarify that I was giving a reason why sales decreased. I was not justifying that reason as a smart one.

If you think the majority of vehicle buyers (you know, the same guys who buy a $35k vehicle without even knowing it has nav) are doing math calculations RE: Fuel Economy @ variable prices....well, I don't need to say anything else because I know you know they aren't

As you said, it is a perceived issue but a big enough one to halt sales. And I would argue that the economy has not improved significantly from 2013, however gas prices sure as hell took a steep dive and SUVs are flying off the shelf.

I also don't think weekly in terms of anything - but monthly. Gas going from $4.50 to $2.50 using your math is over $130 month increase. That's like getting my car insurance for free.

Daily, weekly, monthly is all the same. You have X income and no matter how you divide it you have the same result.

What's funny is guys who will b i t c h and moan about gas prices buy a 4runner and then, and then go put 500 lbs of weight hanging off it and put on big tires lol.

I calculated it once for a member and showed how much those big tires cost in gas for him in a year, above what he paid for them. He had no clue the price of looking good is way more than the initial cost.