Emergency brake

[BlackWorksInc]

On later model 4th gen yes, but I know my 03 doesn't. Not sure what year that started.



I don't care what you call it but the OP isn't wrong for calling it an emergency brake. There is a reason its a strictly mechanical system controlled independently from the main brakes. Plus why would you need a brake solely for parking, thats what "Park" in your transmission is for. But say your transmission was to fail (ie an emergency you still have the "whatever you wanna call it" brake holding the vehicle. As I said, I don't care what you call it but its as much an emergency brake as it is a parking brake.

Its because the system hasn't become as robust as modern cars have. Back in the day they might have been good for stopping the vehicle, but now a days they are only good for holding the car in place to relieve pressure on the parking pawl inside of the transmission.

Parking Brakes are just not strong enough to effectively stop a vehicle going at high speed. They'll more than likely burn out before they do anything effectively.

If you've ever had the opportunity to do this in a safe enviroment, get to about65mph, then slam on your parking brake and nothing else. The Automotive industry has stopped using "emergency brake" because too many people thought it really would stop the car effectively.

These days you can easily end up driving with your p-brake completely engaged if you were distracted enough not to notice the light and smell.

Not trying to put you down or anything, just letting you know why the terminology has changed over the years and why they really are not a system intended to "Stop" the vehicle more than just hold the vehicle against its own weight to provide relieve on the parking pawl.

 

[rebelbowtie]

Its because the system hasn't become as robust as modern cars have. Back in the day they might have been good for stopping the vehicle, but now a days they are only good for holding the car in place to relieve pressure on the parking pawl inside of the transmission.

Parking Brakes are just not strong enough to effectively stop a vehicle going at high speed. They'll more than likely burn out before they do anything effectively.

If you've ever had the opportunity to do this in a safe enviroment, get to about65mph, then slam on your parking brake and nothing else. The Automotive industry has stopped using "emergency brake" because too many people thought it really would stop the car effectively.

These days you can easily end up driving with your p-brake completely engaged if you were distracted enough not to notice the light and smell.

Not trying to put you down or anything, just letting you know why the terminology has changed over the years and why they really are not a system intended to "Stop" the vehicle more than just hold the vehicle against its own weight to provide relieve on the parking pawl.

Just because our 4Runners and other trucks are overweight pigs and the brakes are barely suffice enough as it is. On other more sporty cars I've had like A4, Charger, Mustang these "parking" brakes are more than suffice to stop the vehicle as well as allow me to do some cool J turns and 360°s in deserted parking lots.

 

[eds72]

How about this?

Not sure what year your vehicle is, but this is for an '04 and worked on my '06 as well:

2004 4Runner: DRL Disable With On/Off Capability - YotaTech Forums

As for the question of why someone would want the DRL off, I did it to effectively separate the DRL and turn signal/flasher circuits so I could run whatever type of DRL I chose. I am now running the switchback 1157 instead of the stock 1156. Initially, I asked the dealer to turn the DRL off and they claimed they could not. I didn't feel like arguing so I used the above as a guide. Since I just wanted them off I simply clipped the wire and called it a day, no need for a switch.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

Just because our 4Runners and other trucks are overweight pigs and the brakes are barely suffice enough as it is. On other more sporty cars I've had like A4, Charger, Mustang these "parking" brakes are more than suffice to stop the vehicle as well as allow me to do some cool J turns and 360°s in deserted parking lots.

I think it depends on the style of parking brake used. I believe on sportier vehicles they utilize the actual rear brake calipers while many vehicles likes ours use a drum brake system. (I can easily overpower the P-brake on a Camry let along something as "sporty" as say a 328i or what not.)

Also I'm not saying they don't brake at all, just that they don't do it efficently. I don't think you're gonna stop a Mustang going 70mph with just the P-Brake in any less distance that probably 2-3 times normal braking distance.

 

[TRDCal]

Nice try BlackWorksInc but you can't bull**** and old bull****er

Where did you get that info, on the back of a cereal box? Don't take that the wrong way, I appreciate your involvement in the discussion and everything but your entire post is nothing more than speculation.

"The Automotive industry has stopped using "emergency brake" because too many people thought it really would stop the car effectively." Oh is that why they stopped?? LOL..."the system hasn't become as robust as modern cars have". What?? Do you seriously believe that??

Vehicles are built to a standard. It's not just willie nillie...oops the car is too robust for the parking brake....Aww well screw it. There are specific regulations that a vehicles parking brake system must conform to in order to be deemed "safe for the public"

Here's is a link to specific Canadian requirements. Canada Motor vehicle safety standard - 121 - Parking brake test - Transport Canada. I realize that link deals with tractor/tractor trailers brake requirements but it was the first thing that came up in my google search and I couldn't be bothered to continue searching. It at least gives you an idea that there are specific requirement that manufacturers need to meet even for things as simple as a parking brake.

Also, it doesn't relieve stress from the parking pawl because by the time you've set the parking brake, you've already released the main brakes and allowed the vehicles weight to roll onto the pawl. Unless your able to hold the brakes with your right foot and apply the parking brake with your left, which I doubt you do, and if you do your a very small minority.

"If you've ever had the opportunity to do this in a safe enviroment, get to about65mph, then slam on your parking brake and nothing else." Well obviously you can't expect miracles from it, but when your going that fast you can use the gearing in your transmission to slow you down.

Try not to get offended by any of that, it's all in the name of a good debate. All I'm saying is that the brake is there for emergencies also, not just for parking. Pointe finale!

 

[rebelbowtie]

Whenever I am on a steep incline(only time i set the parking/emergency brake) I most certainly hold the brake with my right foot and completely depress the parking brake, then shift into park.

Guess I am a minority

 

[BlackWorksInc]

I apprecuiate your honesty TRD, I'm not trying to BS you. I am just going by information I have personally been told, trained with, and/or garnered in my experience. I always am willingto admit if I mess something up.

It wasn't a ceral box by the way , it was all my instructors, Toyota's training material and almostevery course in automotive technology I have taken in recent years. There's an active push towards calling it a "parking brake" rather than emergency, and I think its more to do with liability than anything.
From my experience with regular parking/emergency brakes they are not sufficent to provide what I personally would consider enough use for an Emergency situation. You don't need to stop the car to drift it or perform a J-turn, hence why they're so useful for that situation.

As for the Canadian regulations, I believe heavy duty trucks utilize a different parking brake system as they are disengaged with air, in the event of a air line failure the brakes engage automatically. (at least this was my brief explanation from a fleet mechanic who worked on those vehicles. I personally have not taken any heavy truck training.)

PS- I am also a minority, Was taught to engage the P-brake before letting off the brakes.

 

[MikeInNH]

When you're driving down the road and you have complete hydraulic brake failure...Guess what...You're going to use your Parking Brake for the emergency. So while technically it's a parking brake...it's still used as an E-Brake.

 

[Atlanta_man]

I can tell you the biggest mistake a valet parking guy can make is to set the brake before sending the owner off on their way.

 

[TRDCal]

No worries, I didn't think you were BSing me but I had heard that expression last week and have been waiting for a chance to use it

Another argument as to why its more than a parking brake is because of its design. If it was only meant for parking then why not make it a simple system that holds pressure on the main brakes. Instead its a complete system that is independent of the main brakes. It's like Mike said, if you have a complete hydraulic failure your going to apply the parking brake, therefore in that situation it's an emergency brake.

Also generally the parking brake isn't even sufficient for drifting, sure it works for amateur enthusiasts but professionals like Ken Block use a hydraulic parking brake. But in that instance its not being used for parking OR emergencies.

You correct about how tractor trailer brakes work, I learnt that on Ice Road Truckers hahahaha. There are standards out there for passenger vehicles as well though.

P.S. I guess I'm also a minority because I was taught to drive in a standard transmission vehicle.

EDIT: Wow, I just realized what were arguing about is ridiculous, it feels like I've hit rock bottom.

I can tell you the biggest mistake a valet parking guy can make is to set the brake before sending the owner off on their way.

Yah no doubt, especially if the owner never uses it and it seizes on. One reason I'll park my own car thank you very much.

 

[Subnet]

Ok now that you have your answer I'm going to jack your thread...

Why do people disable DRLs? I just don't get it! The only possible reason I can see is wanting to be stealthy but other than that what the purpose?

Stealth is the main reason

 

[rebelbowtie]

Stealth is the main reason

So you're making drug deals in your 4Runner?

 

[Atlanta_man]

I just wish my emergency/parking brake would work. It's only good for the smallest of emergencies and parking on level ground (with no wind blowing).

 

[TRDCal]

I just wish my emergency/parking brake would work. It's only good for the smallest of emergencies and parking on level ground (with no wind blowing).

Wishing isn't going make it better :. Get out there and adjust it. Even if its not the most effective parking brake it should certainly be able to hold the vehicle on a hill. Even on a windy day

 

[Subnet]

So you're making drug deals in your 4Runner?

Doesn't everybody?

 

[Atlanta_man]

Wishing isn't going make it better :. Get out there and adjust it. Even if its not the most effective parking brake it should certainly be able to hold the vehicle on a hill. Even on a windy day

Sounds good ! Too bad the two dealer adjustments years ago back when it was new did no good. I'm not tempted to go through the console removal to try it myself.

Yeah it works, but its too weak to be worth using.

 

[TRDCal]

Sounds good ! Too bad the two dealer adjustments years ago back when it was new did no good. I'm not tempted to go through the console removal to try it myself.

Just because it was done at the dealer doesn't mean it wasn't some young punk apprentice (like BlackWorksInc....hahahaha just kidding man ) that didn't know what he was doing because guess who gets to do tires and brakes at a shop (I'll give you a hint, its not the experienced guys).

And I'm not talking about adjusting it at the console. That's one way but personally I would start by adjusting the shoes. You should adjust them to the point that there is resistance when spinning the wheel with the brake NOT engage. If you do that then theres no reason it shouldn't work.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

Just because it was done at the dealer doesn't mean it wasn't some young punk apprentice (like BlackWorksInc....hahahaha just kidding man ) that didn't know what he was doing because guess who gets to do tires and brakes at a shop (I'll give you a hint, its not the experienced guys).

And I'm not talking about adjusting it at the console. That's one way but personally I would start by adjusting the shoes. You should adjust them to the point that there is resistance when spinning the wheel with the brake NOT engage. If you do that then theres no reason it shouldn't work.

I agree with TRD (except the calling me stupid part :cry2:.) The only time you should really be adjusting it at the actual parking brake lever is if you've properly adjusted the brake shoes and they still do not tightly engage or your parking brake mechanism, untilizes the actual caliper itself and not a mini drum brake system.

You're first adjustment should always be at the rear brakes before you do anything else. Toyota says something like 7-12 clicks should be the appropriate range for the parking brake to be fully engaged (I like mine a little tighter myself.) Oh, forgot to mention that you'll need the rear wheels off to adjust the brake.

 

[dadigab]

Nice try BlackWorksInc but you can't bull**** and old bull****er

Where did you get that info, on the back of a cereal box? Don't take that the wrong way, I appreciate your involvement in the discussion and everything but your entire post is nothing more than speculation.

"The Automotive industry has stopped using "emergency brake" because too many people thought it really would stop the car effectively." Oh is that why they stopped?? LOL..."the system hasn't become as robust as modern cars have". What?? Do you seriously believe that??

Vehicles are built to a standard. It's not just willie nillie...oops the car is too robust for the parking brake....Aww well screw it. There are specific regulations that a vehicles parking brake system must conform to in order to be deemed "safe for the public"

Here's is a link to specific Canadian requirements. Canada Motor vehicle safety standard - 121 - Parking brake test - Transport Canada. I realize that link deals with tractor/tractor trailers brake requirements but it was the first thing that came up in my google search and I couldn't be bothered to continue searching. It at least gives you an idea that there are specific requirement that manufacturers need to meet even for things as simple as a parking brake.

Also, it doesn't relieve stress from the parking pawl because by the time you've set the parking brake, you've already released the main brakes and allowed the vehicles weight to roll onto the pawl. Unless your able to hold the brakes with your right foot and apply the parking brake with your left, which I doubt you do, and if you do your a very small minority.

"If you've ever had the opportunity to do this in a safe enviroment, get to about65mph, then slam on your parking brake and nothing else." Well obviously you can't expect miracles from it, but when your going that fast you can use the gearing in your transmission to slow you down.

Try not to get offended by any of that, it's all in the name of a good debate. All I'm saying is that the brake is there for emergencies also, not just for parking. Pointe finale!

Really? You just heard it and have been WAITING to use that line. Cave man thought it was a Bull**** line.

 

[TRDCal]

I agree with TRD (except the calling me stupid part :cry2:.)

LOL, just screwing with yah...It is nice having someone with the inside scoop :