Frozen Calipers - How many others had this problem?

[charlier180]

Had my Front Pass Side caliper replaced yesterday at the dealer under the extended warranty.

I had a Corolla loaner overnight. Driving to the dealer yesterday in the snowstorm was fun. No ground clearance + all weather tires + automatic transmission + other jerks on the road = PITA drive. The ride back with the 4Runner was great and put a smile on my face.
Especially when I passed other Cute Utes doing 25-30 mph or other SUVs on the side of the road in a ditch. Gotta Love the 4Runner. :biggrin2:

 

[rando]

I replaced my front pads last weekend (45k miles on truck) and, thankfully, didn't encounter this problem.

 

[zerowkul98]

I just drove my 08 home from the dealership...new front passenger side caliper. I dont feel guilty anymore for buying the extended Extra Care warrantee anymoe.

However....my pedal travel is TOTAL CRAP now! I used to touch the brake pedal and SCHREECH! ON A DIME! Now though, it goes nearly to the FLOOR!

Anyone know what (if anything) i can/should do about this?

 

[NCSCOTT]

I just drove my 08 home from the dealership...new front passenger side caliper. I dont feel guilty anymore for buying the extended Extra Care warrantee anymoe.

However....my pedal travel is TOTAL CRAP now! I used to touch the brake pedal and SCHREECH! ON A DIME! Now though, it goes nearly to the FLOOR!

Anyone know what (if anything) i can/should do about this?

Take it back to the dealer ASAP!! They did not bleed the brakes properly after they replaced the caliper. There is still air in the system which will cause excessive pedal travel and poor braking.

 

[zerowkul98]

Update: I took the 4runner out on the highway this morning and when i press the brake, the truck jolts to the left! The new caliper is on the right side though! I guess the new caliper isnt as responsive or as good as the original?

I called the dealership and they told me they'd take it back in today and tell Toyota Extra Care it MUST HAVE BOTH REPLACED, not just the one.

I'll be sure to tell them about the pedal-travel, but on the paperwork i received that shows what was done, there is a line that says the brakes were bled. I have also been told that once the braking system is changed from its original state, its NEVER as good. My 03 is the same way. I had the front calipers replaced a year ago,....pedal travel sucks.

Just wanted to add: The dealership i go to out here in western mass is tops. These guys have hooked me up a few times and have always been straight-shooters. Love em'.

 

[stanleybb50]

Update: I took the 4runner out on the highway this morning and when i press the brake, the truck jolts to the left! The new caliper is on the right side though! I guess the new caliper isnt as responsive or as good as the original?

I called the dealership and they told me they'd take it back in today and tell Toyota Extra Care it MUST HAVE BOTH REPLACED, not just the one.

I'll be sure to tell them about the pedal-travel, but on the paperwork i received that shows what was done, there is a line that says the brakes were bled. I have also been told that once the braking system is changed from its original state, its NEVER as good. My 03 is the same way. I had the front calipers replaced a year ago,....pedal travel sucks.

Just wanted to add: The dealership i go to out here in western mass is tops. These guys have hooked me up a few times and have always been straight-shooters. Love em'.

That message wad automated or they just didn't do it correctly. Reason pulling left is your right is doing jack **** so it pulls left... Very unsafe too. Get that thing back in there or bleed the brakes yourself.


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[zerowkul98]

I dont understand why the new one would being doing jack! Why wouldnt the NEW caliper being closing? Id imagine that the new equipment would be functioning better than old, but im no know-it-all on the hydraulics of the 4runner brakes.

Its back at the dealership, they ordered a new caliper for the left side as well. I'll have a new pair in the front completely.

 

[stanleybb50]

I dont understand why the new one would being doing jack! Why wouldnt the NEW caliper being closing? Id imagine that the new equipment would be functioning better than old, but im no know-it-all on the hydraulics of the 4runner brakes.

Its back at the dealership, they ordered a new caliper for the left side as well. I'll have a new pair in the front completely.

Good to hear. They should have done both from the start. The new one has air in the lines. Air compresses MUCH more than the brake fluid itself (which doesn't compress much). So the old caliper has no air in the line, but the new one does. The new one is doing ''something'' but not as much as the other side with no air in the line. Make sense?


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[BlackWorksInc]

I wonder if they bled the ABS Module properly as well? I doubt it, but when they replaced the caliper it could have got an air buble back into the ABS unit. That system controls the brakes individually and could cause some problems along with the caliper not being bled properly. Like I said, more likely the caliper, but it still is a possibility. I would have them bleed the entire system again to be sure as well as the ABS/TCS (They should have done it anyways)

As for the pedal travel? You will notice more pedal travel than what you are accustomed to because the brakes were probably dragging before which made the brakes slightly stiffer in terms of pedal travel. But you're describing ecessive pedal travel, I just wanted to make sure you understood that when they fix it and the system is running properly your pedal travel will still be "softer" than what you have become accustomed to.

 

[KB084RUNNER]

I dont understand why the new one would being doing jack! Why wouldnt the NEW caliper being closing? Id imagine that the new equipment would be functioning better than old, but im no know-it-all on the hydraulics of the 4runner brakes.

Its back at the dealership, they ordered a new caliper for the left side as well. I'll have a new pair in the front completely.

Your dealer mechanic is an idiot. He should know that you only replace calipers in pairs. He should also know that there is an electric accumulator pump in the 4 Runner braking system and the brakes need to be bled with the ignition key in the ON position so the pump works. WTF? :wow: He should also know that to retract the pistons you have to open the bleeder first so the fluid can escape.

I just did my 2008 calipers at 60k and the pins were rusted in and needed to be hammered out with a punch BUT the pistons were fine. New pads & fluid flush and like brand new.

 

[zerowkul98]

Sure, just amazing that they wouldnt have remedied that before i picked it up, or even during the "road test" after the work was done...if that was actually done.

Im told also that the brakes are never the same or as good as they once were when/if the original system is tampered with or changed. There any truth to this?

It sure is worse on our 03', but that one has Carbone calipers on the front..i didnt have he coin back when that one's originals went.

 

[KB084RUNNER]

I wonder if they bled the ABS Module properly as well? I doubt it, but when they replaced the caliper it could have got an air buble back into the ABS unit.

No possible if he topped off the master cylinder with fluid and left the cap off so fluid would gravity bleed out of the disconnected line while the caliper is off. But these guys obviously don't know that. If they would simply open the bleeder first and use a c-clamp to push the pistons in they would find many of the pistons are really not frozen.

 

[KB084RUNNER]

Sure, just amazing that they wouldnt have remedied that before i picked it up, or even during the "road test" after the work was done...if that was actually done.

Im told also that the brakes are never the same or as good as they once were when/if the original system is tampered with or changed. There any truth to this?

No...mine are like brand new and used the existing calipers and rotors. They don't know what they are doing. I'll give you a simple "bed -in" tip. Once the brakes are done correctly go do 30 gradual stops from 35mph down to 5mph with about 1/2 mile of driving in between each stop. This allows the brake pad material to transfer evenly onto the rotor. Allow to cool and take it easy on the brakes for the next 500 miles. By bedding them in you should get 50-70,000 miles from a set of factory pads and your rotors should last 150-200,000 miles.

 

[zerowkul98]

Wow, thanks for all that info. I really appreciate it.

That "booster" the V8 sports have kicks in A LOT on the 03 with the Carbone calipers. Wondering if i should invest in OEM's or if it doesnt really matter.

 

[stanleybb50]

Wow, thanks for all that info. I really appreciate it.

That "booster" the V8 sports have kicks in A LOT on the 03 with the Carbone calipers. Wondering if i should invest in OEM's or if it doesnt really matter.

All castings are OEM castings actually regardless of the rebuild company from what I understand. But you could upgrade to Tundra calipers/rotors pretty easily (also from what I've read). If my calipers freeze again, ill likely do this.


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[BlackWorksInc]

Your dealer mechanic is an idiot. He should know that you only replace calipers in pairs. He should also know that there is an electric accumulator pump in the 4 Runner braking system and the brakes need to be bled with the ignition key in the ON position so the pump works. WTF? :wow: He should also know that to retract the pistons you have to open the bleeder first so the fluid can escape.

I just did my 2008 calipers at 60k and the pins were rusted in and needed to be hammered out with a punch BUT the pistons were fine. New pads & fluid flush and like brand new.

The electric acumulator pump deal I can see someone overlooking if they don't do these 4Runners regularly. Honestly? I could see a technician just slapping the calipers on there and doing a half assed bleed job also.

As for the person who said that they should replace them in axle pairs, you are correct. But from warranty standpoint, they want to only replace the damaged part and its become such a regular thing that its unfortunetly become a bit of a mindset in customers and service writers to just replace one shock or caliper.

Eh, most of the Toyotas are pretty good about not having to crack the bleeder to compress the pistons. Even with these floating calipers, as long as you can apply even pressure to both sets of pistons they retract slowly but perfectly fine. Our guys do it all the time and we haven't had any issues when changing out brake pads. BUT, that is for replacing pads and not disconnecting the lines and allowing air to get in them and do a poor job of bleeding them. :

 

[KB084RUNNER]

Eh, most of the Toyotas are pretty good about not having to crack the bleeder to compress the pistons. Even with these floating calipers, as long as you can apply even pressure to both sets of pistons they retract slowly but perfectly fine. Our guys do it all the time and we haven't had any issues when changing out brake pads. BUT, that is for replacing pads and not disconnecting the lines and allowing air to get in them and do a poor job of bleeding them. :

Yes, but when you fail to open the bleeder and you force the pistons back in you are forcing any of the contaminated fluid in the calipers back into the braking system instead of flushing it out of the system. This is just a poor practice in my opinion to save 1/2 labor hour. I have always flushed at least 1 pint of new fluid through the system with every reline. SOP for me and it extends the caliper life by a factor of 2 or 3. My wifes Lexus ES350 has 140,000 miles on the original calipers & rotors and just got a reline & full flush. I checked the rotor thickness and they will go to 200k no problem. This will be our second Lexus that got 200k on the factory calipers & rotors.

 

[zerowkul98]

Ill be sure to request the brakes bled PROPERLY. Also, Blackworks, thanks for the info on pedal-travel. I never thought that my malfunctioning caliper would create a false sense of a more "tight" braking sensation. I appreciate the education!

 

[Metzbower]

My 07 T4R goes in the shop Tuesday. The driver's side pads are wearing quite unevenly (outer looks great, even at 104k hwy miles, inner is almost gone). My mechanic only works on Toyota's, so I am hoping it is an easy fix. Though possibly costly.

BTW, I found this when getting new tires. The tire place would have just replaced the pads and turned the rotors, not fixing the root cause problem.

I understood you need to do pads or discs on both sides - if only one caliper is seizing, why replace both? I'd love to know the reasons. Thanks. Love this forum.

 

[flnycus]

calipers not covered under CPO??

I have a 06 v8 sport with 45k miles, took it in for oil change and tire rotation and they said the front two calipers were frozen. My truck is certified pre owned but they said it wasnt covered, had to pay $800... did i get taken for a ride? Any chance i can get toyota to pay for some anyone???