Holy DTC code hell!!! 2008 Limited
- Thread starter alia176
- Start date
BlackWorksInc
New member
Oh, derp forgot about that. But yeah typically haven't seen too many VVTi issues with the 1GR-FE & 2UZ-FE engines.
Mostly been the FWD engines and it's not very common.
If we were to unplug the MAF during these episodes, that should immediately throw a CEL but how would the engine run? Would it simply return to a limp home mode idle or some other default RPM?
I'd love to swap in a MAF from another VVTI, not sure if someone on this board has one to loan. If I were to use the one from my' 03 V8 (non VVTI), would there be any drastic issues or would the engine throw a CEL right away?
It's tempting to do this just to rule it out. The engine may not develop full hp/torque due to the non VVTI MAF but who cares if it rules out another possibility. Let me know your thoughts please and once again, thanks everyone for their inputs.
*** Update ***
Well, her Runner had a total freakout on our way home from ice cream. So, we pulled over and I unplugged the MAF and the engine died, as expected. The CEL came on with P113, P102.
What was interesting is that after plugging the MAF back in, the engine acted normal again, all the way home. There were ZERO hints of what just happened two min ago, even though I flogged her.
So there you go gents, another data point for you.
Well, her Runner had a total freakout on our way home from ice cream. So, we pulled over and I unplugged the MAF and the engine died, as expected. The CEL came on with P113, P102.
What was interesting is that after plugging the MAF back in, the engine acted normal again, all the way home. There were ZERO hints of what just happened two min ago, even though I flogged her.
So there you go gents, another data point for you.
Scott@Hightech
New member
So that's pretty much exactly what I was thinking would happen. usually you can get a vehicle running with no MAF but it takes a little throttle work and a few tries starting before the engine swtiches to some failsafe mapping. and it usually does run poorly.
I think the MAF is the right path if you cant find someone local, I would replace that first before dropping the tank.
Couple of things:
Dropping the tank? My '96 80 series Landcruiser has a top access for the fuel pump and sending unit. Surely this '08 modern 4Runner has the same thing, no?
I'm tempted to swap out her MAF with mine (non VVTI) and see what happens just for S&G!!
I didn't notice it while I drive it yesterday but I'm curious if she is referring to the fan clutch sound.
Scott@Hightech
New member
I couldn't tell you I did my first Toyota fuel pump in 15 years on a sienna van 2 weeks ago. Maybe blackworks knows different but with as many Toyotas as I see( not a dealership) that was the first fuel pump failure.
chitown40
Member
Less talk - more do. :bravo:
BlackWorksInc
New member
From what I remember when I was going to swap intakes with a member that had a vvti v8, the MAF connectors are different as are the mounts.
I don't see too many fuel pumps going bad, but it's possible.
I don't see too many fuel pumps going bad, but it's possible.
*** Update ***
This issue reared it's ugly head yesterday eve on the hwy as she was heading home. She unplugged the MAF sensor but that didn't do anything. The usual DTC codes came up and the engine wouldn't start or hold the idle.
So, I went to her and was getting ready to tow her to my house but then the engine started. I drove it to my house as she followed me. The engine didn't like to be pushed under load and it stumbled badly around 1500 rpm or under. So basically the engine didn't like to be pushed under load. This issue can be recreated by power braking as well on the driveway.
Around 10pm last night, I started the engine up and power braked like normal. Lo and behold, she is right as rain
I drove it to work this morning and she is driving her normal self.
So, it looks like a component is getting hot and malfunctioning. As soon as things cool down, life it normal again.
Switching the MAF is a no go as the connectors are indeed different as mentioned previously.
The ambient temps in ABQ was around 100 deg yesterday.
This issue reared it's ugly head yesterday eve on the hwy as she was heading home. She unplugged the MAF sensor but that didn't do anything. The usual DTC codes came up and the engine wouldn't start or hold the idle.
So, I went to her and was getting ready to tow her to my house but then the engine started. I drove it to my house as she followed me. The engine didn't like to be pushed under load and it stumbled badly around 1500 rpm or under. So basically the engine didn't like to be pushed under load. This issue can be recreated by power braking as well on the driveway.
Around 10pm last night, I started the engine up and power braked like normal. Lo and behold, she is right as rain
I drove it to work this morning and she is driving her normal self.
So, it looks like a component is getting hot and malfunctioning. As soon as things cool down, life it normal again.
Switching the MAF is a no go as the connectors are indeed different as mentioned previously.
The ambient temps in ABQ was around 100 deg yesterday.
Additon to Update
To add a bit more info......
I did have to pull over on the freeway. the engin didn't die but the vehicle would not move forward. I could push the pedal to the floor and nothing would happen. no revving sound. no forward movement. I then unplugged the MAF. This is when the engin died and wouldn't restart. I pulled codes P0113, P0102, P0171, P0174, C1201, P0302, P0304, P0306, P0308.
Ali was on his way to tow me to the nearest safe place. I continued to try to start the vehicle. when the engin would catch it would then sputter and die. So, the next time I heard the engin catch I revved the crap out of it (in neutral). if I let it idle it was really ROUGH. I felt like I was on an old combine. once it would hold a smooth idle I was able to drive to the next exit off the freeway. it made some hesitations but drove well...
I was able to drive about 3-ish miles before it had another 'melt down'. again, engin was running, but zero ability to move forward. I pulled off the road and set the vehicle in neutral and let it idle. eventually the engin died and woudln't turn over at all.
This is where I met up with Ali.
He hooked up the tow strap and as we were getting ready to depart I decided to try to turn over the engin again. it caught and I revved it up and let Ali take the wheel.....He did his thing all the way home....
This issue reared it's ugly head yesterday eve on the hwy as she was heading home. She unplugged the MAF sensor but that didn't do anything. The usual DTC codes came up and the engine wouldn't start or hold the idle.
So, I went to her and was getting ready to tow her to my house but then the engine started. I drove it to my house as she followed me. The engine didn't like to be pushed under load and it stumbled badly around 1500 rpm or under. So basically the engine didn't like to be pushed under load. This issue can be recreated by power braking as well on the driveway.
Around 10pm last night, I started the engine up and power braked like normal. Lo and behold, she is right as rain
I drove it to work this morning and she is driving her normal self.
So, it looks like a component is getting hot and malfunctioning. As soon as things cool down, life it normal again.
Switching the MAF is a no go as the connectors are indeed different as mentioned previously.
The ambient temps in ABQ was around 100 deg yesterday.
To add a bit more info......
I did have to pull over on the freeway. the engin didn't die but the vehicle would not move forward. I could push the pedal to the floor and nothing would happen. no revving sound. no forward movement. I then unplugged the MAF. This is when the engin died and wouldn't restart. I pulled codes P0113, P0102, P0171, P0174, C1201, P0302, P0304, P0306, P0308.
Ali was on his way to tow me to the nearest safe place. I continued to try to start the vehicle. when the engin would catch it would then sputter and die. So, the next time I heard the engin catch I revved the crap out of it (in neutral). if I let it idle it was really ROUGH. I felt like I was on an old combine. once it would hold a smooth idle I was able to drive to the next exit off the freeway. it made some hesitations but drove well...
I was able to drive about 3-ish miles before it had another 'melt down'. again, engin was running, but zero ability to move forward. I pulled off the road and set the vehicle in neutral and let it idle. eventually the engin died and woudln't turn over at all.
This is where I met up with Ali.
He hooked up the tow strap and as we were getting ready to depart I decided to try to turn over the engin again. it caught and I revved it up and let Ali take the wheel.....He did his thing all the way home....
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Scott@Hightech
New member
well the first 2 codes were likely set from disconnecting the MAF, then 2 lean codes, a VSC trigger code and bank 2 misfires.
Its interesting that it only is missing on bank 2. but leaning out on both banks.
Do you have access to a heat gun? maybe try hitting various things with a heat gun such as the O2s, MAF , Cam sensors and even the PCM is self. be mindfull not to melt anything
Its interesting that it only is missing on bank 2. but leaning out on both banks.
Do you have access to a heat gun? maybe try hitting various things with a heat gun such as the O2s, MAF , Cam sensors and even the PCM is self. be mindfull not to melt anything
I have several heat guns but I'm not sure that's a good idea :biggrin1: As you said, the codes are interesting. She did get misfire codes on bank 1, back on the first post.
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Scott@Hightech
New member
I use heat guns in situations like this frequently, ive also put parts in the freezer to get them to act up.
BlackWorksInc
New member
Do your scantools show commanded injector pulse width and good data lists?
I would try to replicate the issue and watch the Short & Long Term Fuel Trims as well as the O2 Sensor responses as the computer tries to adjust. I'd also see as much data as you can pull on the injectors to see what the ECM is commanding out of them along with MAF sensor data.
IF there's a heat related fault in the MAF or Injector coils you should see the MAF start giving odd numbers, or the Injectors having increasingly higher and higher pulse width despite the fuel trims and O2 sensors reading lean and/or showing little to no change as a result.
I would try to replicate the issue and watch the Short & Long Term Fuel Trims as well as the O2 Sensor responses as the computer tries to adjust. I'd also see as much data as you can pull on the injectors to see what the ECM is commanding out of them along with MAF sensor data.
IF there's a heat related fault in the MAF or Injector coils you should see the MAF start giving odd numbers, or the Injectors having increasingly higher and higher pulse width despite the fuel trims and O2 sensors reading lean and/or showing little to no change as a result.
Let me fire up my OBD-II diagnostic software and see what data I can provide for you. I'm with you, the more data I can provide, the better troubleshooting we can do. As soon as we can swap rides, I'll have her drive my vehicle for a week while I drive hers with the laptop hooked up and do some data logging.
As a side note, I drove her '08 to/from work yesterday and sure enough, as soon as I hit the long uphill grade to my house on the I-40, the surging started. I was able to coax it home but not without a lot of effort. P0171 & P0174 popped up. If i stabbed the throttle, it falls flat on its face, literally just bogs down!
More fun ***UPDATE***
Hello,
My precious has been running perfectly for the past couple of weeks. And then This past Monday check engine and VSC lights came on while driving home (under load, up a hill. ambient temperature was about 58 degrees). But absolutely nothing mechanical wise was noticed. the vehicle was running perfectly. I was able to pull codes P0430 and C1201.
I reset the codes and not another issue all week.
Until Friday. I got the normal chugging/slugging and pulled codes p0171& p0174
And today Saturday no engine/driving issues but code p0430 is pulling.
:frusty:
Hello,
My precious has been running perfectly for the past couple of weeks. And then This past Monday check engine and VSC lights came on while driving home (under load, up a hill. ambient temperature was about 58 degrees). But absolutely nothing mechanical wise was noticed. the vehicle was running perfectly. I was able to pull codes P0430 and C1201.
I reset the codes and not another issue all week.
Until Friday. I got the normal chugging/slugging and pulled codes p0171& p0174
And today Saturday no engine/driving issues but code p0430 is pulling.
:frusty:
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