I'm going soft- want my 4R to ride like a GX

[jakehere]

I have a SR5 2WD with bilstein 5100's all around, front set to .85" of lift and better than stock tires on 17" wheels, caster set to 4 degrees. Huge improvement all around than stock. Got 37K miles on this setup.

I have come to the point where I'm being honest with myself and realizing that I will never take my 4R offroad. I drive polaris rzr's off road, no need to wheel my 4R. But I'll never drive a unibody suv so don't even go there. This is my 3rd 4R and I love them.

BUT, driving around my parents, kids, suburbia, I do wish sometimes my 4R rode a bit nicer, seems harsh on big hits and lots of side to side movement. Not the best road trip car either.

So obviously larger sway bars would help the side to side motion. I searched some old posts that spoke of ADDCO sway bars but looks like they never materialized.

I often daydream about running Icon/Radflo/Toytec coilovers set to 0.5-1" lift... would these ride nicer than stock? By nicer I mean smoother, more progressive travel, that would feel Lexus like.

I'm dreaming of my 4R riding like a Ford Raptor on road. Maybe bypass shocks? Haha I dunno, but I'm open to any ideas.

Any thoughts would be much appreciated.

 

[SigSense]

I've never experienced the ride in a GX or a Raptor, so have no point of reference. You took an SR5 with it's boat-like handling and added Bilstein's to (I guess) improve the ride. Now that set-up is unsatisfactory? Why go the Icon/Radflo/Toytec route if you're not going to need the capabilities those systems provide? You said you were being honest, then really evaluate the WHO/WHAT/WHEN/WHERE and HOW you'll be driving. If there will never be any offroad, then by all means adjust accordingly.

 

[ATL4R]

I have a SR5 2WD with bilstein 5100's all around, front set to .85" of lift and better than stock tires on 17" wheels, caster set to 4 degrees. Huge improvement all around than stock. Got 37K miles on this setup.

I have come to the point where I'm being honest with myself and realizing that I will never take my 4R offroad. I drive polaris rzr's off road, no need to wheel my 4R. But I'll never drive a unibody suv so don't even go there. This is my 3rd 4R and I love them.

BUT, driving around my parents, kids, suburbia, I do wish sometimes my 4R rode a bit nicer, seems harsh on big hits and lots of side to side movement. Not the best road trip car either.

So obviously larger sway bars would help the side to side motion. I searched some old posts that spoke of ADDCO sway bars but looks like they never materialized.

I often daydream about running Icon/Radflo/Toytec coilovers set to 0.5-1" lift... would these ride nicer than stock? By nicer I mean smoother, more progressive travel, that would feel Lexus like.

I'm dreaming of my 4R riding like a Ford Raptor on road. Maybe bypass shocks? Haha I dunno, but I'm open to any ideas.

Any thoughts would be much appreciated.

I think going to a P285 70 17 will get you a much smoother ride than any LT tire, which I assume you are running.


Edit: just read your Sig and see you are on passenger tires already. Never mind my comment. What psi are you running?


They toytec coilovers are the exact same shocks you are currently running with even stiffer springs, so that is probably not the direction you would want to go. I'd drop your bilsteins from .85 to 0 to take out the preload.

 

[characterzero]

You want softer shocks

Go back to stock, that is probably your best option. You'll have to mitigate the dive/roll another way.

The setups like the ICON and Radflos seem to have a higher floodgate to open the compression valve, which makes sense. This translates to a stiff ride on the road that opens up when bumps are hit at speed. That is why they are considered racing shocks - they're valved for that application. Of course, if you think your 5100s feel too stiff, you'd just be getting upset at dropping that money to get something that is even more stiff.

Honestly, this is why I bought a TE with KDSS. Nice supple suspension with mitigated roll. It works.

 

[crunchcity]

Might want to test drive a GX and see if getting one is feasible, you'll always be wondering "what if" and comparing to it.

The GX has adaptive suspension (with selectable modes?) as well as adaptive stabilizer bars? I'm not sure there is a 4Runner trim available with that exact same combination of options.

 

[philsey]

Also suggest you go test drive the LE. Might not be much more expensive to trade than to put all those changes into the SR5, with unknown satisfaction.

 

[homeyclaus]

The side-to-side motion ("head toss") is a suspension pre-load issue most of the time.

I run my 5100's at stock height, because when the truck is loaded, it's level then, and the last thing I need is a taller truck. The lifting action of the 5100's actually pre-loads your front springs more, and so your front end is less compliant than it would be at stock height.

So my recommendation is this: set your fronts back to stock height, and level out the back with a spacer or something if you feel the need to. That combination, at least with my truck, has a LOT less head-toss or discomfort when empty than the stock shocks.

And lastly, if all you're doing is driving around with it and want a better ride, a Highlander is probably more your thing. It can tow the same weight, it just lacks the image.

 

[Stifler]

I run my 5100's at stock height, because when the truck is loaded, it's level then, and the last thing I need is a taller truck. The lifting action of the 5100's actually pre-loads your front springs more, and so your front end is less compliant than it would be at stock height.

I could very well be wrong but I thought the 5100s lifted the vehicle by raising the coil seat... thereby in conjunction with a longer shock just moved the coil north without preload. I ran 5100s at the 2.25" setting on my tundra and the change in "feel" was minimal. I could definitely feel the change in dampening but there was no "jarring" affect like an in coil spacer gives.....

EDIT... as you were:

Bilstein’s 5100 series literature (pdf) does a great job of highlighting the limitations of traditional spacer lifts in great detail, but it seems to gloss over the fact that Bilstein’s new kit most-definitely relies upon spring pre-load to achieve lift. Bilstein’s literature states that pre-loading the spring is bad because:

A spring preload kit does not provide for more overall wheel travel. By lifting the vehicle in this manner, all you are doing is increasing the static ride height within the stock limited amount of wheel travel. The result of utilizing a spring preload kit is a loss of down-travel. For example, with the static ride height increased by 2″, droop has been decreased by 2″ causing the stock shock to top out sooner. Keep in mind, a certain amount of down travel *must* be maintained in order to maintain a decent ride quality. Vehicles with little or no down-travel deliver *extremely* poor ride characteristics.

 

[proquip]

Interesting read off the Bilstein website.

http://www.bilsteinus.com/fileadmin/user_upload/user_upload_us/pdfs/Bil_LevShks_WebArticle.pdf

Page 3

Strut Extension Kits Can Create Over Extended Down-Travel
Coilover shocks are the factory down travel limiter on the majority of applications. This means that the OEM shock will stop the downward motion of the suspension before component damage occurs. Parts that may be damaged from over-extension include ball joints, CV joints, driveline or swaybar components. Most of these suspension designs allow a little leeway for a longer shock, typically about 1/2” to 3/4”. By installing a strut extension spacer, you will be increasing the overall length of the coilover assembly by 1” to 2”. This will far exceed the limits of the suspension down-travel and increase the likelihood of component damage.
Bilstein 5100 Series Leveling Shocks are 1/2” to 3/4” longer, depending on application, than the O.E. shocks they replace. Yet, they are designed to prevent over-extension of the suspension travel and possible component damage. All 5100 Leveling Shocks are designed to optimize available suspension travel.​

The 5100 is 1/2" to 3/4" longer than the stock shock depending on the application, having a similar effect to a top-out spacer. In addition, the adjustable collar allows you to preload the stock spring to achieve another 1-3/4" to 2" of lift similar to a preload spacer. It's the combination of both factors that gives you up to 2.5" of lift. I would suspect that at the 0.85" lift setting, you're getting most if not all of the lift from the longer strut, not from additional spring preload.

 

[jfdallas]

Also suggest you go test drive the LE. Might not be much more expensive to trade than to put all those changes into the SR5, with unknown satisfaction.

^^This

The LE with XREAS is a much smoother ride than the SR5. I haven't driven a Trail so can't comment on it's ride. But I use my LE almost exclusively for highway/street driving and it's great, even corners well. I don't do any offroading, that's why I got the 2WD. It's great, I love it.

So if you want to stay with the 4R and can pony up the cash difference, I'd suggest giving the LE a try...I think you will like the improved ride.

Best of luck!

 

[Sound Auto]

Put Michelin LTX MS or Cross Terrain tires on it. There is not a better riding tire on the market. Not to mention they will last 60-80k miles. Most tire places near me offer a 30 day trial. I would imagine it will be the same near you.

 

[Stifler]

Put Michelin LTX MS or Cross Terrain tires on it. There is not a better riding tire on the market. Not to mention they will last 60-80k miles. Most tire places near me offer a 30 day trial. I would imagine it will be the same near you.

1st post from a michelin employee?

 

[jakehere]

The 5100 is 1/2" to 3/4" longer than the stock shock depending on the application, having a similar effect to a top-out spacer. In addition, the adjustable collar allows you to preload the stock spring to achieve another 1-3/4" to 2" of lift similar to a preload spacer. It's the combination of both factors that gives you up to 2.5" of lift. I would suspect that at the 0.85" lift setting, you're getting most if not all of the lift from the longer strut, not from additional spring preload.

I hear what you're saying about the length being longer. But my gut tells me that at .85" of lift the springs are being preloaded, the front end definitely feels a little stiffer. On my last vehicle, a 2007 Tundra, I also had the 5100's at .85" and that too felt a little a little stiffer.

 

[philsey]

I have a SR5 2WD with bilstein 5100's all around, front set to .85" of lift and better than stock tires on 17" wheels, caster set to 4 degrees......

I guess Bibendum missed this. This is an SR5 suspension tuning and component issue, not tires so much.

Be funny if the OP is running Michelins.

 

[Sound Auto]

Never worked for Michelin. However, I spent a few years in the wheel and tire business and went to Michelin's east coast facility for their Bronze, Silver, and Gold training program. Additionally, I have gone to Cooper and Hankook trainings and had the opportunity to A/B compare many tires. Auto manufacturers go to Michelin to enhance the ride of their luxury cars and hide the cheap suspension parts in their economy cars.

Anytime I do wheel and tire package for my customers I go Michelin for street and BFG for dirt providing they offer the size I'm after.

If you can find a shop that offers 30day trial you can't go wrong.

 

[Kinnick]

But I'll never drive a unibody suv so don't even go there.

Have you considered a Highlander or Pilot? :hiding:

 

[gamerc]

Also suggest you go test drive the LE. Might not be much more expensive to trade than to put all those changes into the SR5, with unknown satisfaction.

I went from a 2010 SR5 to a 2011 Limited and I'm quite pleased with the choice. It stung a little, but for the next 9 years, I'm confident I'll be happy with the choice. Maybe next time I'll go with a lexus GX (that's for you, Stifler).

 

[BlackWorksInc]

You want squishy, soggy, road erasing Lexus feeling, go air suspension. You'll have a cushy ride, and since you don't plan on off-roading no need to worry about puncturing the bags on a rock. Personally if I want my car to feel like I'm not driving on anything I'll hire a driver to drive it for me too, but to each their own.

 

[jakehere]

You want squishy, soggy, road erasing Lexus feeling, go air suspension. You'll have a cushy ride, and since you don't plan on off-roading no need to worry about puncturing the bags on a rock. Personally if I want my car to feel like I'm not driving on anything I'll hire a driver to drive it for me too, but to each their own.

If you know of any air suspension that will work with our 5th gen please let me know. I'm not talking about firestone air bags. I'm talking about a true air suspension...

 

[tjnaples]

You need a Highlander if sticking to Toyota. Same space inside as a 4R. Buyer remorse sucks.