Yup, DI is loud.
Jeep went diesel, Toyota next?!
- Thread starter DannyLlama
- Start date
Yup, DI is loud.
rebelbowtie
New member
For some reason those two variants seem louder than normal. My old A4 sounded like a 12v Cummins when idling.
1engineer
Moderator
See, that's just not true lol. We love to make things as simple and robust as possible. Fortunately, you guys don't have to drive around in something I would design. If you did, you would be embarrassed to be seen in it but you would never have to work on it and it could double as a stump puller on a farm.
Actually, YOU are the reason everything is so complex nowadays. You and millions of others who want something like power windows for example. How easy were crank windows? Loved them. Manual transmission? Perfect. All those safety features? If the public could drive then we would not need them. So you see we are not responsible for the complexity it's you and your buddies lol. Just kidding but you see my point.
BlackWorksInc
New member
Like I said, most engineers I've met; I'm sure there are some out there that like to do things simply.
I agree, you're right about the complexity of the systems being based on customer demand. Power Windows, Adaptive Cruise Control, adaptive butt warmers, ect ect.
But my point was more along the lines of something as simple as a door lock latch & actuator. The BMW systems I've seen use a linkage, but it has little to no real mechanical use. The lock latch is computer controlled down to the latch itself with little to no mechanical back-up should the system freak out or fail. What practical purpose does it serve to overly computerize a door latch, other than locking your customers inside the vehicle and making them sound like idiots on 911. LoL
There's a lot of these complex engineered bits on modern cars that seem to serve no purpose other than an exercise in over complicating something else. In that door lock example, the simple mechanical latch with a lock actuator to engage and disengage the lock switch has been a tried and true system and had the great back up if the lock actuator failed of letting you out of the vehicle!
I agree, you're right about the complexity of the systems being based on customer demand. Power Windows, Adaptive Cruise Control, adaptive butt warmers, ect ect.
But my point was more along the lines of something as simple as a door lock latch & actuator. The BMW systems I've seen use a linkage, but it has little to no real mechanical use. The lock latch is computer controlled down to the latch itself with little to no mechanical back-up should the system freak out or fail. What practical purpose does it serve to overly computerize a door latch, other than locking your customers inside the vehicle and making them sound like idiots on 911. LoL
There's a lot of these complex engineered bits on modern cars that seem to serve no purpose other than an exercise in over complicating something else. In that door lock example, the simple mechanical latch with a lock actuator to engage and disengage the lock switch has been a tried and true system and had the great back up if the lock actuator failed of letting you out of the vehicle!
philsey
New member
1-E is exactly right. Case-in-point; look at all the carping on here over the loss of, or exclusion of *memory seats, *self-leveling headlights, *multi-zone AC, *I-pod ports, *power points, on-and-on ad nauseum.
My second car was a 1960 Beetle. It didn't even have a gas gauge, or a radio, ....... and a heater? ... HAH!!!
My second car was a 1960 Beetle. It didn't even have a gas gauge, or a radio, ....... and a heater? ... HAH!!!
Cool thread and I'll have to read more of it when I get time. Wrangler Unlimited 4cyl diesel...that would be my next ride. Guess I'll hold off and see how the new JGC works out since it has a different diesel engine in it than the previous diesel. Maybe the Italians know something different than the Germans.
Yogi56
New member
Nothing cooler than seeing a chipped 4x4 3/4 ton diesel truck laying rubber and smoke from all 4 tires
My dad was an engineer at Cummins. Back in the early 2000's, his team developed a V6 and V8 that were intended to be used in light duty vehicles. I know they were in talks with Toyota to supply them the V8, but that was a long time ago. I don't remember the exact specs of the motors, but I think the V8 was around 350 HP. My dad drove a Dakota test mule with the V8 in it and he told me it would spin the tires on demand. I think Dodge was going to put it in the Ram until Fiat took over.
This is actually awesome news... hopefully more 1500 and smaller trucks start getting diesel options.
Reata
New member
Ouch.
Curt Sauve
New member
The JGC is "Supermodele Italiano" and most likely just as High Maintenance.
homeyclaus
New member
Toyota has zero incentive to bring a diesel to market here.
All the D4D diesels are built to run with sulphur-free fuel, which isn't likely to be on the market here for some time. Listen to the diesel pickup people, they hate the stuff, just like people hated unleaded gas for whatever ignorant reason.
Toyota will not pull out an 80's era diesel with the urea-injection lipstick-on-a-pig-solution just to have a diesel on the market. And they won't design a sulphur-tolerant diesel that meets US emissions standards.
And as a shareholder, I agree with that decision.
This is, incidentally, the same reason why the diesels from VWAG, BMW, and Mercedes are effectively neutered when sold here. I have seen, touched, and sat in an Audi A8 v8 tdi pushing ~ 420 metric horsepower in 2003. It actually needed quattro to keep the tires on the rims.
And Italian diesels are great engines. Except for the turbochargers. Which the Ram will have.
ETA:
Vehicles from any country of manufacture have a lot in common with women from the same country. It's a known fact.
So my Tundra is a Texas chick with an asian fetish. Just my thing.
All the D4D diesels are built to run with sulphur-free fuel, which isn't likely to be on the market here for some time. Listen to the diesel pickup people, they hate the stuff, just like people hated unleaded gas for whatever ignorant reason.
Toyota will not pull out an 80's era diesel with the urea-injection lipstick-on-a-pig-solution just to have a diesel on the market. And they won't design a sulphur-tolerant diesel that meets US emissions standards.
And as a shareholder, I agree with that decision.
This is, incidentally, the same reason why the diesels from VWAG, BMW, and Mercedes are effectively neutered when sold here. I have seen, touched, and sat in an Audi A8 v8 tdi pushing ~ 420 metric horsepower in 2003. It actually needed quattro to keep the tires on the rims.
And Italian diesels are great engines. Except for the turbochargers. Which the Ram will have.
ETA:
Vehicles from any country of manufacture have a lot in common with women from the same country. It's a known fact.
So my Tundra is a Texas chick with an asian fetish. Just my thing.
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1engineer
Moderator
Decided to slum a little today Homey? How's that new truck doing?
homeyclaus
New member
Taking a break from the Tundra forums for a forum where most can spell, have heard of grammar, and are more likely to have fewer problems with diction.
The new truck drives like a 6100 lb V8 Corolla. I never knew they can do 0-60 in 6.3 seconds, which apparently will beat a Raptor in both that as well as the quarter mile.
My only complaint is that most of the Tundra aftermarket is polluted with bling targeted at bro's for their brodozers. Which is the problem with their forums - all bro's and bubbas. I can only deal with so much of that.
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1engineer
Moderator
Yes, as my children were (are) growing up I spoke of a "cocoon" effect that they were experiencing where, no matter what the circumstance, would find themselves embraced with isolation. They asked me to explain so I took them to the one place where everyone, rich or poor, young or old, black or white, smart or dumb, skinny or fat, short or tall and pretty or ugly had to go: The DMV. This quickly demonstrated to them the cocoon analogy I was using.
dekeman
New member
Hey Homey, isn't all highway diesel in the US now ULSD? And wouldn't a Toyota-owned Hino diesel work in the Tundra or 4R?
I thought diesel engines designed after 2009 were designed to run on the "clean diesel," hence the growing application of d engines?
I would also say Toyota has a very big incentive to bring in a diesel - the competition is running away with technology that improves fuel efficiency while the Tundra hasn't improved much, if any, in almost a decade.
The runaway success of Ford's EcoBoost suggests buyers want better economy with more power (even if the EcoBoost is only marginally more efficient.)
I thought diesel engines designed after 2009 were designed to run on the "clean diesel," hence the growing application of d engines?
I would also say Toyota has a very big incentive to bring in a diesel - the competition is running away with technology that improves fuel efficiency while the Tundra hasn't improved much, if any, in almost a decade.
The runaway success of Ford's EcoBoost suggests buyers want better economy with more power (even if the EcoBoost is only marginally more efficient.)
homeyclaus
New member
Ulta-low Sulphur is just what it say - less sulphur.
Hino engines are medium duty, and while they can burn that stuff, they won't meet the emissions standards for light-duty vehicles without significant work.
"Clean Diesel" is a marketing term, it stands for ULSD. It's anything but "clean." But "less dirty" is about as sexy as "less leaded."
Just about every light-duty (small) diesel sold elsewhere in the world is common-rail, overhead cam, direct-injected, with a particulate management system, either straight catalyst or urea and catalyst (mainly the Germans, since they could not take the "up-yours" from Peugeot's urea-free design in 2002). The particulate management systems for smaller engines require sulphur-free fuel, because they don't produce the exhaust temperatures for "regenerating" a diesel particulate filter.
On a tangent, only the American light-duty diesels sold in the US are still pushrod designs (although there are some advantages to this, stuff like VVT is much harder), and for some reason they seem to prefer throwing technology at an old design rather than do a re-design of the power plant. Heck, piezo injectors are the new thing in diesel here, and I am not sure when VW's tdi light duty engines switched to those - 1993 perhaps? I know Ford's and GM's Euro diesels changed over when they went to the common rail design as well.
My Tundra 5.7L 4x4 can be run at reasonable speeds at 20 mpg on winter gas, even with less than 500 miles on it. Given its performance though, that's a lot harder said than done. The EPA mileage tests since the measurement change may have been more accurate, but don't reflect everyone's driving patterns.
I like good mileage. I really like diesel. I like LPG more. But now the government has made it all stupid with its crony capitalism.
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