1engineer
Moderator
You have a serious reading comprehension problem. Diesels are not going to be on the fringe because they already are here in the US! Maybe one of these days they will be mainstream but not today.
Light in the diesel tunnel
- Thread starter dekeman
- Start date
bluebullet
New member
No one has mentioned the supply/demand part in this discussion.
According to http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-g...../how-much-gasoline-one-barrel-crude-oil.htm
A barrel of crude oil can make about 19 US gallons of gasoline, 10 gallons of diesel, 4 gallons of jet fuel and another 9 gallons of other oil products such as ...
Refineries cannot significantly change their production profiles without major
capital investments so we are stuck there. As more cars/small trucks enter the market with diesel offerings competing with 18 wheelers for diesel (also called home heating oil) gasoline becomes more attractive from a cost standpoint. Plus you don't have to add urea to gasoline engines either. With continued, additional assistance from the EPA I see no way diesel (even bio-diesel) can be considered a desirable alternative for the US passenger car market.
I have always thought diesel is more expensive per gallon (from $.10 to $1.00 depending on time of year) where I live (MT) because there are so many more diesel pickups here compared to other parts of the country thus creating a relatively larger demand for diesel than in other parts of the US.
My point here is that to make more diesel to satisfy demand you must also make more gasoline thus possibly creating an excess supply of gasoline. That should make gasoline relatively less expensive.
According to http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-g...../how-much-gasoline-one-barrel-crude-oil.htm
A barrel of crude oil can make about 19 US gallons of gasoline, 10 gallons of diesel, 4 gallons of jet fuel and another 9 gallons of other oil products such as ...
Refineries cannot significantly change their production profiles without major
capital investments so we are stuck there. As more cars/small trucks enter the market with diesel offerings competing with 18 wheelers for diesel (also called home heating oil) gasoline becomes more attractive from a cost standpoint. Plus you don't have to add urea to gasoline engines either. With continued, additional assistance from the EPA I see no way diesel (even bio-diesel) can be considered a desirable alternative for the US passenger car market.
I have always thought diesel is more expensive per gallon (from $.10 to $1.00 depending on time of year) where I live (MT) because there are so many more diesel pickups here compared to other parts of the country thus creating a relatively larger demand for diesel than in other parts of the US.
My point here is that to make more diesel to satisfy demand you must also make more gasoline thus possibly creating an excess supply of gasoline. That should make gasoline relatively less expensive.
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Depends on what segment you are talking about....for commercial Tractor Trailers, Pickup's, other work vehicles, trains, ect. diesel is either the predominant fuel form or at the very least very popular.
In the general car pool used by America, I agree they aren't nearly as popular or widely used, but my argument is that there is a potential change in that trend.
I'm not following your logic there...
Jhalko
New member
This whole argument is a waste of time fellas, we are moving to electric whether it makes sense or not. Basically ban coal so wind, solar, etc provide power to your next plug in electric car, maybe just maybe you'll still be allowed to drive it by skynet.
Next up, govt will be banning fun because too many people get hurt having it, safety hazard...
:driving:
Next up, govt will be banning fun because too many people get hurt having it, safety hazard...
:driving:
KidVermicious
New member
When you refine a barrel of oil, you basically get what you get from it, in a fairly predictable ratio. You can't say "I'm going to use this barrel of oil to just make diesel", it doesn't work like that. So to make more diesel, you make more gas. Make enough diesel to bring the price down, you make enough gas to push the price down even further.
JHalco is right, electric is the future. We can't produce enough biodiesel or whatever-ahol to power our fleet, and we won't for a long time to come, and our use of fossil fuel is not indefinitely sustainable. Most of our electricity currently comes from fossil fuels too, but it's much easier to change the fleet to electric and then work on making the producing stations greener than it is to try and make green fuel for the existing fleet. I think we'll shortly see a push to mandate a percentage of electric and plug-in hybrids from automakers the same way the Fed is currently mandating a mean MPG.
And hell, you want torque? You want reliability? You want electric. Once the bugs are worked out, electric cars are going to be much more reliable, and easier/cheaper to repair when they do break.
KidVermicious
New member
Those Google cars scare the crap out of me. I work with electronics, I know how often shit glitches.
wfo9
New member
These are all opinions here...
So, I'll throw mine out. ;-)
There is no long term future for diesels in light duty trucks or passenger cars in the US. Diesel will be around for a very long time in commercial applications.
Why?
- Emissions
- Gasoline engine tech is improving at a very rapid rate. The big innovators are not investing in diesel
- Gasoline engines will eventually work like a diesel in some scenarios (best of both worlds). Lookup HCCI engines for more info.
There is a short term market for light duty trucks with a diesel and they will sell very well. I would even consider buying one myself.
Reliability with all the emissions crap on current diesels is very questionable. The smaller ones do better, but you are still rolling the dice a bit at this point compared to a gasoline engine with much simpler and commoditized set of components.
So, I'll throw mine out. ;-)
There is no long term future for diesels in light duty trucks or passenger cars in the US. Diesel will be around for a very long time in commercial applications.
Why?
- Emissions
- Gasoline engine tech is improving at a very rapid rate. The big innovators are not investing in diesel
- Gasoline engines will eventually work like a diesel in some scenarios (best of both worlds). Lookup HCCI engines for more info.
There is a short term market for light duty trucks with a diesel and they will sell very well. I would even consider buying one myself.
Reliability with all the emissions crap on current diesels is very questionable. The smaller ones do better, but you are still rolling the dice a bit at this point compared to a gasoline engine with much simpler and commoditized set of components.
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