Low caster angles after lift

[luckyluke]

Either way, breaking the bolt lose alone isn't the only issue that folks run into. The cam sleeve being seized to the inner bore of the LCA bushing is what really brings the pain.

Today I tried to take my LCAs apart. Do the cams really have to rotate in the bushings? On the driver's side cams are seized to the bushings but I can freely move the LCA from horizontally to vertically.
On the passenger side rear is stuck and no way I can lower the LCA.

 

[EdmundGTP]

Today I tried to take my LCAs apart. Do the cams really have to rotate in the bushings? On the driver's side cams are seized to the bushings but I can freely move the LCA from horizontally to vertically.
On the passenger side rear is stuck and no way I can lower the LCA.

If the cams were not able to rotate within the LCA bushings, then they would not be adjustable.

The actual OEM LCA bushings consist of steel inner and outer sleeves that are molded together to a rubber inner bushing. The reason you can still pivot the LCA up and down, while the cams are seized up is because the rubber inner bushing has most likely failed. Unless I misinterpreted what you wrote.

Hard to determine exactly why yours are behaving the way you describe. In any case, the LCA bolts and cams are either coming apart easily so you can remove the LCA's, or they're not.

What you've discovered is the exact reason why "they" didn't touch your caster adjustment as you mentioned in the first post.

 

[luckyluke]

If the cams were not able to rotate within the LCA bushings, then they would not be adjustable.

The actual OEM LCA bushings consist of steel inner and outer sleeves that are molded together to a rubber inner bushing. The reason you can still pivot the LCA up and down, while the cams are seized up is because the rubber inner bushing has most likely failed. Unless I misinterpreted what you wrote.

Hard to determine exactly why yours are behaving the way you describe. In any case, the LCA bolts and cams are either coming apart easily so you can remove the LCA's, or they're not.

What you've discovered is the exact reason why "they" didn't touch your caster adjustment as you mentioned in the first post.

I think the bushings are fine. They stay tight in the LCAs but sides loose to the frame bracket. I can't get the LCA out because the "toe adjust cam sub-assembly" in the front and the "camber adjust cam assembly" in the rear are seized to the bushings. The front bolt and plate and the rear nut and adjust cam 2 are out.
The passanger side is different. The LCA also moves up and down but the metal flange of the rear bushing is seized to the frame bracket and I'm sure the rubber/sleeve failed here.
It looks to me like the angles can still be adjusted on the driver's side because turning cams move the whole LCA. I'd like to be certain though before I start to saw.

 

[luckyluke]

You were absolutely right. Cams have to rotate in bushings, if seized no alignment possible.
I managed to replace all 4 bushings. Firstly melting rubber with a torch as nothing but the outer sleeve stayed. Then cutting that sleeve with a saw and punching it out. Cleaned from rust inners were prepared for new bushings. I used aftermarket ones, bigger were Febi Bilsteins, smaller Meyles. Biggers were hammered in, smallers were pressed in with a vice and huge pipe.
And of course had to buy OEM cams/bolts that I needed to cut off. Used a decent amount off a copper anti-seized grease on all elements and it works great.

I turned all as the repair manual instructed and was pretty close to the specs. The the mechanic in the alignment shop tried to adjust the camber and caster to the center values and ended up with:

• Caster
  3°16 both
• Camber
  0°24 left, 0°26 right

These values are much better now, but to set it, the cams (one front, one rear) where turned "out of the range" (more then max 10 markers on the cams). Is it OK?

 

[luckyluke]

Attaching pictures. Is this correct for cams to be out of range?

 

[EdmundGTP]

Should be fine..

The cam bolts can be in any orientation (rotationally speaking). The compressive load from the torque of the thru-bolt is what keeps them in place. Caster adjustment is likely maxed out, which is typical when trying to get alignment into spec after a lift with OEM control arms (upper and lower).

If you were to go any higher on the lift, you will lose caster angle and not be able to get it back without switching to an aftermarket UCA.

Just curious, if you had to go back and do it all over again would you buy replacements or repeat the rebuild?

 

[luckyluke]

Thank you.
Knowing that ball joints were fine I would do it all again. I always try to reuse as much of original Toyota's parts as possible. It wasn't too bad. I burned the rubbers when neighbours were out so no one complaint about the smell Cutting flanges went pretty easy. The worst part was pressing new bushings in. I was to go to the shop with a proper press to do it for me but it was Friday and I wanted to finish it before weekend..
Another thing is the quality of the aftermarket bushings I bought. Guess they not as good as three times more expensive OEMs and I only hope they last a few years.