mobile1 supersync'ed

I started running Mobil 1 after the 2nd oil change at 3k (1st one at 1k miles to remove the filings from the break in period). All oil changes were done by the dealer following Toyota's recommendations. When I asked about Dino vs Synthetic, they said all oils break down (which is true)... The difference after 2k miles on Dino vs 2k miles on Synthetic is the contaminants after the dino oil is burned. These contaminates pollute the oil (maybe not appreciably) and will form adhesions within the engine which, after time, lead to poor oil circulation and sludge build up. This has been around since the 50's... The biggest difference between those cars of the 50's and the cars today are the tolerances between moving parts.

They also mentioned that Toyota really doesn't care about the life of your engine after 60k miles (when their warranty runs out). It is actually better for them if your engine doesn't last past 100k miles, then you go out and buy another Toyota...
 
"Also, once synthetic oil is used, you should keep using it and not switch back and forth with natural petroleum-based oil."

Oh, rats. After reading the mixed reviews on synthetic oil, and weighing the added cost, I was gonna do synthetic once every 3 oil chg / 15k miles. Guess Toyota is saying "bad idea". oh well, so much for that.
 
Re: mobil1 supersync'ed

tcpoob said:

the reason i went for the synthetic is, in addition to the valued recommendation from many here, the regular dino oil always checked out dark brown not too long after an oil change - making me wonder if they really did the work.

we'll see how mobile1 fares in a month or two.
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If the oil didn't turn dark, I'd be worried. Mobil 1 will turn dark in a short period of time too. It's an indication that the oil's add pack is working.

Oil darkness does not equal dirty/bad oil.
 
Bluto said:
Toyota's positions is you don't 'have to' use synthetic. A petro SJ 5W-30 is the minimum grade oil, changed at recommended intervals. If you don't think synthetic has any advantages over petro, don't use it.




http://www.toyota-4runner.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6986



Just a FYI, Mobil1 does not recommended extended drains while under warranty.


Synthetics do not break down like petroleum oils. However, Toyota feels petro oils do just fine for 5000 miles.

Your warranty will not be voided for going past the recommended change interval. Toyota simply won't warranty any damages/problems caused by exceeding the oil change interval. For the most part, the burden of proof falls on them.

To totally cover your rear, keep all receipts, change every 5k, and buy only Toyota Oil Filters.
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This is not Toyota's current Fax. Please ask them to send you the most current. It specifically states synthetic is not recommended. It is the fax that talks about the API grade "SL"
 
07runner said:
This is not Toyota's current Fax. Please ask them to send you the most current. It specifically states synthetic is not recommended. It is the fax that talks about the API grade "SL"
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I hate to state the obvious, but there is a really big difference between "not recommended" and "recommending against" something...

Not recommended simply means that they aren't requiring it.

Let's keep arguing this... It's fun. :bash:
 
RECOMMEND - to suggest favororably as suited for some use, funtion , position, etc.

NOT RECOMMEND- the opposite of the above definition.

Please dont make this a argument about semantics.

SEMANTICS- the branch of linguistics concerned with the nature, structure, and esp, the development and changes of the meanings of speech forms, or with contextual meaning.

Simple terms, Toyota is not be thinking that synthetic is good for da motor . So to be safe petro workum good. Motor not enginnerrred for the use of synthetic. Dat why motor come to u with petro oil.

The fax specifically states that the use of synthetic is not recommended, it is the fax that talks about API grade "SL"

So please make sure you get the most current toyota statement regarding the use of synthetic oil.
 
07runner said:

The fax specifically states that the use of synthetic is not recommended, it is the fax that talks about API grade "SL"

So please make sure you get the most current toyota statement regarding the use of synthetic oil.
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What number did you call? If this is true, my owners manual is wrong. It does not say anything about synthetics. Just API grade SL or ILSAC multigrade, 5W-30 viscosity. Pages 375-376, and 402.

Is your owners manual different?
 
Bluto said:
What number did you call? If this is true, my owners manual is wrong. It does not say anything about synthetics. Just API grade SL or ILSAC multigrade, 5W-30 viscosity. Pages 375-376, and 402.

Is your owners manual different?
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Your Salsa Red 4Runner was not made in 2006, which is the year of the fax I am talking about. This is not in the owners manual for 2006 either, but might be for 2007. Ask for the fax, they will send it to you. The current API grade now is "SM" so all future engines will require that grade unless they make a higher grade before production in 2007. Phone number to call is 1- 800-331-4331 Make sure you specify exactly what want. Sometimes the people that answer the phone there are very smart and on top of all issues. Other times, you could get a real dummy.
 
07runner,

The reply you received from Toyota was probably written by a marketing-type person who knows VERY LITTLE about engines and oil.

If this reply came straight from the engineering department, that would be different. However, in the real corporate world these kinds of decisions and official corporate policies are made by business people - not engineers, chemists, tribologists, etc. The technical people may provide input, but the final decisions are made based upon what is best for the company.

If Toyota REQUIRED 5,000 mile OCIs using synthetic, and Honda required only 10,000 mile OCIs with petroleum-based oil (which they do), this would be a huge detriment in the Toyota's true cost of ownership calculation. This could be an unneccessary disadvantage to Toyota in the eyes of consumers.

There is NOT ONE statement in the information from Toyota which leads me to believe that this official policy was in any way formulated by their "technical" people.

I agree that 5,000 mile OCIs with modern dino oil under NORMAL driving conditions is all that MOST modern engines require for complete protection. However, from an engineering and chemical standpoint, there is really no category where a dino oil can be shown to be superior or "better" for a vehicle than a good synthetic.
 
07runner said:
Your Salsa Red 4Runner was not made in 2006, which is the year of the fax I am talking about.
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You don't own a 4Runner? Own any Toyota? It is a bit extreme to have the most current maintenance guidelines faxed to you from the manufacture of a vehicle you don't own. You really research a vehicle before you buy it.


07runner said:
My point is, at this time no Toyota engines require synthetic oil. It is at this time a waste of money....
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Like you said on page 2 , synthetic is a waste of money. But these bull balls are worth buying.

07runner said:
I'm going to put this on the hitch of my new 4Runner. Red, the second generation ones....
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The fax was sent to me from Toyota, I really don't know exactly which department it was issued from. It did say that Toyota does not recommened the use of synthetic oil. Said nothing about hurting the engine or voiding warranty.
I only shared the information that was sent to me. If you can get a more official answer then please share it with us.

I would think that somebody important at Toyota would have approved that statement about synthetic oil. At least I hope so.

No reason was given as to why synthetic was not recommended.
 
I am sure that they are correct in that synthetic is not required to protect their engines. This is their official corporate policy, based upon sound engineering, and they will not offer inconsistent recommendations to the public. That is smart business.

That is not to say that synthetic oils are not superior in many ways to dino oils. However, in most daily drivers on the road, the advantages of synthetic do not always come into play.

Take another example. Toyota recommends using only 5W-30 oil in the 4Runner. In many instances, depending on climate and driving conditions, I am positive that 0W-30, 10W-30, 5W-40, 15W-40, etc. would provide better protection. However, 5W-30 is a good all-around compromise choice for any climate, and you will not get Toyota Corporate to recommend anything else in a fax. The person responding to your request, who likely knows very little about oil, is simply going to regurgitate the corporate policy and tell you to use only 5W-30. Meanwhile, the engineer living in Japan who designed the motor is probably running 10W-30 in summer and 0W-30 (synthetic only) in winter.

As another example, you will find that identical engines sold in different countries will have different viscosity recommendations. Europeans generally prefer heavier oils, and many manufacturers spec heavier oils in those countries, while identical engines sold in the U.S. are speced for lighter weight viscosities.
 
Bluto said:
You don't own a 4Runner? Own any Toyota? It is a bit extreme to have the most current maintenance guidelines faxed to you from the manufacture of a vehicle you don't own. You really research a vehicle before you buy it.




Like you said on page 2 , synthetic is a waste of money. But these bull balls are worth buying.
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I own a Lexus SC and a ES300, no 4runner now. I pay cash for everything and never just do stuff on a whim. Any time I pay more than $30000 for something it is in my nature to be educated and know more than I need to so I won't regrett it later. I will have a Limited 07 4Runner this fall, so excuse me for entering a discussion about a vehicle I will own and know that I will be happy with. If your wondering why I just dont get the GX470, I will be going off road and having fun with it. So excuse me for being here without a 4Runner in my garage right now. Yes I do research before the wallet opens, did the same when I purchased the Fountain boat, not a boat forum, with all the serious stuff in my life I thought bull balls made the mood lighter, you dont like then dont buy them. Make lots of money, buy toys, be happy.
 
07runner said:
If your wondering why I just dont get the GX470, I will be going off road and having fun with it. So excuse me for being here without a 4Runner in my garage right now. Yes I do research before the wallet opens, did the same when I purchased the Fountain boat
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What's wrong with GX470 in off-roading?? Definitely, for your high-class wine tasting sessions, brook brothers shopping, and country club stuff, the GX is a much better fit.:)

BTW...what's the saying...the happiest times for a boat owner are when he buys the boat and when he sells it.:)


Ya know, from recent threads by you...You sound like an elitist snob...i hope not.
 
07runner said:
... excuse me for being here without a 4Runner in my garage right now. Yes I do research before the wallet opens, did the same when I purchased the Fountain boat, not a boat forum, with all the serious stuff in my life I thought bull balls made the mood lighter, you dont like then dont buy them. Make lots of money, buy toys, be happy.
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I was just bustin on your 'bull balls' to make the mood lighter. :arrow:

The canned response from the webpage is all I have got from Toyota. I've been trying to find out if Toyota requires an API certified oil. All I've gotten is "Toyota recommends API grade oil." I wanted to see if you had a different # to call.

The owners manual recommends Toyota Motor Oil. Has anyone ever used it? I've never seen it at a dealer.

motoroil.jpg



http://www.toyota.com/html/shop/dealers/parts/motoroil.html
 
If anybody can get a official reply from Toyota then do it. My major concern was how the fax said not recommended. Did not say not needed, actually said not recommended.

I will be taking my 4Runner off road and because it will get scratched, dinged, and maybe dented, costs less than the Lexus GX 470. If something serious happans, I don't have to be towed very far to the nearest Toyota dealership, but Lexus could be 100 miles away.

Thai, The Sc model is a better choice for the country club scene to answer your question. But the 4Runner is for fun.

When a person purchases a boat in the level of the Fountain line, the normal my best day was buying and selling it does not apply. 93mph , synthetic is required with these engines, came that way from the factory. Very high performance and compression ratio.

I am not a snob, when nobody is looking I drink my beer from the bottle.
 
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