Moving from Vegas to Chicago - Winter Advice

[philsey]

I grew up in Chicago, and have lived mostly in Boston for the past 25 years.



No need. All you are doing is wasting fuel. Go out to the car, start up the engine, turn on front and rear defroster (and seat heaters), then start clearing the frost off the windows with your ice scraper. Once the windows are clear, drive away.



Air compressor? WTF for?



Get a second set of wheels and install honest to goodness snow tires. I like Nokians. They will stop and turn about 30% better than all season tires.

Realize that your 4WD system will easily lead to overconfidence. When you press the gas, the truck will just take off if it is in 4WD, and you might not realize just how slippery it is. 4WD helps you go, but it doesn't help you turn or stop. Once you get going in the snow, on a straight stretch of road with no one around you, slam on the brakes. You will be surprised by just how little braking action you have. I do this every single snow storm.

When driving in the snow, slow and steady wins the race. Don't do anything suddenly. Steer gently. Accelerate gently. Leave a bunch of extra room. Anticipate other drives being morons and give them plenty of room.

Get yourself an extendable snow rake. Clear off all your windows, your hood, and your roof before driving. Don't drive around with a bunch of snow on the roof -- it will blow off and blind cars behind you, and if you slow suddenly, will slide forward and blind you.

I've lived in the Midwest my whole life, and ^ pretty-much says it all.

As to snow tires: it depends. If you have decent tires, and drive carefully, with 4WD you're more GTG than most other drivers.

I do - Blizzaks on steelies - and this combo is fantastic in the 10% of the time when you HAVE to go, and good (normal) tires won't. Trade-offs are cost, storage space, and 2X/year on/off, and the temptation to go when you should stay home.

Personally, you should be the most concerned about your California-girl. You imply she is inexperienced in snow. Make damned sure she has good tires.

 

[M1911]

.



If there is a lot of snow on the ground and the streets aren't plowed, I much prefer the feel of the center-diff being locked. I also often disable traction control by holding the button for 5 seconds. I am not suggesting you do this, this is only my preference in certain conditions. When going up slippery hills or in loose areas, I do not want power being cut to my wheels. Chicago is flat so you probably won't have this problem.
:

Unless I was going through very deep snow (greater than 6 inches), I never locked the center diff. My snow tires had all the traction that I needed, even for steep hills. Once traction control was turned off, my 4Runner became very tail happy. Also on the 4th gen, at least, locking the center diff turns off spin control. For a novice driver in snow, it would be best to keep all the electronic driver aids active.

No need for an engine block heater or a battery blanket. This is just Chicago, not Fairbanks.

 

[M1911]

As to snow tires: it depends. If you have decent tires, and drive carefully, with 4WD you're more GTG than most other drivers.



I do - Blizzaks on steelies - and this combo is fantastic in the 10% of the time when you HAVE to go, and good (normal) tires won't. Trade-offs are cost, storage space, and 2X/year on/off, and the temptation to go when you should stay home.



Personally, you should be the most concerned about your California-girl. You imply she is inexperienced in snow. Make damned sure she has good tires.

I get snow tires for the braking. There are few things worse than driving a 5000 lb suv on snow/ice covered roads and having the damn thing start sliding on you when you brake. I remember one particularly icy day before I got snow tires. I was going less than 10 mph, but it slid a long way and I was just along for the ride.

 

[Griz]

I spent 5 years in Lincoln Park (Chicago neighborhood), and have been in a Chicagoland suburb for the last few months. I also lived in Minneapolis before moving to Chicago, so this all should at least mean that I have some clue what I'm talking about...

Hi folks,

Just looking for a little help on adjusting to driving in and surviving the snow in the Chicago area. After living in Vegas and growing up in the South, I'm not ashamed to admit that I'm not an expert in this area. Did a search and I know that the roads in the city and surrounding areas are maintained well enough that the stock Limited can handle the conditions, but I'm hoping to get some general advice and help deciding what advice locals are giving me is legit or not.

One nice thing about Chicago is that it's far enough North that there typically isn't sleet/freezing rain in the equation. The main roads are well maintained, though side streets may take a day to clear after heavy snowfall. Maybe less relevant based on where you need to drive... avoid Lake Shore Drive when there's heavy snow. Lake effect snow typically affects Indiana more so than Chicago, though it's unpredictable. A few years ago, the fire department had to use snow mobiles to rescue people, and then those people's cars needed to be lifted out with heavy machinery. This is an extreme, but LSD is never a good option when it's snowing.

1. Do I need to "warm up the engine" after "stationing" the 4Runner for the weekend? Seems legit with battery concerns, but I'm wondering of the stock battery is heavy duty enough to forego this or if there are other technical reasons for doing so.

2. Is an air compressor really necessary for a "snow kit" like the 4th Gens suggest? Do I need anything other than a shovel with my drivetrain?

The practice of "warming your engine" before you drive anywhere is good intention that doesn't always work out well. The motivation has more to do with getting oils/fluids to proper operating temperature, rather than battery charge concerns. Yes - your engine will warm this way, but you also want your transmission to warm before you put it under too much strain/load. In colder weather, this comes from actually driving your car. The key will be to drive less aggressively, until your car is warmed up.

Regarding your battery, it won't be uncommon to lose some charge in colder weather (while sitting). Couple days shouldn't be an issue. More than a week of sitting, then I'd consider trickle charging your battery in your garage. Definitely keep jumper cables in your car. If you're in the city and a cab driver doesn't have a fare, you ask them for a jump (they're supposed to oblige, and it's worked for me the one time I needed it for my fiancee's car).

4WD + all-season tires with good winter rating should do just fine for most conditions. I only found winter tires necessary for my M3's.

I agree with others that it will help to find an empty parking lot, and learn how your vehicle reacts in the snow. Good rule of thumb is to leave extra room between you and the car in front, to allow your vehicle to brake in a controlled manner.

I'd also keep a scraper (for your windshield), extra gloves, and a warm hat in your car.

3. I consider myself a pretty reasonable driver in terms of safety, but is there anything I should watch out for from other drivers to keep myself safe? People talk about how no one knows how to drive in the snow, but I'm assuming that's just standard whining.

I'm probably overthinking things and I'm really more worried for the wife who is from CA and drives a Honda Fit so any general advice that I can also pass along is much appreciated. And no, she's not getting my keys or a 4Runner of her own!

General advice... Avoid 290 in the snow (or any bad weather, often best to just avoid anyway... you'll understand after you've driven it a few times), Chicagoland drivers are fairly aggressive, and pedestrians and bicyclists (in Chicago) have a death wish.

I'd get your wife some winter tires for her Honda Fit, and it might be worth getting AAA for the first year that you're here. The AAA is probably overkill, but at least it will provide some confidence as she settles in. Regarding her car type/size, I wouldn't worry about it. Most city cab drivers get around in in some sort of hybrid vehicle (e.g., Prius, Camry), and they're just fine through the winter.

One last note, if you're going to actually live and work in Chicago (rather than suburbs), you're going to find that you often won't need to drive. Cabs and public transportation are plentiful. The L and city buses are quite safe and clean, and there are routes that will get you pretty much anywhere in the city and surrounding neighborhoods. If you're in the suburbs, check to see if you have a Metra train nearby.

If you have any other questions about living in Chicago, feel free to shoot me a PM.

 

[Griz]

My advice is to stay off the El.

There are perhaps some lines that you don't want to take too far into some areas (e.g., too far West or South). Otherwise, you'll be perfectly find on the L.

 

[JayceeP]

Unless I was going through very deep snow (greater than 6 inches), I never locked the center diff. My snow tires had all the traction that I needed, even for steep hills. Once traction control was turned off, my 4Runner became very tail happy. Also on the 4th gen, at least, locking the center diff turns off spin control. For a novice driver in snow, it would be best to keep all the electronic driver aids active.

No need for an engine block heater or a battery blanket. This is just Chicago, not Fairbanks.

For sure. I just like the power being split evenly, in the same way when you engage 4wd manually. I find when the diff is unlocked it's much more loose as power allocation varies (as far as I understand anyway). It's rarely a necessity but I have found, especially on the highway, the locked centre diff is a much more planted and controlled feel.

I disable the features a) because it's fun and b) because they can be detrimental in certain situations. If you are just driving around on flat suburban streets, as Chicago would be, you are fine. However, where I live is very hilly and all those features will do is kill your momentum. People often get stuck on hills here because it can go from snow, freezing rain, to rain, back to sub zero within hours.


My 4Runner is parked outside most of the winter and I've never had issues starting up... even on the odd few days where it would get to -40.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

There are perhaps some lines that you don't want to take too far into some areas (e.g., too far West or South). Otherwise, you'll be perfectly find on the L.

It was a half tongue in cheek joke.

Years ago two of my co-workers were in Chicago on training and they got on the L with little clue where they were going and ended up on the south side.

They started to figure out they probably way missed the stop they wanted (they were trying to go to dinner) and were trying to figure out what to do without looking too conspicuously touristy lost.

About that time Bad Bad Leroy Brown starts walking over to them and they were like "Oh shit, this ain't gonna be good".

He looks at them and says "What are you boys doing down here?".

They politely said "We think we missed our stop".

He said " You most assuredly missed your stop. It's not safe for you down here". Then he actually told them what to do to get back were they belonged (don't remember exactly what that info was but it was how to get out of there without being robbed or killed more/less).

 

[CF_Machete]

4 things to remember:

1) Tires: I had general grabber AT2s on my old pathfinder, amazing tires for the price. excellent in deep snow.

2) Wash the road salt off your truck regularly. My pathfinder only lasted 10 years because I didn't & the frame rusted out.

3) Find an empty parking lot: Mess around an learn how your truck handles and how long it takes you to stop.

4) Ice: unless you have studs or chains, you are going to slide.

 

[Ricomondo]

I previously lived in Chicago and have lived in Indiana (just across the border) for almost 30 years.

A small collapsible shovel (auto zone) stows nicely in the back of an SUV.
Chicago/suburbs is susceptible to "Lake effect" snow. Basically its snow bands intensified by Lake Michigan and can be cause for some really hard/fast snowfalls (upwards of 6-10 inches or more) You will hear "Lake effect" quite a bit here.
That is not the norm though. A good all season tire will get you through most of what Chi-town will throw at you.
A few years back though (2011); we got a whopper of a blizzard and 1100 cars approx were stranded on the main road (Lake Shore Drive) commonly referred to as "LSD"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qV3Bcngnv3M

Abandoned on LSD - Chicago Tribune

Don't let that scare you though. Chicago has plenty of awesome restaurants, parks and things to do; but the parking rates; both on the street or in parking garages are outrageous!!
We prefer to stray to the outlying suburbs. Best of luck in your move!

 

[calcrc]

(Canadian 4Runners come standard with a block heater)

Not in Quebec its not ...

Drive like a grandpa until you get used to it. Trust me when you lose control of a 4wheel drive on the snow your done.

Snow Icon tires.

Drive safe.

This pictures dates about 2 years ago. It's the only I have with snow.


That's what we get often around here. All the shoveling done was for the wife's car.

 

[ubergoober3]

Michelin LTX M+S II is the best combination of all weather tire for pavement. Not an AT tire. But 3 sets , on 3 different trucks, over the years through the worst Colorado Wyoming winters. Particularly good on ice compared to other tires. Doesn't need additional siping from dealer.

 

[M1911]

It was a half tongue in cheek joke.



Years ago two of my co-workers were in Chicago on training and they got on the L with little clue where they were going and ended up on the south side.



They started to figure out they probably way missed the stop they wanted (they were trying to go to dinner) and were trying to figure out what to do without looking too conspicuously touristy lost.



About that time Bad Bad Leroy Brown starts walking over to them and they were like "Oh shit, this ain't gonna be good".



He looks at them and says "What are you boys doing down here?".



They politely said "We think we missed our stop".



He said " You most assuredly missed your stop. It's not safe for you down here". Then he actually told them what to do to get back were they belonged (don't remember exactly what that info was but it was how to get out of there without being robbed or killed more/less).

My rules growing up in Chicago were:

1) You need a very special reason to go south of the Loop anywhere other than the museums or the McCormick center.

2) when in doubt, drive east until you hit Lake Shore Drive, then turn left and go north.

There are some lovely parts of Chicago. But the bad parts of town are really bad. Bad as in you might lose your life bad.

 

[Batang.Gapo]

Get a second set of wheels and install honest to goodness snow tires. I like Nokians. They will stop and turn about 30% better than all season tires.

Realize that your 4WD system will easily lead to overconfidence. When you press the gas, the truck will just take off if it is in 4WD, and you might not realize just how slippery it is. 4WD helps you go, but it doesn't help you turn or stop. Once you get going in the snow, on a straight stretch of road with no one around you, slam on the brakes. You will be surprised by just how little braking action you have. I do this every single snow storm.

When driving in the snow, slow and steady wins the race. Don't do anything suddenly. Steer gently. Accelerate gently. Leave a bunch of extra room. Anticipate other drives being morons and give them plenty of room.

Get yourself an extendable snow rake. Clear off all your windows, your hood, and your roof before driving. Don't drive around with a bunch of snow on the roof -- it will blow off and blind cars behind you, and if you slow suddenly, will slide forward and blind you.

I completely agree and Nokians Hakkapeliitta R/R2 SUV wins!

 

[Jhalko]

When you drive through Denver, just STOP, don't bother continuing to Chicago, way way way better here. Always room for more 4runners...

:lol:

 

[M1911]

It's rarely a necessity but I have found, especially on the highway, the locked centre diff is a much more planted and controlled feel.

Gosh, I disagree so completely. There is never a reason to lock the center diff on the highway. I lock the center diff when I'm going offroad, or in very deep snow. A few inches of snow on the road? No. Locking the diff will cause tire slippage when turning, which will reduce traction, not increase it.

I disable the features a) because it's fun and b) because they can be detrimental in certain situations. If you are just driving around on flat suburban streets, as Chicago would be, you are fine. However, where I live is very hilly and all those features will do is kill your momentum. People often get stuck on hills here because it can go from snow, freezing rain, to rain, back to sub zero within hours.

The only reason those systems would be killing your momentum is if the tires are losing grip. Get some snow tires and the tires won't be losing grip.

 

[JayceeP]

Gosh, I disagree so completely. There is never a reason to lock the center diff on the highway. I lock the center diff when I'm going offroad, or in very deep snow. A few inches of snow on the road? No. Locking the diff will cause tire slippage when turning, which will reduce traction, not increase it.

I'm not so sure about that. But like I said, it's how it "feels." I had a 4dr Jeep Wrangler before the 4Runner and when you engage 4wd it would be the same function as a full-time 4wd vehicle like the LE 4Runner having its centre diff locked. I don't care about slippage in 4wd, I care about power getting to the wheels the way I like it.

The only reason those systems would be killing your momentum is if the tires are losing grip. Get some snow tires and the tires won't be losing grip.

That's exactly my point! If you re-read what you just quoted me saying you would see that's what I was alluding to. No matter what kind of winter tires, you will have slippage going up ice packed snow packed steep hills. I run Michelin X-Ice Xi2's in the winter, not sure why you are implying I don't. I live in Nova Scotia man, it's not like I haven't driven in snow before.

 

[mckensel]

I currently live in lake Forrest, just north of Chicago. But commute downtown daily. The last 3 winters in Chicago have been brutal. Negative windchill down to 30 and even 40 below 2 years ago. People drive like idiots at times. But they normally do a good job clearing the main roads. Side roads are a whole other story, people will get in fights over parking spots that they have shoveled out.

-Keep your tank full of gas
I have waited in winter traffic due to wrecks or plows that turns my 40 min commute into 2 hours or standstill for a 30 minutes plus the 2 hours.
-Drain your windshield fluid if it's water based
-Keep a extra coat and blanket in your car along with some snacks
Hot hands
-I keep a army collapsible shovel to help if I leave the hospital and it just snowed and they plowed you are boxed in.
-Keep a good windshield scrapper with brush on it.

Also, it's not a most but I personally like a remote start so I can somewhat have a warm car.

Keep your head and brake lights cleaned off after a snow and ice. It sucks driving in the snow in bumper to bumper traffic and the person in front of you has iced over lights and you can't tell what they are doing.


My two cents. Good luck, and stay north of the loop unless your about "dat lyfe"

 

[Tleahcim]

Thanks, everyone! Luckily I was out there this weekend for the first snow and the wife had a little trial by fire as I had her drive into the city when we went looking for places to live. We're definitely building her a little kit for the car, new rubber for the season, but I completely forgot to drain her current wiper fluid before putting in the winter stuff. Ooops! Until we find a place in the city, it looks like I'm going to take the train into work from Waukegan and hopefully avoid driving too much myself.

 

[philsey]

[MENTION=3101]Tleahcim[/MENTION]

Your avatar is real zazzy.

 

[perkdog258]

I spent 5 years in Lincoln Park (Chicago neighborhood), and have been in a Chicagoland suburb for the last few months. I also lived in Minneapolis before moving to Chicago, so this all should at least mean that I have some clue what I'm talking about...



One nice thing about Chicago is that it's far enough North that there typically isn't sleet/freezing rain in the equation. The main roads are well maintained, though side streets may take a day to clear after heavy snowfall. Maybe less relevant based on where you need to drive... avoid Lake Shore Drive when there's heavy snow. Lake effect snow typically affects Indiana more so than Chicago, though it's unpredictable. A few years ago, the fire department had to use snow mobiles to rescue people, and then those people's cars needed to be lifted out with heavy machinery. This is an extreme, but LSD is never a good option when it's snowing.



The practice of "warming your engine" before you drive anywhere is good intention that doesn't always work out well. The motivation has more to do with getting oils/fluids to proper operating temperature, rather than battery charge concerns. Yes - your engine will warm this way, but you also want your transmission to warm before you put it under too much strain/load. In colder weather, this comes from actually driving your car. The key will be to drive less aggressively, until your car is warmed up.

Regarding your battery, it won't be uncommon to lose some charge in colder weather (while sitting). Couple days shouldn't be an issue. More than a week of sitting, then I'd consider trickle charging your battery in your garage. Definitely keep jumper cables in your car. If you're in the city and a cab driver doesn't have a fare, you ask them for a jump (they're supposed to oblige, and it's worked for me the one time I needed it for my fiancee's car).

4WD + all-season tires with good winter rating should do just fine for most conditions. I only found winter tires necessary for my M3's.

I agree with others that it will help to find an empty parking lot, and learn how your vehicle reacts in the snow. Good rule of thumb is to leave extra room between you and the car in front, to allow your vehicle to brake in a controlled manner.

I'd also keep a scraper (for your windshield), extra gloves, and a warm hat in your car.



General advice... Avoid 290 in the snow (or any bad weather, often best to just avoid anyway... you'll understand after you've driven it a few times), Chicagoland drivers are fairly aggressive, and pedestrians and bicyclists (in Chicago) have a death wish.

I'd get your wife some winter tires for her Honda Fit, and it might be worth getting AAA for the first year that you're here. The AAA is probably overkill, but at least it will provide some confidence as she settles in. Regarding her car type/size, I wouldn't worry about it. Most city cab drivers get around in in some sort of hybrid vehicle (e.g., Prius, Camry), and they're just fine through the winter.

One last note, if you're going to actually live and work in Chicago (rather than suburbs), you're going to find that you often won't need to drive. Cabs and public transportation are plentiful. The L and city buses are quite safe and clean, and there are routes that will get you pretty much anywhere in the city and surrounding neighborhoods. If you're in the suburbs, check to see if you have a Metra train nearby.

If you have any other questions about living in Chicago, feel free to shoot me a PM.

Could not have said to better myself. LAKE EFFECT SUCKS! Anyone around the Great Lakes will tell you that. Been in Western NY my whole life and I have never owned Winter Tires. Good All seasons are just fine and not driving like and A-hole too.