Need help pulling the trigger on suspension

[RaginTxn84]

So after reading a lot of posts on suspension, I want to go with bilstein 5100 shocks (currently can get them quite a bit cheaper on autoanything), and the toytec front and rear coils (OME 884/Toytec Superflex - I believe these are eibachs?) (Part no. FJ3-FRCC-DR).

I'm looking at 2.5" up front and 2" rear. Frankly the squishiness of the OEM suspension is driving me nuts, and everyone seems to say this set up improves off and on road quite a bit.

I just want to know if I'm missing anything to make sure the truck is still drivable (mechanical parts/pieces) - ie, do I need UCAs now with that much lift, or am I good for the time being? Would wheel spacers be needed/highly recommend at this time? Also, I will eventually go with 285s (either 17s or 18s), but not at least for a good number of months (fall time) - just bought a new set of tires for my wife's van and just had our 3rd son a month ago... no ahi mucho dinero

Thanks for the input and help - in a week or two I'll be posting my "1-3-5" build plan and open for comment on that as well.

Thanks again!

 

[DRICHEY]

Mailman just delivered my 5100's & rear spacer today, installing tomorrow! Its a good start. Ill post specs when i finish. After wheels and tires I'm going with OME front coils and SuperFlex rears.

 

[RaginTxn84]

Also - what is the differential drop kit for (says needed for 4WD models)? Will I need the OME FJ REAR TRIM SPACER?

thanks again for the help!

 

[1engineer]

First, you never need wheel spacers unless the wheel you have is hitting the caliper or other components. Most buy them just to "toughen their stance" whatever that means lol. A function of form instead of function if you prefer.

Many here have performed the lift you are getting without aftermarket UCA's and they were able to get it aligned just fine and the road feel was good for them. Others have had issues getting the correct caster and had to go with aftermarket UCA's. Some of this was a function of crappy alignment shops and techs not knowing how to properly align this vehicle. There is a myth floating around that persists in the fact that your caster has to be +4. That is not true. My caster is around +2.5 and that is within spec and the vehicle feels good and stable. I personally would do the lift, get it aligned with the stock UCA's, make sure it is within spec (the alignment guy will have the spec) and see how it feels. If it is terribly twitchy and feels unstable and the caster is maxed out you might have to go to aftermarket UCA's.

The diff drop kit is not usually needed under 3" and you can read many threads on that by doing a simple search. Good luck.

 

[RaginTxn84]

First, you never need wheel spacers unless the wheel you have is hitting the caliper or other components. Most buy them just to "toughen their stance" whatever that means lol. A function of form instead of function if you prefer.

Many here have performed the lift you are getting without aftermarket UCA's and they were able to get it aligned just fine and the road feel was good for them. Others have had issues getting the correct caster and had to go with aftermarket UCA's. Some of this was a function of crappy alignment shops and techs not knowing how to properly align this vehicle. There is a myth floating around that persists in the fact that your caster has to be +4. That is not true. My caster is around +2.5 and that is within spec and the vehicle feels good and stable. I personally would do the lift, get it aligned with the stock UCA's, make sure it is within spec (the alignment guy will have the spec) and see how it feels. If it is terribly twitchy and feels unstable and the caster is maxed out you might have to go to le search. Good luck.

Thanks Greg! I was hoping you would show up and that our "debate" about CAIs didn't scare you off (btw - you mentioned that the gain numbers are not specific to a make or model - I caught this on K&N's web page of their dyno test on an FJ - claims 12.18 hp gain http://www.knfilters.com/dynocharts/63-9034-10_dyno.pdf; further article explaining the claim http://www.knfilters.com/news/news.aspx?id=2906 - I look forward to your comments op2: - I can move this part of my comment back to the intake thread if needs be)

Thanks for the great info (especially the caster and diff drop) - as always I look to much of your wisdom for things mechanical :hail:

Only question on the wheel spacers - as you said, I figured it was more for a "tough look" or to give more space away from the inside of the wheel well; but just from a theoretical point - would adding the spacers increase over all stability (widening the stance), or would it not be enough to make a difference in this case?

Thanks again for your help and input!

 

[1engineer]

Thanks Greg! I was hoping you would show up and that our "debate" about CAIs didn't scare you off (btw - you mentioned that the gain numbers are not specific to a make or model - I caught this on K&N's web page of their dyno test on an FJ - claims 12.18 hp gain http://www.knfilters.com/dynocharts/63-9034-10_dyno.pdf; further article explaining the claim 2010 and 2011 Toyota FJ Cruiser and 4 Runner Get 12 HP with Easy to Install Air Intake - I look forward to your comments op2: - I can move this part of my comment back to the intake thread if needs be)

Thanks for the great info (especially the caster and diff drop) - as always I look to much of your wisdom for things mechanical :hail:

Only question on the wheel spacers - as you said, I figured it was more for a "tough look" or to give more space away from the inside of the wheel well; but just from a theoretical point - would adding the spacers increase over all stability (widening the stance), or would it not be enough to make a difference in this case?

Thanks again for your help and input!

What type of intake is on a stock 2010 FJ? Is it set up like ours?

Yes, the spacers would nominally increase stability. They also will decrease efficiency at highway speeds (wheels further out in the airflow) and decrease front bearing life. Enough to matter much? Probably not but there have been several here that have had wheel bearing failures though. To some the look is the most important part and they will sacrifice performance for a look.

 

[Bad_Influence]

i would avoid wheel spacers if you can, many wheel options will give you a great stance if you get them with the right offset. -6 to -12 (with 4.5 inches of backspacing) should give you a descent stance to start with before considering wheel spacers. Also, those bilstein's are really popular on this forum, I would only recommend those if you weren't planning on doing any serious off-roading, light off-roading would be no problem.

As far as the uca's go, i've learned not to chime in on that subject anymore, the locals will refer you to older threads and take offense that you didn't do all the research yourself before asking us. Don't worry about a diff drop kit with that setup btw, anyway Good luck!

 

[Okki]

RE: Diff Drop.

I'm running a Icon Stage 6 and when [MENTION=99235]Scott@Hightech[/MENTION] installed it, he pointed out how it's not needed. It's been laying in a parts pile in my garage ever since.

Same as Greg said. Do the install, check the axle/shaft angles and go from there.

Okki

 

[Lenny33]

Why not do the diff drop while you are under the vehicle and already have dirt in your face and scratched up knuckles? Pretty cheap part from Toytec and pretty easy install. I figured the more in line I could keep my CVs the better.

 

[RaginTxn84]

As far as the uca's go, i've learned not to chime in on that subject anymore, the locals will refer you to older threads and take offense that you didn't do all the research yourself before asking us...

haha - yeah, I've been reading threads and seeing what everyone else has done. Basically I never saw anything definite with "when you should use UCAs." Everything ranging from 2" to 3", some people putting them on just cause they wanted to redo the whole set up, etc. My concern was the mechanical operation and safety of driving the truck because I will eventually replace them. However, I now feel that question has been answered thanks to greg.

What type of intake is on a stock 2010 FJ? Is it set up like ours?

I was looking at FJs before I ended up going with the 4R, and from what I remember they were the same - just found this: (http://www.wordplop.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/toyota-fj-cruiser-engine-bay-2.jpg)

Yes, the spacers would nominally increase stability. They also will decrease efficiency at highway speeds (wheels further out in the airflow) and decrease front bearing life. Enough to matter much? Probably not but there have been several here that have had wheel bearing failures though. To some the look is the most important part and they will sacrifice performance for a look.

:iagree:
Yeah - forgot about the aerodynamics of keep the wheels in - good point. Especially about the wheel bearings - I much prefer performance over simply looks. Bad_I - good point on the wheel off-sets.

Also, those bilstein's are really popular on this forum, I would only recommend those if you weren't planning on doing any serious off-roading, light off-roading would be no problem.

Yeah I'm not looking to conquer any undiscovered country or anything, but rather something that I could use to take on some easy/medium type trails. Something to boost off-road and on-road confidence - and from what everyone kept saying about this set up, seems to be exactly what I'm looking for. :bigok:

 

[CatskillsRunner]

Auto Anything & Toytec

Hi there,
Be aware that Auto Anything might not have the 5100s. They might show them in stock then you might wait for 4 weeks, as I did. I ended up cancelling the order. I got really hung up on the fact that a few folks on this forum recommended a certain part number for the 5100s, and I finally got sick of waiting and called Toytec and asked why they were selling a different part than some folks here were saying our 4Runners needed.
Miles (think I got the name right) assured me that Toytec pulled the shocks apart and could see no reason why they couldnt use the same ones they always had from Bilstein, insteadgof stocking a bunch of 2010+. Thus the different part number. I was in the same boat as you but I pulled the front spacer I had and installed Light Racing UCAs along with the new shocks. I LOVE it. What a difference. Rides so much nicer than stock (I am kdss-less). But there are some risks to the after market UCAs which I'm sure you'll see after reading a bit. For me, it was about how well it drove. It is still not a Corvette, but it is pretty friggin sweet.
Good luck!

 

[RaginTxn84]

Hi there,
... I got really hung up on the fact that a few folks on this forum recommended a certain part number for the 5100s, and I finally got sick of waiting and called Toytec and asked why they were selling a different part than some folks here were saying our 4Runners needed.
...

I was in the same boat as you but I pulled the front spacer I had and installed Light Racing UCAs along with the new shocks. I LOVE it. What a difference. Rides so much nicer than stock (I am kdss-less). But there are some risks to the after market UCAs which I'm sure you'll see after reading a bit. For me, it was about how well it drove. It is still not a Corvette, but it is pretty friggin sweet.
Good luck!

Thanks for your feedback/experience with the UCAs!

Alright - so here are the part numbers that I am finding:

autoanything:
Bilstein 5100 Series Shocks
5100 Series - RearVehicle2010 Toyota 4RunnerSubmodelWith rear 0"- 2" lift
AutoAnything SKU 3766012
Part Number 33-187174

Bilstein 5100 Series Shocks
5100 Series - Front Ride Height Adjustable ShockVehicle2010 Toyota 4RunnerSubmodelLifts vehicle from 0"- 2.5"
AutoAnything SKU 3819389
Part Number 24-196499

carid:
Bilstein® 17174048 - 0"-2.5" 5100 Series Ride Height Adjustable Front Leveling Shock
24-196499

Bilstein® 17174049 - 5100 Series Rear Shock
33-187174

I did not see a part number for toytec other than the following: FJ4RBILK - but I believe that is just their SKU.

wanna make sure I'm getting the right items - let me know if those are correct - thanks!

 

[CatskillsRunner]

The 1964... shocks are the ones AutoAnything will say they have but don't. I can't recall the Toytec part number I went with. I would just call them if you want to go that route. Best, Kristy

 

[RaginTxn84]

Suspension Update

So I went and bough the 5100 front and rear shocks last week. Just got an email that the rears were shipped yesterday. The fronts should be shipped hopefully by the end of this week.

Kristy - yeah, I ended up going with AA - couldn't pass up the cost savings that I was getting from them over everyone else. Plus it's helping me space out the next part of the purchase - the springs :frog:

Also, after doing a little more research per B_I - if I need new UCAs, I'll be going with the LR UCAs - so we'll see how it goes.

Also - didn't see a response about the OME Rear Trim kit - will I need this or will the springs be adjusted for the driver's side extra weight?

Again - thank you for your help!