Octanejunkie's T4R project - 99 SR5 4WD 5-speed

[octanejunkie]

I’m trying to plan ahead accordingly gearing wise also. I definitely don’t want to do it twice. Both of you have manual transmissions though. My Automatic is geared a lot differently looking at the Grimm jeeper calculator.

Decisions decisions…..I wonder if I just go whole hog down the road to financial ruin and step into an atlas? Gets me into 2 choices of low range and away from making the extra sticks work. Would be spendy, but it definitely solves the packaging issue. Mmmm.

That was all about my musings around MCs taco Box, you can do dual cases using any of the kits out there like NWFab, etc.

I am still considering going that route with 4.88s to net a final double-low drive of 96:1 in first gear (vs 46:1 now) but again, doesn't affect my freeway RPM/ mpg situation

The big question is what do you want your rig optimized for?



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[habanero]

Double low is nice for the rare times I need it, but high/low is so much better than stock low with the stick...nice to not have to juggle the pedals on certain obstacles. My husband went with the NWF EcoCrawler, the gearing isn't as low as the Taco Box.

 

[Romeo1]

Double low is nice for the rare times I need it, but high/low is so much better than stock low with the stick...nice to not have to juggle the pedals on certain obstacles. My husband went with the NWF EcoCrawler, the gearing isn't as low as the Taco Box.

Is there a write up or a build thread on the eco crawler? Thanks!

 

[sleepydad]

Is there a write up or a build thread on the eco crawler? Thanks!

there is a pretty good set of instructions on their site.

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0...nstallation_Manual_-_VF2_R06.pdf?v=1660256907

they also have some video's but its all on facebook and it's just my personal problem but I can't use facebook, I just can't touch that site. it makes my fingers catch on fire.

I have said this before and I will say it again, I would love to put a second transfer box under my truck because low is not quite low enough.

However having to build my own by salvaging parts from other cases... I would totally screw it up and destroy the 2000$ worth of shiny new parts. it does require very specific knollege, you have to grind things to fit and... yea like I said it does not look hard but... 100% I would mess it up.

it's really too bad they don't sell completed cases.

 

[Team_Jake]

[MENTION=643801]Romeo1[/MENTION] I've got a NWFab box + triple shifters. The install instructions they provide do a pretty good job detailing everything. The nice thing about the install was that it only required basic garage tools, no presses or anything like that. The only "special" tool needed was a 3 jaw puller but they are available at AutoZone through their free tool rental program. I did need to buy a set of crowfoot open end wrenches to get the top two bolts mated to the transmission though, probably possible without them though.

 

[Team_Jake]

[MENTION=95183]octanejunkie[/MENTION] you install your coilovers yet?

 

[T4topher]

there is a pretty good set of instructions on their site.

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0...nstallation_Manual_-_VF2_R06.pdf?v=1660256907

they also have some video's but its all on facebook and it's just my personal problem but I can't use facebook, I just can't touch that site. it makes my fingers catch on fire.

I have said this before and I will say it again, I would love to put a second transfer box under my truck because low is not quite low enough.

However having to build my own by salvaging parts from other cases... I would totally screw it up and destroy the 2000$ worth of shiny new parts. it does require very specific knollege, you have to grind things to fit and... yea like I said it does not look hard but... 100% I would mess it up.

it's really too bad they don't sell completed cases.

It’s really not as tough as you’re making it out to be, it’s one of those things that is hard to grasp until you start tearing down the old gear driven tcase. The video I made with Sean is pretty thorough on building the tcase. I did just see a few weeks ago marlin had built tacobox’s for sale on their website btw..

[MENTION=95183]octanejunkie[/MENTION] maybe instead of worrying about regearing the 4.88’s just go to 35” tires . Unless your worried about mpgs I guess that wouldn’t help much in that case lol.

 

[octanejunkie]

[MENTION=95183]octanejunkie[/MENTION] you install your coilovers yet?

Not yet, I've been following my "one change at a time" process and am ready to add the coils once I weld in the eimkeith coil tower top plate reinforcements.

I think the next mod after that will be new rear springs (861), reservoir shocks and OSR

BTW, [MENTION=177008]Team_Jake[/MENTION] I added you to Built Not Bought on FB, a few guys there need your F150 fuel pump kit

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[octanejunkie]

Is there a write up or a build thread on the eco crawler? Thanks!

[MENTION=71960]JohnMc[/MENTION] has a write up somewhere, perhaps on TW

Here's his most excellent aux gas tank thread tho:
Auxiliary tank install on 99 4Runner
[MENTION=5345]habanero[/MENTION] can probably point us to the dual case section of his build thread

 

[octanejunkie]

It’s really not as tough as you’re making it out to be, it’s one of those things that is hard to grasp until you start tearing down the old gear driven tcase. The video I made with Sean is pretty thorough on building the tcase. I did just see a few weeks ago marlin had built tacobox’s for sale on their website btw..

[MENTION=95183]octanejunkie[/MENTION] maybe instead of worrying about regearing the 4.88’s just go to 35” tires . Unless your worried about mpgs I guess that wouldn’t help much in that case lol.

I'm not looking to chop metal to fit 35s, yet...

I scored a set of FJ80 16x8 rims I'm considering for larger, MT meats...

 

[JohnMc]

[MENTION=71960]JohnMc[/MENTION] has a write up somewhere, perhaps on TW

Here's his most excellent aux gas tank thread tho:
Auxiliary tank install on 99 4Runner

[MENTION=5345]habanero[/MENTION] can probably point us to the dual case section of his build thread

I may have put a post or two in her build thread over there on Yotatech. I don't really have a build thread.

The one thing I really didn't expect on the NWF Ecocrawler was how far apart I'd have to take the rear donor case. I knew the middle one would have to come about as far apart as one comes, since you're just using the planetary gears (and a few other minor parts) in a new case. And I assumed the rear case pretty much just bolted on in fairly stock/as-is configuration.

But nope, the rear case needs to have the input shaft replaced on the planetary cluster. So really, that case needs to come even MORE apart than the middle case does, since you're pulling the planetary cluster apart to replace that input shaft. It just then goes back together in the original case again.

I've been driving the Ecocrawler around about 6 months now, including our usual 2 week Colorado/Utah trip. Where the doubler was AWESOME. We're doing difficult trails out there now (6 or 7 on the Moab 1-10 scale), and they're both 5-spd trucks. The lower gear ratios are REALLY great when you get into the bigger/rougher obstacles. Before it was a matter of slipping the clutch a lot (not a good practice when you're out in the middle of nowhere), or just feathering the throttle to keep 1000 rpm going in 1st gear/low range, and bashing through/over faster than you'd want to. Now with 1st gear/low/low range the truck is CREEPING, more than slow enough for pretty much anything (I'd usually use a higher gear even on gnarly stuff back in Elephant Hill). Nice, slow, controlled creeping. And even going down really steep stuff, creeping down in 1st/lo/lo is slower and more in control than neutral/brakes. The brakes can lock up and slide independently of each other, less controlled than all of them rotating together. Even going down STEEP stuff, the engine braking was all it needed, no need to touch the brakes.

 

[octanejunkie]

Thanks [MENTION=71960]JohnMc[/MENTION] I've become a big fan of not using brakes, favoring my lower gears in 4 lo - and most trails we have done I rarely use 1st gear going up, but those rock ledges... those are what make me want lo/lo - even if it were 2.28 second lo

I really hate the idea of bumping it, slipping the clutch or sending it - I favor slow and controlled

Yes, the taco box was very tempting, and if it were 2.57 vs 4.7 I would have bought it. I just don't need 200:1 as far as I know

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[JohnMc]

Yeah, in theory there's a niche of (slow) speeds where the 4.7 by itself might be a little better than the 2.57 or the doubled 2.57 (6.6). But in reality, it's fairly indiscernible. There's some overlap between 3/4/5 in one range and 1/2/3 in the next range up, but really, you just pull one lever when you're into it, and pull the other when you're REALLY into it. No real need to have 4 ratios and shift out of one low and into another.

And the 12(ish) low/low with the 2.57 and 4.7 together really is getting into a party trick realm. Out on the trail, the 6.6 really is about as slow as you practically need to go, even over the biggest obstacles.

 

[octanejunkie]

And the 12(ish) low/low with the 2.57 and 4.7 together really is getting into a party trick realm. Out on the trail, the 6.6 really is about as slow as you practically need to go, even over the biggest obstacles.

Exactly, I see myself using double lo in literally first and second gear at the most. If I had a 6 speed with a 6:1 first gear and could start in 2nd most days, 4:1, then I'd never use first unless facing an unnavigable obstacle, and probably be all set.

I like the idea of lo/lo but not 3 sticks, persay

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[JZiggy]

Is there currently a way to get to ~4.7 reduction with a single tcase? That's how my 88 is setup and with 33's it's awesome -- I rarely want to go slower, even in the rocks.

 

[octanejunkie]

Is there currently a way to get to ~4.7 reduction with a single tcase? That's how my 88 is setup and with 33's it's awesome -- I rarely want to go slower, even in the rocks.

Calling Marlin Crawler today to find out

Might be easier to SAS the rig and swap trans and TC with an R1FA and 4.7 gears

 

[JohnMc]

Is there currently a way to get to ~4.7 reduction with a single tcase? That's how my 88 is setup and with 33's it's awesome -- I rarely want to go slower, even in the rocks.

The chain drive t-cases have a planetary reduction gearset, and that's way too many parts needed to change a ratio for any shop to engineer, fabricate, and then sell at a price anyone would want to pay.

MC sells the 4.7 gearsets for $800, that's two gears and some stock replacement parts (counter shaft, bearings).

The planetary gearset would need an input shaft (has the sun gear on it), 4 planet gears, a ring gear (???), and the cage that holds the planet gears would need to be replaced as well.

 

[octanejunkie]

The chain drive t-cases have a planetary reduction gearset, and that's way too many parts needed to change a ratio for any shop to engineer, fabricate, and then sell at a price anyone would want to pay.



MC sells the 4.7 gearsets for $800, that's two gears and some stock replacement parts (counter shaft, bearings).



The planetary gearset would need an input shaft (has the sun gear on it), 4 planet gears, a ring gear (???), and the cage that holds the planet gears would need to be replaced as well.

There are a few pickup/T100 transfer cases with driver side front outputs but not sure what it would take to adapt to an R150F...

I've not really hit the limits of my current setup/ gearing, so this is really a theoretical conversation at this point

 

[JZiggy]

The chain drive t-cases have a planetary reduction gearset, and that's way too many parts needed to change a ratio for any shop to engineer, fabricate, and then sell at a price anyone would want to pay.

MC sells the 4.7 gearsets for $800, that's two gears and some stock replacement parts (counter shaft, bearings).

The planetary gearset would need an input shaft (has the sun gear on it), 4 planet gears, a ring gear (???), and the cage that holds the planet gears would need to be replaced as well.

Gotcha. For some reason I thought there was a complete gear-driven tcase that would drop in to replace the chain driven one.

Shoot, $800? I bought my 4.7 kit from Trail Gear for like $200 back in 2012! Don't tell me inflation's only 10%

 

[T4topher]

[MENTION=95183]octanejunkie[/MENTION] just a heads up you can setup a Marlin dual tcase to have 2.26 gears instead of 4.7’s. That’s what I did originally in the video Sean and I made. But in the end I did switch over to 4.7’s. Not a huge noticeable difference but it is a tad bit slower. I actually have the input gear to switch the 2.26 gears to 23 spline if you end up going that route (adapts the gear drive tcase to 3rd gen transmission) lmk. I think the gear drives are 2.26 ratio, don’t quote me on that lol.

Edit: maybe they are 2.28’s like you stated above.