Official 4Runner VS Raptor - Apples VS Oranges Thread

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I'm kind of a flavor of the week guy,or 100k mile type guy, which ever comes first. 80k on my 16 TRDP.


..... this. I used to do every 2-2.5 years. Then 3ish. I've worked my way to going 4 this time... but it'll go before 100K. Which is so stupid, cuz these will live for so long. *sigh*. No way a Raptor. Not practical in my life (in any shape, form, or fashion). But another Runner? (Would be #4)... not sure. If I'm in another position job-wise, I may try something new & different. If I'm still doing the same role, it'll prob be another Runner. Cannot afford to lose the practicality, reliability, and all-around utility for family & work.

I, for one, am enjoying the thread. It's fun to see opinions on both even though they are two very different tools IMO.





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Most 4Runners never see dirt either, what's your point?

It's a truck, with 4 doors, a hell of a lot of towing capacity, it's just tuned to handle the desert in a way that no Toyota comes from the factory or can compete with unless you start gutting the truck and caging it.

The first Gen is entirely different than the 2nd Gen, and even Gen 1 owners will kind of lower their head since the Gen 2 was built from the ground up to be an off road monster.

The Raptors never got stuck in a variety of technical, rocky, silt, beach, etc, the only one that got stuck was in silt, and the driver took a crappy line and lifted at the wrong moment and got stuck, but so did a jeep and so did a tundra.

As for towing? They tow great. As for MPG, with a 36gal tank they get 18-21mpg even on 37s and that was factoring in offroad.

They don't add the mechanical complexity of a 3rd party super charger for like 8K dollars either, but please, tell me about value.

And to the other poster, I didn't bring my trailer on this trip, why would I bring my trailer on that trip?

For all the guys chirping about reliability, to suggest a chevy is pretty laughable. Admittedly the ZR2 looks and is very cool, but it's about the same size as a Tacoma inside, and the Tacoma is very small inside.

The Raptor could haul my motorcycle around, my dog, and pull my XV3 trailer, with ease.

If Toyota ever pulls its head out of its ass that'd be awesome. Instead of putting on hipster bullshit like Hotel Tacoma they could I don't know...hire actual off road enthusiasts to the TRD team and make cool shit again, instead of soccer mom vehicles. There's a reason why they keep losing market segments.

Don't be fooled... These trucks are neat, but the use case is so narrow. It's one of the most misunderstood vehicle on the market.

To use it for what it is made for will destroy it. It inspires too much confidence at speed offroad, but the reality is that high speed and offroad don't mix well for most people. It's mainly a race team activity where the course is well understood. Most raptors never see any dirt and those that do often end up with bent frames and broken suspension ... it's not the trucks fault.. It just allows the unskilled driver to push into territory that will break just about anything. The only real use case for them is a well understood course or a very experienced desert driver. Otherwise, any other vehicle will serve the same purpose. Because you really need to be pushing the speed to take advantage of what it is.

Also, they don't do general off-roading well. Rocks, mud, narrow trails are miserable in them. The wheelbase is huge and thus the turning radius. Horrible breakover angles. The base weight is pretty much 6k pounds which creates a lot of ground pressure and sinking. I don't own one, but have a few friends that do own first gens and they readily admit it is not built for typical offroading and they actually own Toyotas or Jeeps for that.

If you are looking for something new.... Take a look at the zr2. That is much more do it all with updated tech to match. And the price is about 20k less making it a great value. The avg buyer will utilize the capabilities of the zr2... not the raptor. And when I say capability... I'm talking speed not ability to go from point A to point B in mixed terrain conditions. The zr2 and 4runner will both crush the raptor in that department.

The raptor use to be OK for towing.. but the new ones probably get extremely bad mpg in those conditions. I have not seen any test.. but small gas motors with turbos don't do well for towing in terms of efficiency.

It's just such narrow focused truck... Go check it out.. but make sure to think about how you will use it. Lots of time running baja.. it might be for you. Somehow I'm guessing that is not the case though.
 
And to the other poster, I didn't bring my trailer on this trip, why would I bring my trailer on that trip?

I'm saying it's built for overlanding and your trying to compete with vehicles that are designed from the ground up to race Baja to a certain level. If your trying to race, maybe try removing half the gadgets you installed.

I hear you ***** about TRD, funny most everyone on here knows this and it's been said many times over on other threads that TRD is mostly an appearance package. I hear enough people say to buy a Trail and upgrade from there.

I know very little about racing, but I have friends who own shops and do that and not one of them bought a Raptor like vehicle. They bought a vehicle, swap motors and the like.
 
I'm saying it's built for overlanding and your trying to compete with vehicles that are designed from the ground up to race Baja to a certain level. If your trying to race, maybe try removing half the gadgets you installed.

I hear you ***** about TRD, funny most everyone on here knows this and it's been said many times over on other threads that TRD is mostly an appearance package. I hear enough people say to buy a Trail and upgrade from there.

I know very little about racing, but I have friends who own shops and do that and not one of them bought a Raptor like vehicle. They bought a vehicle, swap motors and the like.

And I'm saying I realized my needs changed. Get it through your skulls that I'm admitting my needs changed after this trip, and I want a pickup truck. Good god damn.

It wasn't a race, it was keeping pace. I wonder how many people on this forum have even driven a Gen 2 raptor, before blowing hot air out of their suck holes.

Sigh. This forum...
 
FFS lawndart, go buy a raptor already. So we don't have to hear about snorkels, baja, or *****ing about toyota reliability with 1 ton of extra parts and a stock 4 liter engine.

just make sure it'll fit in your parking garage
 
I can't believe this comparison even exists. The proper comparison should be between the raptor and the worlds most inadequate pickup, the toyota "i still have drum brakes" tacoma shitbox
 
Oh I'm no Fanboy, I don't hold allegiance to anything except God and the USA!
But reading my posts I could understand where the thought is.

Lawndart your build has been a good one to read and follow. I think you have one of the nicest 4Runner around and I wish you luck on your purchase.

Edit: Read post 16 in this thread. You talk about race vehicles.
 
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And I'm saying I realized my needs changed. Get it through your skulls that I'm admitting my needs changed after this trip, and I want a pickup truck. Good god damn.

It wasn't a race, it was keeping pace. I wonder how many people on this forum have even driven a Gen 2 raptor, before blowing hot air out of their suck holes.

Sigh. This forum...
Spoken by one of the biggest hot air blowing suck holes I have ever seen. :hello:
 
And you've resorted to personal attacks. lol.

And this thread has hit it's zenith.

I don't want to go personal..kind of feel a little bad about that. Just throwing back at you a little of what you dish out constantly. What's the difference from generalizing a group vs pointing someone out who keeps insulting everyone and everything this forum focuses on..


You bash people for doing SAS, you bash people for going to FJ summit, you bash people for wanting a supercharger on their 5th gen....
Heck, you bring up legal action against Toyota for displaying a picture of your truck at an internal event.... You obviously don't like to operate with low resistance....

That is your choice.. but if you are going to dish it out... be prepared to take it once in a while.

You also seem to do quite a bit of smack talking outside of this forum BTW.. saw a few FB posts were you were talking some serious smack.

We are all different. There is no one size fits all. Experience teaches us many things, but sometimes just getting back to simplicity is best.
 
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I don't want to go personal..kind of feel a little bad about that.

No you don't. Be honest.

Forums continue to be where intelligent discussion of practical applications goes to die. And as a result there's a reason why they keep chasing off smart people, and yet here we are, at least for a little while longer.

Back to the raptor, it's almost assuredly true that everyone here has a 4Runner, I wish people would test drive a raptor before they offered an opinion.

ETA: You know what, I really don't care, I think Raptors are cool, I think Jeeps are cool, I think Toyotas are rad when they're being used by people who don't sit there giving a shit about forums like this. This thread was created to compare an SUV and a race truck, which is an absurd comparison when you get right down to it.
 
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Heck, you bring up legal action against Toyota for displaying a picture of your truck at an internal event.... You obviously don't like to operate with low resistance....

Okay now we're gonna get personal here, champ. Toyota used my photography at the Chicago Auto Show, that's not an internal event. That's an international car show.
 
Okay now we're gonna get personal here, champ. Toyota used my photography at the Chicago Auto Show, that's not an internal event. That's an international car show.

Sorry, I remember you saying it was internal...my mistake I guess. I could go dig up the thread but I will take your word for it.

Whatever the case.. you are opinionated and like to take a stance.... and that is OK... I'm not against that, but you have to realize you dish out a lot of smack talk with your opinions.. Which I'm sure you would readily admit.. .change over time, because your experience is limited to a pretty small slice of time... All of us find new needs.... thus the reason why I try not to talk a bunch of smack. I learned a long time ago, it comes right back around.

I apologize for turning this into more of a pissing match.. Your hot air/suck holes comment just offended me and I felt like dishing a little of it back at you. We can see where that went.

Back on topic.
 
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I'm opinionated but I'll back it up with putting my money where my mouth is.

You can't do a major trip where you find the limits of your vehicle and not come away asking some really hard questions about what you've doubled down on as far as investments.

I'm not dogmatic in my beliefs, and I change opinions like the wind changes directions, because when you're presented with in your face evidence it's hard to make new value judgements.

If people can't take someone talking smack about their sacred cows negatively, then they have too much invested in something. I don't consider my 4Runner to be a waste of time or money, I've pushed it as far as I think it'll go, and I either need to fix it up to pre-Baja status, or sell it and find something better.

I think everyone should take their rigs out and find the limit of how well they work. And if the vehicle doesn't suit their needs any more...get something else. Life is too short to think that buying a car is like being in a marriage.
 
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I'm opinionated but I'll back it up with putting my money where my mouth is.

You can't do a major trip where you find the limits of your vehicle and not come away asking some really hard questions about what you've doubled down on as far as investments.

I'm not dogmatic in my beliefs, and I change opinions like the wind changes directions, because when you're presented with in your face evidence it's hard to make new value judgements.

If people can't take someone talking smack about their sacred cows negatively, then they have too much invested in something. I don't consider my 4Runner to be a waste of time or money, I've pushed it as far as I think it'll go, and I either need to fix it up to pre-Baja status, or sell it and find something better.

I think everyone should take their rigs out and find the limit of how well they work. And if the vehicle doesn't suit their needs any more...get something else. Life is too short to think that buying a car is like being in a marriage.
I don't really understand that last line...
 
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