Oil Pump Preference for 3.4

[19963.4lsr5]

Next oil change I’m running Rotella T6 5w40.

Hopefully Monday I can get the oil pressure gauge installed and see what’s going on. I may be worried over nothing. However, I never in my life had an engine that didn’t build adequate oil pressure with the starter. I am not interested in getting another starter to compare rpm’s. I’m sure a new starter will spin the engine faster......it’s got new contacts in it and I’m not interested in rebuilding the gear side of the starter (to get more rpm out of it) just to see if that’s my problem. And sadly there is a good chance that’s it.

All I really need is a 12v liquid solenoid valve and I can install my 3qt engine pre-luber. They are around 20 dollars. Of coarse finding a place to mount the cylinder will be fun.

Hooked up to the ignition circuit the valve will open and dump the pressurized oil from the cylinder into the main oil galley. Then I hit the starter.


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[Dieselchessy]

Did you prefill the oil filter and oil cooler before install. They both hold a bit of oil, so if empty you'd have needed to crank for a bit to fill them up and pressurize.

I like a paper gasket on the pickup tube, but I add a skim of RTV and Loctite on the bolts. O-rings cook and turn hard. Glued and screwed has never let me down.

I'm interested in your rebuild. Did you turn anything or just put in new standard bearings? Did you mic it all out or plasti-gauge it to see what clearances were?

I've got a 5vz I just pulled with 211K on it and a blown head gasket. Thinking I'll replace bearings, rings, hone cylinders, and have the heads reworked and slap it back together, assuming everything measures within spec. Sade tree rebuild if you will.

 

[19963.4lsr5]

Did you prefill the oil filter and oil cooler before install. They both hold a bit of oil, so if empty you'd have needed to crank for a bit to fill them up and pressurize.



I like a paper gasket on the pickup tube, but I add a skim of RTV and Loctite on the bolts. O-rings cook and turn hard. Glued and screwed has never let me down.



I'm interested in your rebuild. Did you turn anything or just put in new standard bearings? Did you mic it all out or plasti-gauge it to see what clearances were?



I've got a 5vz I just pulled with 211K on it and a blown head gasket. Thinking I'll replace bearings, rings, hone cylinders, and have the heads reworked and slap it back together, assuming everything measures within spec. Sade tree rebuild if you will.

I pulled the ECU fuse and spent a long time turning the engine over trying to get the oil pressure light to go out and It never did. I said screw it and started it and light went off instantly at engine run.

My friend has been doing engines for years. From what I remember everything was in spec. Cylinders, pistons, mains and rod bearings. But, I’ve been doing engines long enough to know that something is not quite right. I’ve cheated on engine rebuilds with V8’s to know that skimping on replacing the cam bearings results in lower oil pressure than if they were replaced. And saying that overhead cams are not near the same. I hear zero noise etc.....just bugs me to not see the oil pressure light go out around the same time the engine starts.

Like I said before, my Cummins in my 94 Dodge Ram takes almost 5 seconds to build oil pressure. But it’s got an 18gpm oil pump and has to fill the Turbo first and then pump 3qts into the main oil galley if I don’t use it within 2 weeks of the last engine start.

My Cummins is why I bought the Moroso 3qt pre-lube cylinder, I never used it when I figured out that it was the norm for a mechanically injected 5.9 Cummins to build oil pressure.

My oil pressure light never comes on. It just takes a one-second-one count for the light to go out. I will get the pressure gauge installed Monday....Tuesday at the latest.


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[Dieselchessy]

Just for reference my 2006 5.9 with 140k and maybe 3500 on the oil. Needle starts climbing at cranking and took 4 seconds to climb to vertical (40) as verified by video.

Looked normal to me, as I recall my 96 5.9 did the same as does my dads 2003.

 

[19963.4lsr5]

Just for reference my 2006 5.9 with 140k and maybe 3500 on the oil. Needle starts climbing at cranking and took 4 seconds to climb to vertical (40) as verified by video.



Looked normal to me, as I recall my 96 5.9 did the same as does my dads 2003.

My 94 and my brothers 96 acted the same. I switched to the T6 5w40 and that made a difference over standard 15w40. You can hear the engine load a little when it builds pressure which corresponds to the needle rising.


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[skjos96]

New old user, I haven't been here in a long time because my 4runner just works and I haven't had too many issues to deal with until today. I would start a new thread, but because of my newbie status I cannot, and this thread discusses the flow of oil.

I was replacing my leaking valve cover gaskets and had a major screw up. I was cleaning the FIPG from the front drivers side half moon and thought it would be a good idea to plug the small hole just behind the half moon with a foam q-tip to keep the old seal from falling down the hole. It did keep the seal out, but the stupid q-tip fell down the hole and is nowhere to be seen.

The Hole of Doom

A similar q-tip, the one lost was round with a round shaft

Not my engine, but the next stop for the qtip. I can see the head surface through the little hole, but the q-tip must be farther down.

I'm an OK mechanic (timing belt, valve covers, etc), but digging deep into a engine is a little beyond my skill set.

My questions:
1) Where would the q-tip end up?
2) What is the best way to retrieve it?

 

[Dieselchessy]

Hopefully it’s a return drain to the oil pan.
I have one of those $40 inspection cameras from amazon that I use in times like yours. It WiFi’s to my phone for a display. Mines a DEPSTECH, but likely the same as many others.

But... my first move would be to drain the pan and hope the q-tip was in the pan and floated over the drain so I could grab it with pliers.

But... those motors have a real big splash guard(?) plate in them. It may get stuck on that and not make the bottom of the pan.

I also generally have my shop vac with a small tube tapped on the end. I vacuum out all those type holes after scraping gaskets, before removing spark plugs, ect...
Might be you could suck it up with a shop vac.

 

[19963.4lsr5]

I’m pretty sure that ended up down in the oil pan now


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[skjos96]

I have one of those inspection camera's as well, but it is too big for the hole by just a hair. I might be able to modify it.

I did find this oil-flow diagram, and it looks like its on the uptake side, probably stuck low in the main oil hole. I might be able to get to it if I remove the cylinder head, the diagram shows a bend before flowing into the crankshaft area so it might be sitting there. Those that have done a head gasket replacement - do you recall a bend in the engine block's main oil hole, or would this thing drop straight into the crank shaft area?

 

[skjos96]

The hole is approximately .300 diameter, too big for my .340 borescope. A quick trip to amazon and I have a .220 diameter borescope being delivered tomorrow.

 

[Dieselchessy]

Your hole shouldn’t be uptake. It would just blast oil at the valve cover. The uptakes should inject into the cam bearing journals.
Your hole should be a drain back for oil that oozes out the back of the rear cam bearing.
That diagram doesn’t show the drains.

 

[19963.4lsr5]

I installed the oil pressure gauge with the copper capillary tubing and had 10psi at idle after some driving. I’m going to Lancaster tomorrow so I’ll check it again when I get home.

Watching the gauge the oil builds pressure at the time the light goes out. About a second.

I left the gauge in the engine bay for now. I had to remove the alternator to hook everything up.


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[Dieselchessy]

10 PSI seems low to me.

 

[brillo_76]

10 PSI seems low to me.

FSM LU-1(5vz-fe)

At idle 4.3 psi or more
At 3k rpm ( 36-75psi)

So I am not quite following as 10psi at idle would be low.



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[Dieselchessy]

FSM LU-1(5vz-fe)

At idle 4.3 psi or more
At 3k rpm ( 36-75psi)

So I am not quite following as 10psi at idle would be low.



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Thank goodness I've never put a pressure gauge on a 5VZ. I'd of been scared. LOL

We've got a 1942 Ford 9N that runs about 12 at idle and 25 mid throttle, but that's the lowest I've seen on an engine for a hot idle pressure. My 22r's all ran 15+ for a hot idle pressure, but I tended to run 15w40 or 20w50 in those.

Now I want an oil pressure gauge, or maybe I don't. Ignorance is bliss as they say.

 

[brillo_76]

Thank goodness I've never put a pressure gauge on a 5VZ. I'd of been scared. LOL



We've got a 1942 Ford 9N that runs about 12 at idle and 25 mid throttle, but that's the lowest I've seen on an engine for a hot idle pressure. My 22r's all ran 15+ for a hot idle pressure, but I tended to run 15w40 or 20w50 in those.



Now I want an oil pressure gauge, or maybe I don't. Ignorance is bliss as they say.

Lol. I haven't seen a Toyota engine that had oil in the crankcase loose oil pressure yet because of how they designed the oil pumps. The 22R engine had 2 gears that the one was a worm gear for its oil pump. Could you lose it sure but when you would you have major crankshaft and main bearings issues as well so the engine would be junk.

Come to think of it I havent seen a oil pressure sending unit fail either. I am sure those will in time though.

[ just in close to 30 years of having and working on them]


You mostly can tell by the sound of the engine if you have oil pressure or not. As they like to let you know know of the impending failure.

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[19963.4lsr5]

.

Now I want an oil pressure gauge, or maybe I don't. Ignorance is bliss as they say.

Trust me when I say a part of me didn’t want to know what the oil pressure is/was. I don’t think The oil wasn’t fully up to temp after the 6-8 miles I drove it.


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[brillo_76]

Trust me when I say a part of me didn’t want to know what the oil pressure is/was. I don’t think The oil wasn’t fully up to temp after the 6-8 miles I drove it.


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I would say no at the temperatures we are currently at in PA. I posted the FSM guidelines for you so you will know soon enough.

Besides if your valves aren't sounding starved for oil you should have enough. [emoji14]



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[19963.4lsr5]

I would say no at the temperatures we are currently at in PA. I posted the FSM guidelines for you so you will know soon enough.

Besides if your valves aren't sounding starved for oil you should have enough. [emoji14]



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We have a mechanical valve train. No hydraulic lifters.




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[brillo_76]

We have a mechanical valve train. No hydraulic lifters.




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Very true but when you hear your valves tapping so hard they sound like they are coming through the cover. You know you have a problem. Toyota engines always were mechanical and when I changed the oil on a 22R. I could hear when the oil pressure hit the valvetrain after a fresh change a few seconds after start. The engine went quiet.

This may have changed in some of the newer engines now. I never looked into the newer engine styles.

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