Power window modification

[JZiggy]

[MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION] if I add a switch to energize the relay rather than bypass it I am concerned that it could cause a power draw. How much current do these little relays draw on the control side? Example if I press the button to put into camping mode and leave it all night will I have a problem?

 

[TheDurk]

[MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION] if I add a switch to energize the relay rather than bypass it I am concerned that it could cause a power draw. How much current do these little relays draw on the control side? Example if I press the button to put into camping mode and leave it all night will I have a problem?

No, not overnight. Not even close. I once had a Hella harness that was manufactured incorrectly and left my fog relay engaged 24/7. Truck still could go two weeks and then start. The coil will draw about 150mA, so in ten hours it will draw 1.5 amp-hours(Ah). A typical 24F battery for our trucks will run a capacity of 55 Ah, so to go to 50% will take 171 hours. Typical key-off drain for our rigs is about 50mA, so it is a bump, but not that big a deal.

 

[JZiggy]

No, not overnight. Not even close. I once had a Hella harness that was manufactured incorrectly and left my fog relay engaged 24/7. Truck still could go two weeks and then start. The coil will draw about 150mA, so in ten hours it will draw 1.5 amp-hours(Ah). A typical 24F battery for our trucks will run a capacity of 55 Ah, so to go to 50% will take 171 hours. Typical key-off drain for our rigs is about 50mA, so it is a bump, but not that big a deal.

Thanks Durk! Another question for you please...

I want to wire in the switch here:

As I look at pictures and wiring diagrams I see that the "Body ECU" piggybacks on the driver's side junction/fuse block. How do you suggest I get at those terminals?

 

[TheDurk]

Not a clue. Never had one open. I'd look at doing it at the fuse and at the relay socket Pin 1. No reason to go inside the Body ECU. I would think that more difficult.

 

[JZiggy]

Not a clue. Never had one open. I'd look at doing it at the fuse and at the relay socket Pin 1. No reason to go inside the Body ECU. I would think that more difficult.

Sorry for my ignorance here. How does one tap a fuse and a relay like that?

I've used fuse taps for the little fuses but not the big fuses (Jcase?) like the 30A and never a relay.

 

[TheDurk]

Sorry for my ignorance here. How does one tap a fuse and a relay like that?

I've used fuse taps for the little fuses but not the big fuses (Jcase?) like the 30A and never a relay.

I can't give you an answer. If I were doing it, I'd look for something I could solder a wire to. There is no pretty solution that I am aware of.

 

[pavelvoivoda]

Hi guys,
Been reading this tread and I think I came up with an idea.

The easiest way to do it is to put an ON/OFF switch next to the power window master switch (controls on the driver's door). It should be a regular switch that allows current to go from one wire to another like a bridge.

This bridging allows to bypass the relay in the diagram that is switched ON when you insert the key in the ON position, that gives power to the whole system.

You could technically just bridge both wires together without a switch, but I am not sure if there is a significant current draw, because of maybe another device being spliced at the hexagonal splice points on the diagram.

My opinion is that there probably isnt, but just to inform you guys to check with a multi meter for AMP draw, so you don't find the battery drained.

Here is the diagram:

First check for 12v on PIN 3 (blue wire) of the master switch plug pictured in the diagram with the ignition switch in the OFF position.

Then, check that there is no 12V on PIN 10 (blue/red wire) on the same plug, when ignition switch is in the OFF position, and that there is 12v when the ignition switch is in the ON position.

If that so, the you can proceed with connecting an ON/OFF switch to connect those two wires.

You can drill a hole in the master switch bezel and install the switch there, just make sure that the switch can handle more than 30 amps, as that is the current rating of the fuse in that system. Otherwise in case of a short, the switch may become the fuse and burn out.

Should I add a disclaimer - compare that the diagram wire coloring IS the same as that on the 4Runner and use minimum same wire gauge as the two wires, and, of course, do at your own risk!

 

[JZiggy]

[MENTION=111373]pavelvoivoda[/MENTION]

That is a great recommendation, Pavel. The wires from that plug should be pretty easy to get to, certainly way easier than the relay or fuse.

I am worried about the switch power rating. I suppose if I remember to only run one window at a time this would reduce the amperage but that's not a robust solution.

Perhaps the switch could engage a separate relay that serves to make the 10-3 bridge you are proposing?

 

[pavelvoivoda]

[MENTION=111373]pavelvoivoda[/MENTION]

I am worried about the switch power rating. I suppose if I remember to only run one window at a time this would reduce the amperage but that's not a robust solution.

Perhaps the switch could engage a separate relay that serves to make the 10-3 bridge you are proposing?

I think that the OEM back window lock switch (or any one of the simple push button rectangular switches) used on Gen3 4Runners, that do not have power windows, can handle that power... i think! Contacts seem thicker than the 30 amp fuse's burn point in the casing.

I don't think you'd need a relay. I assume if you open/close all windows at once, it should not draw that much current. But if you have a motor or two that fight against old window seals to raise or lower the glass, then yeah you could get higher amperage draw.

Give it a try, I think that since you are always there when you raise or lower the windows, you will see if the switch that bridges the wires, gets too hot... and you could always say short it intentionally, to see if it will handle 30amps thru and burn the fuse, or if it will spark and melt! haha

If you want to put a relay in the door, here is a edited diagram of the same thing with a relay. It is all doable right there at the door controls bezel
:becky:

 

[JZiggy]

I think that the OEM back window lock switch (or any one of the simple push button rectangular switches) used on Gen3 4Runners, that do not have power windows, can handle that power... i think! Contacts seem thicker than the 30 amp fuse's burn point in the casing.

I don't think you'd need a relay. I assume if you open/close all windows at once, it should not draw that much current. But if you have a motor or two that fight against old window seals to raise or lower the glass, then yeah you could get higher amperage draw.

Give it a try, I think that since you are always there when you raise or lower the windows, you will see if the switch that bridges the wires, gets too hot... and you could always say short it intentionally, to see if it will handle 30amps thru and burn the fuse, or if it will spark and melt! haha

If you want to put a relay in the door, here is a edited diagram of the same thing with a relay. It is all doable right there at the door controls bezel
:becky:

Thanks again Pavel! I am thinking about using this nifty "Window Lock" switch from a 1st gen 4Runner:

I'll only use two of the leads. It's a simple push and stay switch (not sure the EE term for that). It's probably 18ga maybe 16ga.

Wondering if maybe I should just wire in a 10A or 15A fuse with this switch just in case.

 

[JZiggy]

Also, where is that P7 connector?

 

[pavelvoivoda]

Wondering if maybe I should just wire in a 10A or 15A fuse with this switch just in case.

yep, I think this will handle it. You can put a fuse but don't go above 30amps. I think you shouldn't have problem!

Let me know how it works

 

[pavelvoivoda]

Also, where is that P7 connector?

I think you can see it here it is on the lower part of the second picture...98 - 02 TOYOTA 4RUNNER LIMITED FRONT LEFT SIDE MASTER POWER WINDOW SWITCH BLACK | eBay

 

[JZiggy]

Thanks Pavel! I see that these wires leave the fuse block thingy via connector 1C. Since I want to wire the switch near the clutch start cancel button I'll try to tap into them there.

 

[pavelvoivoda]

Thanks Pavel! I see that these wires leave the fuse block thingy via connector 1C. Since I want to wire the switch near the clutch start cancel button I'll try to tap into them there.

Cool, take a pic once you finish. I might end up doing the same after i install... power windows in mine! :becky:

 

[JZiggy]

[MENTION=10169]TheDurk[/MENTION] [MENTION=111373]pavelvoivoda[/MENTION]

Success! I wired in my switch as per Pavel's idea. Pretty easy to get to the wires once the fuse block was pulled out.

I tried a 5A fuse and it worked when running a single window but blew when running two. So I upped it to a 10A which was happy with 2 windows at a time.

Thanks again for the advice and ideas, guys!

 

[TheDurk]

Yeah, that'll work. Sunroof should be live, too.

 

[JZiggy]

Yeah, that'll work. Sunroof should be live, too.

Don’t know for sure, don’t have one.

 

[pavelvoivoda]

Yeah, that'll work. Sunroof should be live, too.

Since I drive a manual, I found the center dash board switches above the ac/heater controls in a junkyard and replaced the original and used the ECT button to make the same type of switch but it turns on all the accessories, without the key in the ignition. It's nice to turn on the radio or charge something for a few minutes, but it will drain the battery if forgotten.

I suggest if you want to prevent battery depletion from forgetting manual override switches like these ones ON, use a small circuit board that breaks the circuit once the voltage drops below a preset one, that you can set yourself with a small potentiometer on the board. They are available on ebay and are a few bucks and they themselves use very little current, like an alarm LED.
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=12v+voltage+cutoff&_sacat=0