Question For Non-KDSS TE Owners...

[jerlane]

I planning on getting a TE and am trying to decide if KDSS is a must have or not. As much as I would like to be offroad more, I live in Minnesota and there just isn't much to do here (off-road wise). I'll be lucky if I can get off road once a year. So the question is whether or not KDSS makes a big difference for street driving.

DO any of you non-KDAA people have major regrets about not getting it and if so, why? I'm not sure that an extra $1500 is worth it for me.
Thanks in adavnce!

 

[4ShoreRunner]

I have never driven a KDSS TE on or offroad; however, I will say that the benefits of KDSS may appeal to you even more since you plan to stay mostly on-road. The larger sway bars will help the TE handle a little better than a non-KDSS counterpart.

Sure, there is a clear offroad benefit, but the benefits shine on-road as well.

I would just test drive a KDSS if possible and see if the difference is great enough for you to spend the extra cash.

I upgraded my suspension about 15K miles into ownership so I don't regret getting a nonKDSS at all...can't say I really regretted it beforehand either.

 

[jerlane]

Thanks, 4shore,
As you know TE's are hard to come by and I will most likely not be able to test drive one. I was thinking that I could always upgrade the suspension just as you did if I notice a problem. What's a ballpark cost on something like that?

 

[FactoryRide]

gotta have that KDSS!!!!! :banana:

 

[jerlane]

gotta have that KDSS!!!!! :banana:

Care to elaborate?

 

[1engineer]

gotta have that KDSS!!!!! :banana:

That's an opinion which is what "muddies the water" when people are trying to get a fact.

Fact: More SR5's are sold than LE and TE models put together. Last I read only about 6% sold are TE models. LE's fare slightly better at about 15% of total sold. Those figures were taken from the Toyota press room mid last year.

So why do people buy the SR5's?
Fact: Apparently they like them just fine and are not willing to shell out 10-20% more for the LE and TE option packages.

IN MY OPINION, the SR5 does just fine on both street and trail. Can the TE options help off roading? Sure. Can an experienced off road driver do just as good with an SR5? I personally think so.

In the end the decision is up to you.

 

[jerlane]

That's an opinion which is what "muddies the water" when people are trying to get a fact.

Fact: More SR5's are sold than LE and TE models put together. Last I read only about 6% sold are TE models. LE's fare slightly better at about 15% of total sold. Those figures were taken from the Toyota press room mid last year.

So why do people buy the SR5's?
Fact: Apparently they like them just fine and are not willing to shell out 10-20% more for the LE and TE option packages.

IN MY OPINION, the SR5 does just fine on both street and trail. Can the TE options help off roading? Sure. Can an experienced off road driver do just as good with an SR5? I personally think so.

In the end the decision is up to you.

Thanks for that perspective. We have an '07 Sport Edition and like the way that handles just fine. So, I wonder how the TE would compare. From what I've been reading here, KDSS would be best. It's going to come down to price I guess.

 

[rickwol]

I have a TE without KDSS and couldn't be happier. I love the "look" of the TE over the SR5 as well as the LTD (personal opinion) and it does everything I need it to do. I've taken it mildly offroad several times, played with the select a terrain dials and even checked out the rear locker once (in a combination mud snow rut) even though I know it wasn't needed to free myself. But seriously most of my driving is in town/highway and the touted benefits of on-road handling to me are not worth the extra money or the potential expense of a repair(s) down the road (note I said potential as I think we've seen one poster here with KDSS problems but these vehicles are still basically new). I kind of like the softer, comfortable ride when traveling but think that the non-kdss shares the same nose-dive fate with the SR-5. However if that bothers you, and I've been considering this myself, then a nice set of Bilsteins (non-lift) will take of that problem nicely and inexpensively, thank you. There is something in each of these models and options for everyone. Part of the fun is deciding what's right for you.

 

[Tengu]

Let me get this straight, you are asking if you should get KDSS on an admittedly hard to come by trail, so that you can "maybe" take it off the road once a year? And further more, it's because there is not much to do off road in Minnesota?

One... I know some that would love to differ with you on the later part.

Two... Do you need a sniper rifle at the pistol range? Really, it's like the soccer moms down here who buy land rovers so they can maybe see the grass at the soccer field. I know the trail is cool, but unless you want to seek out new and cool places, rock crawling, or serious offroading, save your money. (and save the trail for those that would put it to the test)

Three... KDSS is realitively new. Yet you see what people are doing in their 4runners and FJ's pre KDSS. My previous stock 05 4runner ran through some muddy ruts so deep my left wheels were off the ground because the center rut was bottomed out and I was leaning on the right wheels. The 4runner did not even think about getting stuck. (made me want a lift though)

I've been in sand so deep in my new SR5 I was plowing it with my skid plate. Still, not even thought that I was even close to getting stuck. (Again, lift is coming soon)

Some of the dumb stuff my son has done in his 97 limited 2 wheel drive 4runner has me wonder how many people will ever need their 4x4. I'm sure he has a thread here somewhere with pics.

So to answer your question. Do I regret not getting KDSS? Yes, because I wanted a trail so I can crawl, do some mudding, and really run the hell out of it.

Given I could not find a trail, I got another SR5 and am totally pleased with it, and it's capabilities. (Surprised actually)

Once a year wheeling, you probably will not gain enough knowledge/skill to miss it.

I know the TE is a bad mamma jamma, and I certainly understand the lust, but you, could save your money and be totally happy without KDSS, or a trail for that manor. If you must have a trail, get KDSS, that way you'll never have to wonder if you'll miss it.

As for your second ballpark an addition... without having an idea what you'd want to add, how could one ballpark that?

 

[Ryan_S]

I know mine handles great w/ KDSS. Its no sports car, but there is no SUV lean or body roll in the curves. Id say it's a lot less scary to drive than other big SUVs.

Tires make a huge difference too.

Where in MN are you at?

 

[GreerAZ]

I bought the TE because I could get KDSS and it seems odd to me that people would buy a TE without. Its like buying a T4R in 2WD. I didn't test drive an SR5, but I drove several limited's in my car search. The TE with KDSS is a much smoother ride and has less body roll. The TE with KDSS still nose dives at stop lights, but so does my 01 Wrangler. The KDSS is great for driving on winding mountain roads, no sea sick kids in the back. The KDSS is great on wash boarded dirt roads, it seems to absorb bumps better than any vehicle I've driven. I think some of the other TE features like terrain control and crawl control are pointless, they make four wheeling like driving on the highway in cruise control. The rear locker is great when rock crawling in 4LO. I also dislike the hood scoop because the sun glares off of it really bad when driving into the sun, even when using polarized glasses. Again, the biggest reason to get a TE is the KDSS which really is awesome.

 

[jerlane]

I know mine handles great w/ KDSS. Its no sports car, but there is no SUV lean or body roll in the curves. Id say it's a lot less scary to drive than other big SUVs.

Tires make a huge difference too.

Where in MN are you at?

Hey Ryan,
I live in south Minneapolis. You must have the only TE in town. I'm not sure if I've ever seen one here. Care to give a demo of the KDSS some time?

 

[Wakeborder556]

Can an experienced off road driver do just as good with an SR5? I personally think so.

You think that if the same experienced driver drove both the sr5 would do just as good as a KDSS TE?

 

[swordncross]

No

I've had my TE since August 2010. The only time that I wish I'd had the KDSS was when I was parked at a crazy angle off road at a dive site for work. All the guys asked, "Did you break an axle?" because of the extreme angle. The flex was still great, I just wish that the body was sitting all level and cool looking. You'll love it without the KDSS. Save the bucks, and buy a beer to celebrate you new toy.

 

[KCcarguy]

Let me get this straight, you are asking if you should get KDSS on an admittedly hard to come by trail, so that you can "maybe" take it off the road once a year? And further more, it's because there is not much to do off road in Minnesota?

One... I know some that would love to differ with you on the later part.

Two... Do you need a sniper rifle at the pistol range? Really, it's like the soccer moms down here who buy land rovers so they can maybe see the grass at the soccer field. I know the trail is cool, but unless you want to seek out new and cool places, rock crawling, or serious offroading, save your money. (and save the trail for those that would put it to the test)

I think you're exaggerating the difference between a TE and any other 4runner. You're acting like the TE is a totally different vehicle.....it's simply a trim level with some extra off-road goodies. However, it's also better-looking IMO and will likely have higher resale value down the road. KDSS is more beneficial on the street than off road, so the OP's question is legitimate.

 

[jerlane]

I think you're exaggerating the difference between a TE and any other 4runner. You're acting like the TE is a totally different vehicle.....it's simply a trim level with some extra off-road goodies. However, it's also better-looking IMO and will likely have higher resale value down the road. KDSS is more beneficial on the street than off road, so the OP's question is legitimate.

I appreciate your comments, KC. For a minute there, I was thinking about getting a RAV4 . You points are the exact reasons I'm planning on getting a TE and if I can afford it, KDSS. From what I've been reading here and in other posts it does have a big impact in on-road driving as well as off-road. Hopefully I can test drive one before I pull the trigger.

 

[Grape Ape]

KDSS is beneficial to both on an offroad capabilities. On road, it makes for a more stable, smoother and consistent ride. It's no BMW, but it's pretty nice when you have to cruise for a distance.

 

[453030]

I'm not sure many of the replies address your question, which IMO is yes, KDSS provides a noticeable on-road improvement. The easiest way to see for yourself is by driving an SR5 and KDSS Trail (if you have access to both). I did, back to back, and the difference was very obvious when cornering and turning.

I have upgraded my suspension components to Overland Warehouse, but put plenty of miles on the stock suspension. I still have the KDSS benefits of course, and it is the thicker sway bars that really make the difference.

The other options on a Trail are well documented, but to me the single reason to get it is KDSS.

 

[lowrange44]

That's an opinion which is what "muddies the water" when people are trying to get a fact.

Fact: More SR5's are sold than LE and TE models put together. Last I read only about 6% sold are TE models. LE's fare slightly better at about 15% of total sold. Those figures were taken from the Toyota press room mid last year.

So why do people buy the SR5's?
Fact: Apparently they like them just fine and are not willing to shell out 10-20% more for the LE and TE option packages.

IN MY OPINION, the SR5 does just fine on both street and trail. Can the TE options help off roading? Sure. Can an experienced off road driver do just as good with an SR5? I personally think so.

In the end the decision is up to you.

I think anybody considering a 4Runner should drive both before they decide. The problem is that KDSS equipped 4Runners are hard to find for a demo.

I've owned both non-KDSS and KDSS equipped 5th Gen 4Runners. In my opinion, the on-road difference between a KDSS equipped 4Runner and a non-KDSS equipped 4Runner is night and day. As others have mentioned, there is very little body roll when cornering with KDSS. Off-road flex is also improved.

There is nothing wrong with the suspension on the SR5 or Limited... But, there has to be a compromise between on road comfort/control and off road flex. KDSS allows for improvements in both areas with less compromise.

FACT: KDSS is standard on all Land Cruisers and Lexus GX 460 models. It is considered a premium technology that improves the ride and capability of Toyota's premium SUV's.

I personally would also love to have the full-time 4wd of the limited and the KDSS system of the trail... This was one of the compromises I had to make when making a purchase. The only way to get both full-time 4wd and KDSS was to jump up to the GX 460. While I think the GX 460 is an amazing vehicle, its price tag was a little more than I was looking to spend and had additional compromises such as the rear barn door and mandatory 3rd row seating.

 

[Ryan_S]

I got my TE at Burnsville Toyota. They had to order it, but I actually got someone else's that was ordered 3 weeks before mine. They also got another one in with mine that they kept for stock. So they have sold a few.

The only other one I've seen driving around was another mag grey one near my work. But I only saw it once. It's true they are rare around here!