Stock Alignment specs

[Sungod]

really? that's news to me... so in other words if align my vehicle correctly it will do NOTHING to PREVENT premature or irregular tread wear? keyword: PREVENT. :dizzy:

Preventive maintenance is changing your oil. You change it before it fails. An alignment is either correct or it isn't. You can check it as a preventive measure to prevent tire wear, but you don't just adjust it for the hell of it. It isn't like you show up and the tech will rotate your ball joints or max out an adjuster then bring it back to spec. You have to understand the difference between checking and adjusting. There is typically no charge for a check, there is a charge for an adjustment.

Dude your way off track. You claim he didnt need any adjustments. Do you have any idea if his steering wheel was centered prior to the alignment? In this case it WAS off, they adjusted toe( while centering the steering wheel) The OP's vehicle is no longer pulling or tracking anymore

Also he only paid $50. Which in seems pretty cheap in my opinion, But different areas have different rates and costs of living.

The OP was not questioning if anything was done. He was questioning if it was correct as it was cheap and fast. The answer to that is Yes it is correct(as long as the wheel is centered).

There is no indication that his steering wheel was off center, and the .03 difference you see in change from left to right would mean only the slightest, and I mean slightest change in the steering wheel position. You are grasping for that, but if you want to look at the numbers, are you going to tell me that they adjusted the rear toe as well? I mean it changed more than the front.

I agree that the price is low. Who knows, maybe they did just charge him for a check, but generally you only get a before print out if nothing is done.

This is completely false. First you accuse them of not doing anything( other than pulling on the bumper. Then you say they made an "Unneeded" adjustment Just so that they could charge him. Clearly adjustments were needed if the OP claims the truck drives better, Its YOUR opinion that they were unneeded and unless your the one working on the truck or the owner. i dont think your qualified to make that decision. On the same token, We dont know if anything was adjusted. Maybe the OP has it in his head that its better and nothing has changed. Whos to say???

There is nothing false about my statements. If you know anything about alignments, a toe adjustment does nothing to improve the ride quality and especially a change so slight. It isn't my opinion that the adjustments were not needed, it is FACT. The manufacturer set the specs so there is no subjectivity when it comes to the angles. Granted you can narrow down optimal settings within the specs, but in this case it was well within spec. The spec for toe is -.07 to + .27 degrees. Those numbers support the FACT that the vehicle was within spec and no adjustments were needed.

To me when I see numbers like I that especially the change in rear toe, I would question it.

I agree that it could be in the OPs head that it has changed because someone told them it did. My point is that from what I am seeing in the numbers that nothing changed and that they should further investigate.

 

[Sungod]

Guys, I'm not expecting a $50 refund. Although it was a slight change, it does in fact track better. It doesn't pull to the side anymore.
I'm happy either way, just making sure it's within OEM spec

It's town fair tire, I doubt these kind of chains would give you a refund. They are more about quantity then quality. Only reason I did alignment with them is because he kinda just thru the cheap price on me and I didn't really think about it, but in the end everything is good.

Did they do anything else besides the alignment? Rotation, air pressure, etc?

 

[Scott@Hightech]

Preventive maintenance is changing your oil. You change it before it fails. An alignment is either correct or it isn't. You can check it as a preventive measure to prevent tire wear, but you don't just adjust it for the hell of it. It isn't like you show up and the tech will rotate your ball joints or max out an adjuster then bring it back to spec. You have to understand the difference between checking and adjusting. There is typically no charge for a check, there is a charge for an adjustment.



There is no indication that his steering wheel was off center, and the .03 difference you see in change from left to right would mean only the slightest, and I mean slightest change in the steering wheel position. You are grasping for that, but if you want to look at the numbers, are you going to tell me that they adjusted the rear toe as well? I mean it changed more than the front.

I agree that the price is low. Who knows, maybe they did just charge him for a check, but generally you only get a before print out if nothing is done.




There is nothing false about my statements. If you know anything about alignments, a toe adjustment does nothing to improve the ride quality and especially a change so slight. It isn't my opinion that the adjustments were not needed, it is FACT. The manufacturer set the specs so there is no subjectivity when it comes to the angles. Granted you can narrow down optimal settings within the specs, but in this case it was well within spec. The spec for toe is -.07 to + .27 degrees. Those numbers support the FACT that the vehicle was within spec and no adjustments were needed.

To me when I see numbers like I that especially the change in rear toe, I would question it.

I agree that it could be in the OPs head that it has changed because someone told them it did. My point is that from what I am seeing in the numbers that nothing changed and that they should further investigate.

Ill make you a deal since your close. Bring your truck to the shop and i Will PROVE to you that I can set your toe within specs and have your steering wheel 90degs off. And i can set your caster and camber within specs and it WILL pull to one side. I Am also willing to take the time to Set your toe way negative and let you drive it up and down the street to see how much it changes how it drives. Then i Can set the toe way in and let you drive it again. You will again notice how drastically different it is. Then I can align your truck properly.

 

[1engineer]

Ill make you a deal since your close. Bring your truck to the shop and i Will PROVE to you that I can set your toe within specs and have your steering wheel 90degs off. And i can set your caster and camber within specs and it WILL pull to one side. I Am also willing to take the time to Set your toe way negative and let you drive it up and down the street to see how much it changes how it drives. Then i Can set the toe way in and let you drive it again. You will again notice how drastically different it is. Then I can align your truck properly.

I like it one thousand times. My bet he never shows....

 

[Sputnik]

Did they do anything else besides the alignment? Rotation, air pressure, etc?

I purchased new tires from them ( Toyo Open Country AT 2) they installed, new valve stems, did balancing and alignment and disposed my old tires all for $810 out the door. $50 of it was for the alignment. I haggled with them on the price. The originally wanted $200 per tire for just the tires plus the work and tax. I brought in a printout from treaddepot.com that had them for $147 each plus $90 shipping, so they matched that plus charged me for balance, alignment, new valve stems, and old tire disposal.
I saved over $200 by bringing in that piece of paper so I think I did okay..

 

[nevada]

yes, you can have the toe set correctly, and the wheel can still be off center.
its VERY common actually.


but, none of that matters, the OP was happy to pay for the service he got.


and if $50 is a cheap alignment, we need to change our prices.....

 

[nevada]

I purchased new tires from them ( Toyo Open Country AT 2) they installed, new valve stems, did balancing and alignment and disposed my old tires all for $810 out the door. $50 of it was for the alignment. I haggled with them on the price. The originally wanted $200 per tire for just the tires plus the work and tax. I brought in a printout from treaddepot.com that had them for $147 each plus $90 shipping, so they matched that plus charged me for balance, alignment, new valve stems, and old tire disposal.
I saved over $200 by bringing in that piece of paper so I think I did okay..

it drives better because of the new tires.
tires can cause a lot of driveability issues.


when buying a new set of tires, its good insurance to get an alignment. to make sure they'll last as long as they can. so good call there.

and, it may not be preventative maintenance, it can certainly PREVENT excessive tire wear.

 

[Sputnik]

it drives better because of the new tires.
tires can cause a lot of driveability issues.


when buying a new set of tires, its good insurance to get an alignment. to make sure they'll last as long as they can. so good call there.

and, it may not be preventative maintenance, it can certainly PREVENT excessive tire wear.

Yes that and the fact that my SUV never treaded straight from day one.
I didn't do anything about it until now because it was slight. I had to hold the steering wheel slightly, very slightly to one side to go straight... Not anymore...
So when you say new tires helped me tread better maybe, but alignment did to

 

[Sputnik]

Either way it's ALL GOOD now
Couldn't be happier with the new tires other then the very slight mpg loss

 

[Sputnik]

My dad drives a tundra and purchased the Toyo Open Country HT instead of at's..
When he seen how mine looked he wishes now he got these instead for his truck

 

[Scott@Hightech]

My dad drives a tundra and purchased the Toyo Open Country HT instead of at's..
When he seen how mine looked he wishes now he got these instead for his truck

Yeah the ATs are a great looking tire, He can always upgrade!!

 

[Sungod]

Ill make you a deal since your close. Bring your truck to the shop and i Will PROVE to you that I can set your toe within specs and have your steering wheel 90degs off. And i can set your caster and camber within specs and it WILL pull to one side. I Am also willing to take the time to Set your toe way negative and let you drive it up and down the street to see how much it changes how it drives. Then i Can set the toe way in and let you drive it again. You will again notice how drastically different it is. Then I can align your truck properly.

Not really sure I get your point, you have pretty much repeated what I have said. I agree that if you go to the extreme you can have those results, but I would be willing to bet you that I could make a .03 degree change in toe and you will not be able to see the difference in the steering wheel. .30 change, sure. .03 no chance.

You can set my caster to any setting within spec and as long as there is no more than a half degree difference side to side, it won't pull. It may wander, but it won't pull.

 

[Scott@Hightech]

Not really sure I get your point, you have pretty much repeated what I have said. I agree that if you go to the extreme you can have those results, but I would be willing to bet you that I could make a .03 degree change in toe and you will not be able to see the difference in the steering wheel. .30 change, sure. .03 no chance.

Understandable, which is why i made the offer to show you the difference.

But just for fun, Using theoretical numbers.Steering wheel centered and 0 deg of toe is 48" and that is when both tierod ends are in the middle of their adjustment range. If i adjust one tie rod end all the way out and the other side all the way in(equal amounts). What would the total measurement be? It would still be 48" and you would still have 0deg of toe. BUT your steering wheel would now be Way off since you have effectively shifted everything all the way one way.

That is how you can change the steering wheel position. Your only seeing the Before and after readings. Which are both within acceptable ranges.

All of this is getting pretty far off topic, if you wish to further discuss feel free to come out to the shop or PM me.

 

[Stifler]

.30 change, sure. .03 no chance.

willing to put some cash on the table for this one?? Just had an alignment done it was .05 off and my steering wheel was slight right. Had to take it back after driving down the street. Tracked just fine but the tilt was just enough to be annoying.

 

[KVA]

I just had alignment done 7 times and they could not align the steering wheel - don't ask.

I can do it myself now. Actually I can set the tie-rods correctly with a white marker and a couple wrenches..no machine. This doesn't change how you drive if you are equally setting each side. Now if you only do one then listen to Scott@Hightech, lol.

Our steering has a bit of play in it and unless they get it centered by moving the steering wheel side to side it can appear centered and great from a machine POV, but once you drive it you'll think you were in NASCAR doing left turns (or right) everywhere.

:lookout:

 

[Sungod]

Understandable, which is why i made the offer to show you the difference.

But just for fun, Using theoretical numbers.Steering wheel centered and 0 deg of toe is 48" and that is when both tierod ends are in the middle of their adjustment range. If i adjust one tie rod end all the way out and the other side all the way in(equal amounts). What would the total measurement be? It would still be 48" and you would still have 0deg of toe. BUT your steering wheel would now be Way off since you have effectively shifted everything all the way one way.

That is how you can change the steering wheel position. Your only seeing the Before and after readings. Which are both within acceptable ranges.

All of this is getting pretty far off topic, if you wish to further discuss feel free to come out to the shop or PM me.

That is 100% accurate. Extreme, but accurate. I was only referring to the numbers posts. You have to agree with the changing rear numbers that something isn't right.

BTW, I have been to your shop. Assuming you are the shop past the U-haul dealer. You used to be high Tech 4x4 if I am not mistaken. I sent a lot of business your way because you were one of the only honest shops around. I actually brought in my 89 Wrangler once in the middle of winter because I had a vacuum leak in the front end that I couldn't find in the 20 degree weather. You all also hooked me up with a new top at cost in the pre internet days.

 

[Sungod]

willing to put some cash on the table for this one?? Just had an alignment done it was .05 off and my steering wheel was slight right. Had to take it back after driving down the street. Tracked just fine but the tilt was just enough to be annoying.

Post your numbers.

 

[c2one]

I feel my tires rubbing when going in reverse. To me it feels like it's rubbing on the frame cross bars. What would need to be adjusted to move the wheels forward? Is this possible with an alignment?

I have a 3inch spacer lift.

 

[Stifler]

I feel my tires rubbing when going in reverse. To me it feels like it's rubbing on the frame cross bars. What would need to be adjusted to move the wheels forward? Is this possible with an alignment?

I have a 3inch spacer lift.

probably gonne need aftermarket UCAs to get the desired result with that setup

 

[c2one]

probably gonne need aftermarket UCAs to get the desired result with that setup

I was afraid this was gonna cost me $$$