Superman3043's Build Thread

Absolutely man i was already thinking about driving the 4Runner down but now that i saw these pics and we can get some wheelin in and catch up with some cool peeps from the T4R it's a done deal!

Thanks man yeah it's coming together! I can't wait till i get my bumper and new shoes!! So far so good on the Plasti dip it's super easy to do aside from the prep is the most part of the work. But even for the first time i've ever done it it looks awesome. I ended up with a little bit more texture some areas them others and after spending some time reading on the DIC forum i realized it's because i was doing too many thin coats, your supposed to do a couple thin coats in the beginning but then your supposed to lay it on heavy which i didn't do enough so i ended up with a little texture in areas not the end of the world still looks sick! Other than that it's solid man i have buddy who has his FJ done lime green and he's hit and has a couple dents from trees on the trail while wheelin and plasti dip help up strong! That's what sold me on it haha,, there's also a good thread in the 5th Gen section here
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/168747-full-plasti-dip-trail-damage.html

Good deal! A little texture wouldn't bother me. I like it. There's a guy local that has his Taco done blaze orange. Definitely stands out. He's not tested it on trails though, it's a mall crawler. The parts that I have dipped on my truck have definitely held up pretty well. Better than paint on most parts. Thanks for sharing the link, I didn't know Andrew had done this. I haven't checked in on his build in a while but I love (Audiox's) truck.
 
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Good deal! A little texture wouldn't bother me. I like it. There's a guy local that has his Taco done blaze orange. Definitely stands out. He's not tested it on trails though, it's a mall crawler. The parts that I have dipped on my truck have definitely held up pretty well. Better than paint on most parts. Thanks for sharing the link, I didn't know Andrew had done this. I haven't checked in on his build in a while but I love (Audiox's) truck.

Yeah the texture doesn't bother me either. Haha Yeah a majority of built up rigs are mall crawlers unfortunately kinda sad. I say if you build it wheel it and that doesn't mean you have to abuse your rig but at least take it of the pavement and get it a little dirty from time to time!With Plasti dip it's all about the prep as long as you do the proper prep/clean etc it sticks pretty well. Yeah Andrew has a sick build, i think those are the new wheels i'm going to get the new FN 17" 5 stars that he just got.Pretty dope!
 
Superman, your runner convinced me on the white bro.

Greenwood, welcome! You won't be sorry man. White is my absolute favorite. Both mine and my wife's last two cars have been white and I really don't see us buying any other color. A word of caution, the single stage white on the 4th gens require some upkeep otherwise the color will go to shit quickly. If you've got something like the Urban Runner in the Blizzard Pearl (the color of my wife's car), then it's the same as anything else. Hope you enjoy your ride. Let me know if I can help in anyway. Maybe we can get up next time we hit Gulches.
 
Greenwood, welcome! You won't be sorry man. White is my absolute favorite. Both mine and my wife's last two cars have been white and I really don't see us buying any other color. A word of caution, the single stage white on the 4th gens require some upkeep otherwise the color will go to shit quickly. If you've got something like the Urban Runner in the Blizzard Pearl (the color of my wife's car), then it's the same as anything else. Hope you enjoy your ride. Let me know if I can help in anyway. Maybe we can get up next time we hit Gulches.

Ya it's a 2005. It's basically stock now. Isn't Gulches in Laurens?
 
:smokin:


Good snag, wonder why Alex doesn't want to hook up the new 14' ?

Well you saved $100.00, plus the shipping fees on a 40 lbs box from OR to SC. You might want to look into the MetalTech lower links to accomodate the rear lift/flex. They're offset on the axle end to prevent any binding at full flex :biggrin1:

Let me know if you need a hand installing those bad boys :bat:


Bobby
 
:smokin:


Good snag, wonder why Alex doesn't want to hook up the new 14' ?

Well you saved $100.00, plus the shipping fees on a 40 lbs box from OR to SC. You might want to look into the MetalTech lower links to accomodate the rear lift/flex. They're offset on the axle end to prevent any binding at full flex :biggrin1:

Let me know if you need a hand installing those bad boys :bat:


Bobby

He doesn't have the 14' anymore. Moved on to Lexus GS350 F-Sport... Baller status.

Yeah, I guess I would have saved that little if Alex had sold it to me for asking price ;). Not at liberty to disclose how GOOD of a deal I got on this, but let's just say, for somebody not looking to upgrade, it was a deal I couldn't pass up.

Yeah, I'm back on making my own links, a project we talked about probably a year or so ago, so we'll see if I follow through this time. I've actually got a lot of the design work finished, just gotta get the money.

Yeah, I'll probably be calling for a set of hands so stay by the phone.
 
Got a little something inbound thanks to my friend [MENTION=86190]Alex T4R[/MENTION].

Stay tuned :)

Nice Grab man! Your gonna love the way it performs offroad I know i do and i haven't even fully disconnected the rear yet and it's still awesome! Alex told me about it when i grabbed the winch off of him, of course it was after i already bought mine from MT.
 
Yeah, I'm back on making my own links, a project we talked about probably a year or so ago, so we'll see if I follow through this time. I've actually got a lot of the design work finished, just gotta get the money.

Hmm, do tell! I'd like to see what you're thinking and costs. ;)
 
Hmm, do tell! I'd like to see what you're thinking and costs. ;)

Nothing special really. I've just been piddling around with making my own on and off in my spare time. Studied a little bit on suspension design to see what I could cook up. Saw what everyone else is doing and charging and borrowed the ideas that I liked.

For the lower links the OEM use rubber bushings. Aftermarket offerings use different combinations of poly bushings, heim joints, and Johnny Joints. For tubing it looks like 1-1/2" x .250 wall DOM is pretty standard for the heavy duty applications. Metaltech uses 1-3/4".

The advantage to the flexible bushings is that they actually give, so they are easier on the components around them like the mounts and chassis, etc. and also will ride less harsh as they are actually suspension components. The drawback is that they don't handle mis-alignment very well at dramatic flex angles because they bind up sooner.

Flexible metal ball and socket style joints offer greater mis-alignment angles and are more heavy duty at the trade off of being more costly, possibly requiring more maintenance, and being harder on surrounding components and yielding harsher ride quality from the nature of their rigidity.

That being said, I decided to utilize 1-1/2" x .250 wall DOM, with a large adjustable Heim Joint at the frame side and an off set 2-1/2" Johnny Joint at the axle side like the MT ones. I haven't seen anybody with this combination. Basically using the design elements that I like from everything that's out there.

O3zxW2t.jpg


For the Track Bar (Panhard) I'm just using some 1-1/2" x .120 wall DOM with left and right hand high mis-alignment rod ends at each end. This will make it adjustable on the truck like a turnbuckle. Some people us .250 wall on these, but I think that'd be overkill. It more than doubles my cost on material. As an engineer, I've learned that it's easy to design overkill, but for companies with competition, not many are willing to pay for overkill.

u8QbZM5.jpg


Originally I wanted to design just a bolt-on panhard lift bracket, that had multiple holes depending on the amount of lift you had, in order to get your axle re-centered as an economical solution, but I really couldn't find an elegant way to pull off. The advantage to that is that it produces a more desirable "roll center" than just throwing a longer panhard bar in would.

Still fleshing out the details for the upper links. I'd like to do something that would alleviate a condition where the driver side link smacks the fuel tank at full droop, so stay tuned for that. I'll really get to investigate it with the long travel setup.

I've still got to make drawings and send them to my fabricators. As a preliminary costing analysis, I don't see myself saving a ton of money over buying something off the shelf, but I'll have "one off" pieces that I designed and they'll be the way I want them. Now if a few of you guys like you and Austin would like to have a set of your own made, that could possibly bring the cost down for all of us. Bobby wanted a set when I first started talking about doing some, but couldn't wait, so he bought MetalTechs. It's tough when ya got that money burnin' a hole in your pocket I guess lol.... Not a problem I know.
 
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So now you decide to poop out some links :)
What about uppers ? The stock knew are anorexic

Metaltech uses poly on the axle side and jj's on the frame side. They're a special size jj too. Specific to MT. Both have greasable zerks.


Bobby
 
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So now you decide to poop out some links :)
What about uppers ? The stock knew are anorexic

Metaltech uses poly on the axle side and jj's on the frame side. They're a special size jj too. Specific to MT. Both have greasable zerks.


Bobby

Working on uppers. I'm not really in a hurry to replace those though. Yeah, they look anorexic, but what sort of load forces do they actually see? I understand making the lowers out of a beefier wall because they can actually be drug over things and bent, but that's the reason I decided to use .120 wall on my panhard instead of .250. I used .120 on the slider tubes and they're expected to be drug AND support the weight of the truck, so I wouldn't go off of how beefy or anorexic something looks. Some will throw material and cost at a part in the name of "beef"... Just not my style.

Yes, I'm aware of what MetalTech does, they're one of the many that researched and looked into for my design. I wouldn't have spec'd a Johnny Joint for mine if I couldn't source one that would work for what I wanted. Did you edit your original post because you realized that I actually did offset my link :) Sneaky sneaky.
 
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I am sure you have been researching this for sometime now, as we discussed these over a year ago now and yes I did edit my post, several times, lol.


Not discounting the OD verses the ID or thickness of tubing. Personally If I was going to make my own lowers they would be 1.75" OD and .25 thick, or thicker :thumb3:

The uppers need to stay relatively thin (OD) to begin with. You will see why when you start almost hitting your gastank. :eek: They do however need to be a heavy duty material though for sure. I am not sure what the load rating is on the uppers, but you have witnessed these break on the trail. I am looking into replacing them because I am concerned about how much they can handle. Especially with the new improved flex.


Bobby
 
OooOoooh! I'm impressed! See, this is why I like you! I'm liking the design, and I definitely want a long travel on the rear in the future.
Does the Lower arm hit the tank due to the swing of the Panhard bar? I haven't really looked into this yet. I like the idea of the different holes on the upper mount to adjust for lift. Seems more beneficial for some reason. When I watch shows like Xtreme 4x4 and such and they are building 4 links they usually have mounts with more than one hole for adjusting for specific setups and conditions. Also, I always see them use the same size for both lower and upper control arms. Darklight pointed out though that there might not be room for much bigger. They do look pretty wimpy..
What about making the lower links longer? Would that throw off the arc of the upper links? Seems like the mounting point on the frame would be really easy to move, make beefier as many ding and bend them up pretty bad.
 
The uppers need to stay relatively thin (OD) to begin with. You will see why when you start almost hitting your gastank. :eek: They do however need to be a heavy duty material though for sure. I am not sure what the load rating is on the uppers, but you have witnessed these break on the trail. I am looking into replacing them because I am concerned about how much they can handle. Especially with the new improved flex.


Bobby

Dammit Bobby... sometimes I feel like you don't even READ my posts lol.

OooOoooh! I'm impressed! See, this is why I like you! I'm liking the design, and I definitely want a long travel on the rear in the future.
Does the Lower arm hit the tank due to the swing of the Panhard bar? I haven't really looked into this yet. I like the idea of the different holes on the upper mount to adjust for lift. Seems more beneficial for some reason. When I watch shows like Xtreme 4x4 and such and they are building 4 links they usually have mounts with more than one hole for adjusting for specific setups and conditions. Also, I always see them use the same size for both lower and upper control arms. Darklight pointed out though that there might not be room for much bigger. They do look pretty wimpy..
What about making the lower links longer? Would that throw off the arc of the upper links? Seems like the mounting point on the frame would be really easy to move, make beefier as many ding and bend them up pretty bad.

Lower link doesn't hit the tank, the upper one can, just because it's located right behind the tank. BUT, the drive shaft flange and balancing weights CAN come in contact with aftermarket fuel tank skid mounts (like BudBuilts) as Bobby discovered with long travel. The travel arc of the panhard would help this by looking at the way it's mounted if the axle were to drop straight down, however if you stuff the driver side, it looks like it actually exacerbates the situation.

Yes, having adjust-ability in locating the panhard bar is good. It lets you dial in your "roll center" or the axis that your vehicle will pivot on side to side. For all intents and purposes, it's basically a point between your vehicle COG (center of gravity) and your suspension center, which is usually the middle of your panhard bar. The closer you can get those two points together, the less moment or lever arm is created when cornering, creating a more stable vehicle. Which is why lifting the panhard bar up is actually more desirable than just putting in a longer one.

I'm not sure if you actually do use the same length arms when doing a 4-Link, but I guess that would be ideal, but probably very easy to achieve due to space constraints on regular cars. Buggies will let you get away with more. I've always heard the rule of thumb is that your uppers should be at least 70% of the lowers in order to maintain proper pinion angels for parallel set-ups and the geometry is a little more complicated for triangulated ones.

Yeah the lower links are adjustable to make them a little longer in order to re-center your axle after lift and manipulate the pinion angle, but yes, when changing link length, be it by moving the mounts or whatever, the other links and pinion/drive shaft angles all need to be accounted for as they'll all be affected.
 

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