Talk me out of Cooper Discoverer AT3??

[having fun]

I usually use a bungee cord to hold the spring in place doing this, it doesn't have to come out.
I never had to loosen the cam tab bolts either.

Toyota 120 Platforms Forum

 

[watson6505]

Go with falken wildpeaks. If you are ruling out an E rated tire that makes me think this is going to be more daily driver than trail. At least the Wildpeaks have an aggresive look at a very attractive price. They look better than the AT3's too

I certainly considered the Falkens but they don't come in 275/70/17 so I had to rule them out.

 

[watson6505]

I usually use a bungee cord to hold the spring in place doing this, it doesn't have to come out.
I never had to loosen the cam tab bolts either.

Toyota 120 Platforms Forum

So I read the post a couple times and I am still not following (without the pictures showing up, its a little hard to visualize). I assume these are the steps where you can do the adjustment:

****************************************************************
...Now, the spring pressure is relaxed, and you can wiggle the spring and shock out of the suspension. You will need to continue holding the lower A-arm down, to make room for this removal.

Now put your new shock and spring back in the same way. Don't forget to put the big bushing & washer on top of the strut, before installing everything.

As you lift t he spring and shock into position, you need to align the top of the shock and the top of the spring, into their proper positions. Push down on the lower A-arm, to place the lower end of the shock in it's seat. Install the lower shock bolt.

Now jack up the lower A-arm, while making sure the top of the spring, and upper shock are properly aligned. The shock stud will come up into its final position. Install the rubber bushing, washer, and nut.
****************************************************************

I guess I don't understand why you would need a spring compressor to assemble the spring to the shock and why companies like wheelers charge $100 for this service if its not necessary and this 'easy'. It sounds like if I remove the top nut from the shock it will 'fall out of the spring' and I can adjust the perch and just push it back in and reattach that nut. Where and why do the spring compressors come into place?

Please clarify

 

[Rodtheviking]

So I read the post a couple times and I am still not following (without the pictures showing up, its a little hard to visualize). I assume these are the steps where you can do the adjustment:

****************************************************************
...Now, the spring pressure is relaxed, and you can wiggle the spring and shock out of the suspension. You will need to continue holding the lower A-arm down, to make room for this removal.

Now put your new shock and spring back in the same way. Don't forget to put the big bushing & washer on top of the strut, before installing everything.

As you lift t he spring and shock into position, you need to align the top of the shock and the top of the spring, into their proper positions. Push down on the lower A-arm, to place the lower end of the shock in it's seat. Install the lower shock bolt.

Now jack up the lower A-arm, while making sure the top of the spring, and upper shock are properly aligned. The shock stud will come up into its final position. Install the rubber bushing, washer, and nut.
****************************************************************

I guess I don't understand why you would need a spring compressor to assemble the spring to the shock and why companies like wheelers charge $100 for this service if its not necessary and this 'easy'. It sounds like if I remove the top nut from the shock it will 'fall out of the spring' and I can adjust the perch and just push it back in and reattach that nut. Where and why do the spring compressors come into place?

Please clarify

The no compressor method works well for stock springs and okay for lift springs, still its kinda dangerous. Most people don't want to get injured. With lift springs being taller its necessary to compress them to get the top mount on the shock. I had Wheelers do mine as it includes new top hats and bushings and they are installed correctly for driver and passenger side, no guess work.

 

[watson6505]

I think Im gonna keep them at .85 (first setting) and take my chances. If they are a bad ride then I will adjust as needed. Seems like more people on the forum have their 5100's above 0 then at 0

 

[RonJR]

Remove shock nut on top first, then pull the shock out when removing the LCA.

Are you talking about the center top shock nut?

Do NOT remove the center top shock nut unless you have the LCA supported firmly on a floor jack and know exactly what you are doing, or unless you have the spring securely compressed with spring compressors! The center nut holds the spring in compression, and on a stock spring setup that force is still about 300 to 400 lbs when the suspension is fully extended. If you just innocently remove the top nut, the spring will decompress violently, driving the LCA down with great force and with a good chance of causing serious injury.

You can safely remove the 3 outside top nuts to pull the shock and spring assembly out as a unit if you want to take it somewhere to have it adjusted.

 

[watson6505]

Are you talking about the center top shock nut?

Do NOT remove the center top shock nut unless you have the LCA supported firmly on a floor jack and know exactly what you are doing, or unless you have the spring securely compressed with spring compressors! The center nut holds the spring in compression, and on a stock spring setup that force is still about 300 to 400 lbs when the suspension is fully extended. If you just innocently remove the top nut, the spring will decompress violently, driving the LCA down with great force and with a good chance of causing serious injury.

You can safely remove the 3 outside top nuts to pull the shock and spring assembly out as a unit if you want to take it somewhere to have it adjusted.

This is exactly my original understanding but I thought an earlier post was describing how "easy" it is to just get the shock out. I can get the entire assembly out with my eyes closed, but didn't think that removing the shock from the spring was something that was so easy or that I necessarily wanted to to it. I think I am starting to get the fact that you need to securely support the LCA with a jack because once you release the center nut, the spring will decompress pushing the LCA down with a lot of force. Once that force is slowly let out by the jack, you can, in theory, remove the shock alone and adjust the setting. Then you have to create an equal amount of force to be able to get the shock through the spring and up through the center hole to then reattach the nut. I am not sure I am interested in that process or not.

 

[RonJR]

This is exactly my original understanding but I thought an earlier post was describing how "easy" it is to just get the shock out. I can get the entire assembly out with my eyes closed, but didn't think that removing the shock from the spring was something that was so easy or that I necessarily wanted to to it. I think I am starting to get the fact that you need to securely support the LCA with a jack because once you release the center nut, the spring will decompress pushing the LCA down with a lot of force. Once that force is slowly let out by the jack, you can, in theory, remove the shock alone and adjust the setting. Then you have to create an equal amount of force to be able to get the shock through the spring and up through the center hole to then reattach the nut. I am not sure I am interested in that process or not.

The earlier post was dangerously wrong, which is why I posted. Your understanding is correct, and is the basis of the "no spring compressor method." Properly done, it's a safe method, but if you don't feel comfortable doing that and/or understand it fully, don't mess with it. Much better to pull the whole assembly, take it to a shop, and have them move the perch.

 

[irishrunner]

AT3 vs. KO2

Have had both sets on my rig. I barely got 40,000 out of the AT3. They were seriously dangerous after 40k. I have well over 40k on the K02 and they have at least another 40k left on them. Great tire in all conditions. Wonderful in snow. Best tires I have ever had.

 

[Throwback]

I've also run both. Actually I've run Nitto G2s, Cooper ATPs and AT3s, Michelin ATs, and KO2s.

Out of all of them the KO2s have been the best tire from summer road trips to winter trail rides - rain, snow, hot/dry. Mine have probably 30k+ miles and look basically brand new and are as smooth and quiet at Michelin LTXs.

Mine are stock size, C-Load, and I keep them around 38psi. My only real gripe is that they're kind of a gaudy tire and I wish they would make this size with black walls on both sides. With a 4Runner, even stock height, you get to see the white letters regardless of if they are in or out.

 

[slimjj]

The earlier post was dangerously wrong, which is why I posted. Your understanding is correct, and is the basis of the "no spring compressor method." Properly done, it's a safe method, but if you don't feel comfortable doing that and/or understand it fully, don't mess with it. Much better to pull the whole assembly, take it to a shop, and have them move the perch.

Just pull the whole strut assembly out, compress the spring with a spring compressor, lower the perch to 0 and decompress the spring. I'm not sure why everyone is terrified of spring compressors. Just lube the bolts and take your time. Took me 30 minutes to put mine together, for free.

It's actually even easier since the springs are compressed more than when you lower the perch, and you don't have to retighten/torque the top nut.

 

[slimjj]

And while I'm at it, my AT3s have been fantastic in the rain, and I live in Seattle area, so... Taken them in the snow many times and they are okay, not super, they are great on gravel and dirt. They are a great choice for mostly pavement driving.

Lots of folks out here seem to go with Toyo Open Country. The Cooper Discover ATPs look more aggressive and probably closer to KO2's.

 

[94toy22re]

When from at3 to ko2, In the same driving conditions the ko2 has been a much better tire! At3 started chuncking within the first 20k, had to replace them at 30k due not being able to balance. Currently have 40k on the Ko2s and have had no issues so far!

 

[oljedi11950]

Nope not gonna ! Just bought a set to replace my Atp (lt285s) to heavy . Had a set on son's 05 he loved em & went to school in Colo. for 2yrs all kinds of different conditions ,solid All terrain tyre ! And if buying a tire for tougher looking side wall hmmmm .

 

[having fun]

Just like Ron stated, as long as you have a jack under the LCA and pressure on it, it is safe,
AS LONG AS YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT YOUR DOING AND THE PRINCIPLE OF THIS METHOD.
You sounded like you where experienced mechanically incline, is why I posted it.
I do it this way myself and only takes under an hour in and out for me, but, I've been doing things like this for yrs, OK decades.

So, if not sure or not comfortable with this technique, DO NOT DO IT!


Edit... so like they say.

Just cause we are dumb a$$s, don't try this at home.

 

[watson6505]

Just like Ron stated, as long as you have a jack under the LCA and pressure on it, it is safe,
AS LONG AS YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT YOUR DOING AND THE PRINCIPLE OF THIS METHOD.
You sounded like you where experienced mechanically incline, is why I posted it.
I do it this way myself and only takes under an hour in and out for me, but, I've been doing things like this for yrs, OK decades.

So, if not sure or not comfortable with this technique, DO NOT DO IT!


Edit... so like they say.

Just cause we are dumb a$$s, don't try this at home.

thanks for the follow-up...I am mechanically inclined enough to install the lift, install rear spoiler, install bull bar, change out cv axles, cut out LCA, etc... That being said I have NEVER removed a spring from a shock and if there is something dangerous about it, I just want to make sure I fully understand the process and potential implications. I don't think that the .85 setting is going to make or break the ride on the truck but if the process is 'easy enough', I may give it a shot. I am certainly (unfortunately) very familiar with jacking the LCA up, letting it down, jacking it up, letting it down, etc.... just not yet with a compressed spring as part of the equation.

 

[Chreaus]

Springs and tires

I'll jump in on this. . . .

I just changed out the top bushing/rubber washer thing that sits between the spring and the top hat of the "strut" assembly.
I used the techniques mentioned. I'm definitely not afraid to turn a wrench. This was after installing my set-up with a professional 5 years ago. Took me 2-3 hours to take both sides apart and put back together. Forgot the driver side spacer when putting them back on. Took about and hour to redo that a few days later. Just keep an eye on the alignment. Thats where I saved time on the redo and it was sure noticeable.

Watch this video.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...=5E6u7dC7EHg&usg=AOvVaw3RTUIblJYn6hmrAQ-6V4AK

If that link doesn't work look for the "PART 1 TOYOTA TACOMA STRUTS INSTALL " on youtube.

And. . . .
I've have had the AT3's for 5 years now. About 50k on them. Regular 5 tire rotation and mostly pavement. Always great in rain, love them on snow (packed or fresh). Sounds like you might have decided on tires already though.

 

[watson6505]

And. . . .
I've have had the AT3's for 5 years now. About 50k on them. Regular 5 tire rotation and mostly pavement. Always great in rain, love them on snow (packed or fresh). Sounds like you might have decided on tires already though.

Yes, I did decide to go with the AT3 (thanks for the input) and ordered them on ebay last night with 100 savings code...all in $696. Then they emailed me today that they are out of stock until Friday so they will be delayed by about a week, so I called them and complained a little (alignment was setup for this Saturday and now Im gonna have to reschedule) and got them to also give me a $100 discount for the delay, new price $596. They are almost disposable at this point if I dont like them or KO2 comes with a Load C 275/70/17, I'm good!

 

[jreask]

Go with falken wildpeaks. If you are ruling out an E rated tire that makes me think this is going to be more daily driver than trail. At least the Wildpeaks have an aggresive look at a very attractive price. They look better than the AT3's too

They look good, but they were almost bald at 23K miles. Those were the worst wearing tire I ever owned and I have owned a bunch. You get what you pay for I guess.

 

[having fun]

thanks for the follow-up...I am mechanically inclined enough to install the lift, install rear spoiler, install bull bar, change out cv axles, cut out LCA, etc... That being said I have NEVER removed a spring from a shock and if there is something dangerous about it, I just want to make sure I fully understand the process and potential implications. I don't think that the .85 setting is going to make or break the ride on the truck but if the process is 'easy enough', I may give it a shot. I am certainly (unfortunately) very familiar with jacking the LCA up, letting it down, jacking it up, letting it down, etc.... just not yet with a compressed spring as part of the equation.

Wasn't trying to inply in general you wasn't, why I put "experience" in with that part.
You made it sound like you was a little gun shy, so to speak, without the pictures.

MY APOLOGIES.

In general it's a pretty easy process using this technic.

Also if you do lower the perch, you'll gain a little more wheel travel.