gamefreakgc
Elite Member
You can drop the IK22's in as-is. You don't have to gap them. The gap widens over time anyway because of our engine's wasted spark system.
The 3.4L TRD Supercharger Thread
- Thread starter SCRunner12
- Start date
You can drop the IK22's in as-is. You don't have to gap them. The gap widens over time anyway because of our engine's wasted spark system.
afg10000
New member
Thanks, everyone - I'll throw 'em in as is. I swear the 7th injector instructions said to gap them things to something like .043. I'm perfectly happy not messing with them as well.
michael33r
New member
Is there a thread somewhere about the value of the superchargers? I've searched and can't really find anything. There' a guy selling one who doesn't know how much to ask. It's a 1st gen, 80k miles (should be rebuilt), and it doesn't have any of the hardware with it.
Hepar
New member
I'd say if he was patient, he could get $6-800 for it. I personally wouldn't pay more than $3-400 considering the rebuild and parts needed. If you do get it, buy the dynamic tensioner and not the static one.
3rd Gen Supercharger maintenance
I have a 1999 with a supercharger that was installed as a "factory/dealership option." However I don't know what maintenance has been done to the supercharger. I bought it with 190,000 miles and from what I've read the fluids should be changed every 100,000. Is this very difficult to do? Or should I replace the internals as well? It seems to be working fine however there is no boost gauge so Im not sure as to what boost I am getting vs. what I should be getting. Any tips out there? and how difficult is it to add a boost gauge?
I have a 1999 with a supercharger that was installed as a "factory/dealership option." However I don't know what maintenance has been done to the supercharger. I bought it with 190,000 miles and from what I've read the fluids should be changed every 100,000. Is this very difficult to do? Or should I replace the internals as well? It seems to be working fine however there is no boost gauge so Im not sure as to what boost I am getting vs. what I should be getting. Any tips out there? and how difficult is it to add a boost gauge?
gamefreakgc
Elite Member
I will try and answer your questions as best I can:
1. The supercharger takes a special kind of oil, most commonly used is the GM supercharger oil: https://www.amazon.com/ACDelco-10-4...D=31181QAtJ%2BL&preST=_SX300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch. The last time I changed mine I needed more than one bottle. You don't have to take off the supercharger to change the oil if you have a way to suck the old oil out (small pump + small hose), otherwise you'll want to take off the entire supercharger and tilt the supercharge so it comes out the drain plug on the front. If the oil is black, it's bad. It should be clear to golden brown, much like gear oil. Brown = dirty/burnt.
2. If you have the grey one, leave it alone until it needs attention with excessive noise or noise/play in the pulley. If you have a black one, you can simply replace the entire nose cone assembly and refill with oil and you are done. No need to replace anything beyond the nose cone unless you have had a catastrophic failure. These supercharges are simple in operation and do not need regular maintanence. My supercharger with 190,000 miles when I got it only needed a new nose cone and oil.
3. Boost gauges require you to tap the boost line and run it into the cab, plus figuring out where to mount the gauge itself. Not hard, but can be frustrating if you've never done it before. Almost 100% of boost loss is caused by vacuum leaks downstream of the supercharger or loose/cracked boost hoses, so start there if you think you have a leak. Otherwise drive happy.
The first post in this thread has a lot of good info.
If you call Magnuson they are $5 I believe. Only down side is you cant buy them off the website you have to order over the phone.
I might be able to find you a part number if needed.
Also what are you guys seeing for MPGs?
pygmy warrior
New member
My mpg is about the same as long as I am not in boost. I lose a little if I have to put my foot in it, but most of my driving is towing a camper.
gamefreakgc
Elite Member
What total timing advance do you guys see at WOT? I'm seeing 13.5 degrees in lower RPM's with it floored up to 15 degrees at redline. This seems low to me but I have nothing to compare it to.
Speedy
Member
Sounds about right based on my memory. Then whatever you have pulled in your tune will kick in and it's even less.
After the water/meth and zeroing out the timing table in my tune so it didn't pull any, I see A LOT more, like 14 to start off and ramps up to 20 or so.
gamefreakgc
Elite Member
I have no timing being pulled, the timing map is all 0's except for at 2000 RPM to help with some pinging I get on really hot days. So there is something wrong, I wonder if my sensors are on their way out. The engine runs so good though.
If you have a chance, could you pull up your timing and do a WOT run to confirm you're seeing near 20? That means I have 5 degrees of timing I can gain back, which is roughly 10-15 HP on the table.
Speedy
Member
I'm sure I see 20. Keep in mind I have water/meth injection though. Do you?
gamefreakgc
Elite Member
Yeah, water meth makes up about 12% of my total fuel, so I'm definitely spraying enough in. I'm just not sure I'm getting the full potential out of the engine.
At partial boost before open loop, I see 20's as well. It's only at 100% throttle in open loop is where I lose all the timing advance.
Speedy
Member
Hmmmm, could be a couple of things. You're not pulling any timing in the tune so the PCM is doing it for some reason. Any STKR at WOT? What's the AFR? How much boost? Ambient Temp? Spark plug gap?
When I was dialing in my meth injection I noticed an odd occurrence. If the mixture was too rich, it would pull timing. Also I had some worn out spark plugs initially and had a miss and that also caused timing to be pulled.
Mine seems to like a low 11 to low 12 AFR with it pulling harder the leaner it gets. Above 12.5 there is no discernible change in power so I keep it below that point even though I don't see any STKR when it's in the 13s.
Also, make sure your water/meth mix is right. It took me a bit of testing to find the sweet spot. Too much water and it'll bog (pull timing too).
I have a vid on my YouTube channel of the mix I use.
I also show a data log from the 4Runner in the meth injection install video - part 2
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-g...meth-injection-install-video.html#post2637147
5 degrees if timing is a lot more than only 11HP. In the Challenger we see about 10HP per degree of timing when tuning for power....probably less in the 4Runner, but not by much I'd say.
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gamefreakgc
Elite Member
I've got it tuned pretty good as well. Did a bit of dyno tuning plus some good 'ol fashioned road tuning. You and I almost have an identical setup I think. AFR's start in mid 11's at WOT, and finish at 12.0 at 5500. 11 PSI and put a brand new set of IK22's at 0.32 gap. Methanol injection was at a 50/50 mix but it was not very happy (was the spark plugs) so I started using 66/33 methanol.
I'm wondering if I should try 3-step colder plugs, the IK24's. There's no sign of fouling after 27k miles on my old 2-step colder NGK plugs, so I bet I could get away with it and help with potential spark knock. Would bring combustion temps down as well a little.
I have no way of measuring how much knock is affecting timing, I can only read my total timing advance via the Torque App. However I was at 15 degrees total at WOT with 50/50 mix, 66/33 mix, and with a brand new set of plugs. So far none of that has even budged the timing. I'm going to try an octane booster next to see if it's my fuel. If not then I think I will try colder plugs.
Speedy
Member
Hmmmm, I don't think you need 3 step colder plugs especially with meth injection.
When you say unhappy at 50/50 what do you mean? Is the 66/33 more meth or more water?
gamefreakgc
Elite Member
More meth. The engine was bucking due to incomplete combustion but it was the plugs, the gap was too big (had eroded to .045!)
Speedy
Member
Yeah that's def too much gap. I have mine at .032 which I think is where you're at now.
Mine also liked a bit more meth so the 66/33 meth/water ratio should be good.
Here's a data log from mine. Ran this in Torque and dumped in to Excel to build the graph.
gamefreakgc
Elite Member
Yeah that's def too much gap. I have mine at .032 which I think is where you're at now.
Mine also liked a bit more meth so the 66/33 meth/water ratio should be good.
Here's a data log from mine. Ran this in Torque and dumped in to Excel to build the graph.
Thanks, this is super helpful to compare to! I haven't tracked timing in a third gear pull for a while, I wonder if that's the difference? Only one place I can safely go that fast. Your second gear timing is pretty close to what I'm seeing, you have a few more degrees though. I actually don't really care what timing I run in a third gear pull, since Ill never see it lol! I also run about half the methanol that you do, my nozzle is approximately 3.5 gph, that is if our pumps are the same PSI.
I have a few more tricks I'm going to try. If it's my fuel, I'm trying Boostane, which has some nice dyno runs showing it increased power by advancing timing. Not expensive either.
If that doesn't work, I'll try MAF tuning into tricking the engine the load is less. Maybe even fiddle with the IAT... not sure how our ECU's work though.
If that doesn't work I'll try a step colder plugs. I asked the facebook group and several run IK24's, especially if they run the 2.1" pulley.
If by all that my timing hasn't budged then I'll live with it!
