Toyota may bring back small FJ Cruiser to Challenge Wrangler

[2016 4Runner SR5]

While it would be cool to see the FJ again, Toyota has never beat Jeep offroad. With that said, the Wrangler is still the only true Jeep left on the road IMO It'll be interesting but i'm sure the Wrangler will continue to outperform the FJ offroad stock for stock as it always had. There's just something about the Jeep 4wd system that is very hard to beat.

 

[hikenbike]

From factory, Rubicon has:



- 4:1 LO range (crawl ratio of 77:1 with automatic and 84:1 with manual)



- “Dana 44” axles that are much stronger and feature a different ring and pinion (210 mm/8.27 inches front and 220 mm/8.66 inches rear on Rubicon)...based on Dana’s new Advantek design



- Front and rear lockers



- Front axle disconnect that is improved upon



- Standard rock sliders



- 33-inch-tall LT285/70R17 BFGoodrich All-Terrain KO tires



- Ample clearances & angles (impressive 10.9-inch running ground clearance, an approach angle of 44 degrees, breakover angle of 27.8 degrees, and a departure angle of 37 degrees)



- 30 inches of water fording (with standard breather tubes on both axles)



- Available Diesel engine next year with 260 hp and 442 lb-ft of torque...add that to 4:1 LO range...yikes!



So, yeah, i doubt that any stock (or even most modified) Toyota vehicles can follow a Rubicon on the trail. You have to really trick out your 4runner with $$$ aftermarket parts to match what the Rubicon has off-road in terms of capability.



But, yeah, the argument against Jeep is reliability and on-road performance. But at least, Jeep claims that on-road performance is improving. So, will see.

Meh...... the 33’s aren’t standard and Rubicon’s are pretty damn expensive too. The 4Runner Trail (or whatever it is called these days) and Rubicon will be with $3-5k of each other “similarly equipped”. At those totals around the $40k range, the difference is negligible. In any event, the 4Runner will do the job without a doubt.


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[Thai]

Meh...... the 33’s aren’t standard and Rubicon’s are pretty damn expensive too. The 4Runner Trail (or whatever it is called these days) and Rubicon will be with $3-5k of each other “similarly equipped”. At those totals around the $40k range, the difference is negligible. In any event, the 4Runner will do the job without a doubt.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Huh?!

“33-INCH BFGOODRICH KO2™ ALL-TERRAIN TIRES
The Wrangler Rubicon comes standard with new 33-inch BFGoodrich KO2™ All-Terrain tires. Tough, durable and capable of delivering superior traction, the taller tire gives Wrangler an outstanding 10.9-inch ground clearance.”

So you’re saying that a stock 4Runner can keep up with a standard Rubicon off-road???

I will have whatever you’re smoking!!

 

[CO-Cygnus]

From factory, Rubicon has:

- 4:1 LO range (crawl ratio of 77:1 with automatic and 84:1 with manual)

- “Dana 44” axles that are much stronger and feature a different ring and pinion (210 mm/8.27 inches front and 220 mm/8.66 inches rear on Rubicon)...based on Dana’s new Advantek design

- Front and rear lockers

- Front axle disconnect that is improved upon

- Standard rock sliders

- 33-inch-tall LT285/70R17 BFGoodrich All-Terrain KO tires

- Ample clearances & angles (impressive 10.9-inch running ground clearance, an approach angle of 44 degrees, breakover angle of 27.8 degrees, and a departure angle of 37 degrees)

- 30 inches of water fording (with standard breather tubes on both axles)

- Available Diesel engine next year with 260 hp and 442 lb-ft of torque...add that to 4:1 LO range...yikes!

So, yeah, i doubt that any stock (or even most modified) Toyota vehicles can follow a Rubicon on the trail. You have to really trick out your 4runner with $$$ aftermarket parts to match what the Rubicon has off-road in terms of capability.

But, yeah, the argument against Jeep is reliability and on-road performance. But at least, Jeep claims that on-road performance is improving. So, will see.

You'd think this would pressure Toyota to up their game... but we're still probably going to get a Camry engine and a lazy 6-speed programmed for MPG > * in the next 4R.

 

[jus10]

You'd think this would pressure Toyota to up their game... but we're still probably going to get a Camry engine and a lazy 6-speed programmed for MPG > * in the next 4R.

Yeah Toyota doesn't seem to do the competition thing too well. Though they should.

 

[LandCruiser]

From factory, Rubicon has:

- 4:1 LO range (crawl ratio of 77:1 with automatic and 84:1 with manual)

- “Dana 44” axles that are much stronger and feature a different ring and pinion (210 mm/8.27 inches front and 220 mm/8.66 inches rear on Rubicon)...based on Dana’s new Advantek design

- Front and rear lockers

- Front axle disconnect that is improved upon

- Standard rock sliders

- 33-inch-tall LT285/70R17 BFGoodrich All-Terrain KO tires

- Ample clearances & angles (impressive 10.9-inch running ground clearance, an approach angle of 44 degrees, breakover angle of 27.8 degrees, and a departure angle of 37 degrees)

- 30 inches of water fording (with standard breather tubes on both axles)

- Available Diesel engine next year with 260 hp and 442 lb-ft of torque...add that to 4:1 LO range...yikes!

So, yeah, i doubt that any stock (or even most modified) Toyota vehicles can follow a Rubicon on the trail. You have to really trick out your 4runner with $$$ aftermarket parts to match what the Rubicon has off-road in terms of capability.

But, yeah, the argument against Jeep is reliability and on-road performance. But at least, Jeep claims that on-road performance is improving. So, will see.

That is a ridiculous amount of off-road features you get standard. And breather tubes are a nice touch.

It’s obvious that jeep is really doing their homework and building an off-the-shelf off road vehicle that really doesn’t need any modifications, unless you just absolutely need a taller suspension and bigger tires.

If Toyota wants to compete with something like this, they would have to make a complete ground up design with startling attention to details. The FJ cruiser was just a modified Prado platform with numerous inherent shortcomings that originated from its hasty and derivative design.

What kills the Jeep is that it’s a miserable vehicle to use as a daily driver when the weather is shit. Like today. I’m in the middle of the winter storm, and I wouldn’t want to be driving down the highway in a leaky, drafty Wrangler that lets the heat out and the elements in. The other problem would be the on road mannerisms of solid front axle vehicles, although the death wobble seems to be most pronounced in jeeps while I never experienced that in my 70 series Land Cruiser wagon.

If Toyota is not serious about appealing to its small, albeit loyal, 4x4 customer base, I may just get a short wheelbase wrangler, or maybe a wrangler pick up as a second truck.

 

[LandCruiser]

Yeah Toyota doesn't seem to do the competition thing too well. Though they should.

At one point they called the Tundra TRD pro a “Raptor fighter.”

That’s like saying Rhonda Rousey could beat up Mike Tyson.

 

[albertschmitz]

The JL Wrangler has addressed most of the failings of the JK and earlier Wranglers..

Having owned 5 of them the price of the new Wrangler is just more than I want to spend so a Used 99 4Runner came in and I always wanted to have one so I bought it for the "fun" vehicle and leased an F-150 for the better ride and trucks part of what I needed.

 

[elemint]

Pretty cool! A bit to much like a Subaru in shape. A more upright version would be more of a Jeep competitor...
As long as it isn't from Car and Driver I will read it. C&D has become a garbage.

I copied and pasted the whole article in the original post, but here it is


Toyota May Bring Back Small FJ Cruiser to Challenge Jeep Wrangler - Motor Trend

 

[RAD4Runner]

...

FUGly. Ricer Styling looks too busy looks more like a Transformer/Civic to compete with Subaru than a no-nonsense off-road machine. Like someone says, Toyota Over-styles it; ricer-styles it.
The G-Wagon generally looks the same now as it did when it first came out.
The Defender generally looks the same now as it did when it first came out.
What's wrong with this?

 

[Jetboy]

At one point they called the Tundra TRD pro a “Raptor fighter.”

That’s like saying Rhonda Rousey could beat up Mike Tyson.

You know the Tundra is actually far more successful in desert racing than the Raptor right? If winning desert racing events is the goal - Tundra >>> Raptor.

 

[LandCruiser]

You know the Tundra is actually far more successful in desert racing than the Raptor right? If winning desert racing events is the goal - Tundra >>> Raptor.

And they sell a long travel desert racing truck with ungodly HP and torque ready to go out of the dealer showroom?

Oh, wait, they don't.

 

[Jetboy]

Huh?!

“33-INCH BFGOODRICH KO2™ ALL-TERRAIN TIRES
The Wrangler Rubicon comes standard with new 33-inch BFGoodrich KO2™ All-Terrain tires. Tough, durable and capable of delivering superior traction, the taller tire gives Wrangler an outstanding 10.9-inch ground clearance.”

So you’re saying that a stock 4Runner can keep up with a standard Rubicon off-road???

I will have whatever you’re smoking!!

Depends on what you mean "off road" - rock crawling, no. Not stock. 50mph in the whoops - of course the 4runner will run circles around the wrangler. The 4runner is not a specialist. Never has been. It can run the rubicon and the baja 1000. No jeep can do that. No Raptor that can do that.

 

[Jetboy]

And they sell a long travel desert racing truck with ungodly HP and torque ready to go out of the dealer showroom?

Oh, wait, they don't.

Nope. Neither does Ford. The raptor is not a desert race truck. It's a paper tiger dressed up like a desert race truck. Checking boxes on paper does not a race truck make. Only one of them has won the Baja 1000. The Tacoma raced in the same Mint 400 last year - only one finished. It wasn't the Raptor... The fact is that if you put both a Raptor and a Tundra on the start line of a desert race, the results show that the Tundra is more likely to finish, and more likely to win. So will the Tacoma. Incidentally - the 4runner even has a better desert race pedigree than the Raptor.

 

[Bigrupp]

You guys can spend your money on all that fancy sh!t and worry about who has the neatest buttons to push. I'll keep cruising my 04 with all the lockers and armor and stuff (that cost way less). Then when you guys move on to the next shiny toy I'll buy your old used one. Cause lets face it, you guys arent gonna go out and really beat on them like they deserve and I'll run it forever too. Thank you. Should you ever need a new way to waste your money- I take donations[emoji6]

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[Thai]

Depends on what you mean "off road" - rock crawling, no. Not stock. 50mph in the whoops - of course the 4runner will run circles around the wrangler. The 4runner is not a specialist. Never has been. It can run the rubicon and the baja 1000. No jeep can do that. No Raptor that can do that.

You must not be familiar with the FJ Cruiser fender frame bend/crack that was prevalent even without jumping.....

You must not be familiar with 4runner’s own motor mount frame failure.....

And no, a stock 4runner canNOT do the Rubicon trail.

 

[FactoryRide]

You must not be familiar with the FJ Cruiser fender frame bend/crack that was prevalent even without jumping.....

You must not be familiar with 4runner’s own motor mount frame failure.....

And no, a stock 4runner canNOT do the Rubicon trail.

Didn't they test the 5th gen on the Rubicon prior to them being officially released? Maybe a set of a sliders and tires, but that appears to be all.

2010 Toyota 4Runner Rubicon Trail First Drive

 

[Thai]

Didn't they test the 5th gen on the Rubicon prior to them being officially released? Maybe a set of a sliders and tires, but that appears to be all.

2010 Toyota 4Runner Rubicon Trail First Drive

Tires and sliders. And how much damage did it suffer (cosmetically)?

A Jeep Rubicon comes STANDARD with tires and sliders, 4:1 transfer case, and lockers front & rear. And add in there close to 11” of clearance and superb approach and departure angles. I am pretty sure that the Rubicon will outperform any equivalent 4runner over the Rubicon trail.

I am not shitting on the 4runner but you cannot deny physics and traction properties. 4runner is a far better all-arounder (on-road and off-road) while Jeep is purely off-road minded.

 

[TacoRunn0517]

Tires and sliders. And how much damage did it suffer (cosmetically)?

A Jeep Rubicon comes STANDARD with tires and sliders, 4:1 transfer case, and lockers front & rear. And add in there close to 11” of clearance and superb approach and departure angles. I am pretty sure that the Rubicon will outperform any equivalent 4runner over the Rubicon trail.

I am not shitting on the 4runner but you cannot deny physics and traction properties. 4runner is a far better all-arounder (on-road and off-road) while Jeep is purely off-road minded.

The only way to look at it and part of the reason why I'll always want one haha.

 

[Rightside Up]

The only way to look at it and part of the reason why I'll always want one haha.

Do it!