Trailer Hitch Question

[richlentz]

I just purchased an 03 4runner Sport with V-8, built Jan. of 03, as per door jam sticker. The factory installed hitch cross member is hidden within bumper and the receiver is rather short. I want to tow a 5000 pound fully loaded 18' travel trailer. I already have a Weight Dist set up with the trailer, but the shank hits the spare tire before the pin holes line-up; plus the hitch looks a little inadequate for my application. The manual states up to 7300 pounds but there is no info on hitch anywhere. Do I need to purchase an aftermarket hitch?

Any info appreciated.
Rich

 

[TechWrench]

I just purchased an 03 4runner Sport with V-8, built Jan. of 03, as per door jam sticker. The factory installed hitch cross member is hidden within bumper and the receiver is rather short. I want to tow a 5000 pound fully loaded 18' travel trailer. I already have a Weight Dist set up with the trailer, but the shank hits the spare tire before the pin holes line-up; plus the hitch looks a little inadequate for my application. The manual states up to 7300 pounds but there is no info on hitch anywhere. Do I need to purchase an aftermarket hitch?

Any info appreciated.
Rich

As I recall, there was a production change some time in the middle of the '03 year for the V8 hitches. After a certain date (don't know the exact date), all V8's had a better frame mounted hitch installed. And, I believe there was a TSB, that wasn't advertised, to upgrade V8 manufactured before the production change date if the customer requested it. You need to check how your hitch is mounted on the vehicle. The lighter duty models were bolted to a crossmember just behind the bumper cover, while the heavier duty models were a complete assembly that bolted directly to the two main frame members on each side. The light duty model is not designed for any type of weight distribution system. If you have the light duty model, you will need to upgrade the hitch with an aftemarket one. There are several available. As for the problem with the ball mount hitting the spare, that is normal. If it is just a bit, some (like me) have had success with lowering the spare and pushing it as far forward as possible when raising it again. Others have had to cut some of the bar off to make it fit. It just depends on the manufacturer of the ball mount. I use a mix of the factory mount, and several NAPA units, and they all will work. I use an equalizer hitch system for my camper, and it works.

 

[jetboy1975]

Techwrench pretty much summed it up. The 7300lb rating is for the 2x4 model with a frame mount hitch. The 4x4 is down to 7000lbs. You're restricted to 5000lbs with the cross member mount hitch and it's not to be used with a weight distributing hitch. The forces of the torsion bars can twist the xmember and cause irrepairable frame damage. Curt 13445 and Hidden Hitch 70779 are good bolt on upgrades. The are reasonably priced and can be installed in 10 minutes. The hard part is getting the old one off (took me 1.5hrs)

I have the Curt model and am very happy with it. Had to modify the 7pin plug mount slightly. I still had issues with the WDH draw bar length hitting the spare. I ended up cutting 2 inches off and redrilling a new pin hole but now it's perfect. The 2 inches was beyond the hitch box so it served no purpose anyway and the trailer being 2" closer is better for WD and sway too.

Do a search on here for those hitches and you'll see lots of posts.

 

[ddwilson1]

I ended up cutting some of the length off the end of the insert did not seem to
make any difference last 3 + years, my winter D ring insert was short enough it did not need to be cut off.
Doug

 

[jetboy1975]

There's a Curt hitch for sale on the classified page for $75.
See here
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/classifieds-buy-sell-anything-related-toyota-4runner-no-commercial-ads-please/79587-fs-oem-seat-covers-sunvisors-curt-hitch.html

 

[richlentz]

Thanks for the info. Should have checked your second reply before buying a new one on line. It was only $150 w/shipping.... I'm curious, how heavy is your trailer and what kind of mpg can I expect while towing?
Rich

 

[jetboy1975]

Mine's 19 feet (only 7.5 wide) and weighs 3200lbs dry. I weighed it loaded, ready to camp, but tanks empty and it is just shy of 3800lbs. Tows easily but headwinds still suck gas bad.

I average around 12-13mpg but have seen as low as 8mpg in a strong headwind. I should add that I tow around 65mph in 4th gear and don't baby it in the hills, so I could probably milk it for better. 4th is recommended for towing purposes and you will get better mileage and less driveline strain this way even though the rpms are higher.

That 5000lbs weight you list, is that max gross weight or what it will weigh with your gear in it? Seems pretty heavy for an 18'er. Make sure you have a good brake controller. Prodigy is the best for the buck IMO.

Happy camping.

 

[TechWrench]

Thanks for the info. Should have checked your second reply before buying a new one on line. It was only $150 w/shipping.... I'm curious, how heavy is your trailer and what kind of mpg can I expect while towing?
Rich

My camper is 26' long, with a fully loaded weight of 5,300lbs. It pulls OK on the flat, but the V6 does struggle on the hills, have to use 4th, somethimes 3rd, and I leave it out of OD. I don't haul it too far, mostly under 100 miles each way. Gas mileage suffers, as low as 8 mpg, depending on terrain.

 

[jetboy1975]

My camper is 26' long, with a fully loaded weight of 5,300lbs. It pulls OK on the flat, but the V6 does struggle on the hills, have to use 4th, somethimes 3rd, and I leave it out of OD. I don't haul it too far, mostly under 100 miles each way. Gas mileage suffers, as low as 8 mpg, depending on terrain.

That can't be a comfortable experience. I started towing my 3800lbs with a V6 Limited. That lasted about 3 short trips before I'd had enough and traded for a V8. To each his own I guess. Good luck with the insurance company if you ever get into an accident being overweight like that.

On a side note the '03 V6s only have 4 speeds. If you want to save your tranny you should leave it in 3rd when towing.

 

[TechWrench]

That can't be a comfortable experience. I started towing my 3800lbs with a V6 Limited. That lasted about 3 short trips before I'd had enough and traded for a V8. To each his own I guess. Good luck with the insurance company if you ever get into an accident being overweight like that.

On a side note the '03 V6s only have 4 speeds. If you want to save your tranny you should leave it in 3rd when towing.

All things being equal, I would rather have a V8, but it is not financially possible at this time. I am not worried about any insurance issue, according to the owners manual, with the upgraded hitch, and a weight distribution system, my V6 is rated to 6,300 lbs. So I am within in those limits. The 5,000lb limit is for the ligher duty hitch, which I no longer have. I recognize the weight I am pulling, and adjust my driving accordingly. I am not uncomfortable when I tow the camper, just extra cautious and don't rush to get to my destination.

As for the gear thing, I misspoke. I do use 3rd instead of 4th (OD) in my trans. I would not tow this setup across country, but in keeping my trips to under 100 miles, I am not concerned with the three or four trips a year I make.

 

[jetboy1975]

Hey Tech, sorry I didn't mean to come across sounding condescending. I've come across a lot of guys on here and other forums (and on the road for that matter) that are towing beyond their, or their vehicles capabilities without knowing it. I shouldn't have assumed you hadn't done the upgrades to get the 6300lbs rating.

For a few short trips here and there I would have kept the V6 too. It'll handle the weight no prob. I found it struggled more with the wind resistance. I guess I'm a little impatient. (can't stand being stuck behind trucks and crawling up hills) plus I tow 6-8000 miles each summer so the V6 wasn't going to cut it for me.

I wanted to ask, how do you find towing with that length? any sway issues? I'm looking to sell my hybrid in the spring and get something a little bigger(24-26').

 

[TechWrench]

Hey Tech, sorry I didn't mean to come across sounding condescending. I've come across a lot of guys on here and other forums (and on the road for that matter) that are towing beyond their, or their vehicles capabilities without knowing it. I shouldn't have assumed you hadn't done the upgrades to get the 6300lbs rating.

For a few short trips here and there I would have kept the V6 too. It'll handle the weight no prob. I found it struggled more with the wind resistance. I guess I'm a little impatient. (can't stand being stuck behind trucks and crawling up hills) plus I tow 6-8000 miles each summer so the V6 wasn't going to cut it for me.

I wanted to ask, how do you find towing with that length? any sway issues? I'm looking to sell my hybrid in the spring and get something a little bigger(24-26').

No problem. I understand your concern, and I appreciate your imput. I also have seen individuals towing way beyond their vehicle capacity, and it can be scary to be behind or along side one. Even if the vehicle is below its tow limits, if the driver is not experienced or comfortable with towing heavier loads, it can be a recipe for potential disaster.

As for how my setup handles. OK, as I said, as long as I take it easy. I haven't had any sway problems with the equalizer hitch setup I am using. I highly recommend it, just be sure you follow the installation and setup instructions carefully. There are those who think that anything less than a 1 ton duel wheel setup is a too little for anything more than a utility or small boat trailer, and will slam anyone who does. I can't see investing in a truck like that for the amount of towing I do a year. I like my 4Runner too much to give it up.

Thanks again for your imput.

 

[Kmvreter]

...
For a few short trips here and there I would have kept the V6 too. It'll handle the weight no prob. I found it struggled more with the wind resistance. I guess I'm a little impatient. (can't stand being stuck behind trucks and crawling up hills) plus I tow 6-8000 miles each summer so the V6 wasn't going to cut it for me.

I wanted to ask, how do you find towing with that length? any sway issues? I'm looking to sell my hybrid in the spring and get something a little bigger(24-26').

Not looking to hijack this thread but just a continuation...

jetboy1975,

I realize you have upgraded but your past experience is what I'm looking at for my situation. I've towed plenty with lower trailers and boats so I have a comfort with what my T4R can do.

I'm looking to do a one time tow of a 19' dual axle hybrid. Actual weight is 3500 lbs and I'm not adding any gear or loading up the T4R. I have the 5000 lb weight carrying hitch plus Airlift spring bags. Upgrading to the WD hitch isn't an option for this one event so I won't have any sway control. I'm not sure how stable it was for the former user who towed it with an Equinox without WD or sway control.

Even though I'm within all the weight spec's my question is how stable will this setup be? Again, it's a one time event on the highway but whether I tow 10 miles or 1000 miles shouldn't matter, I want to be safe. Will it have alot of sway due to the high profile or will it still track OK due to the dual axles?

Another question is what model of Prodigy brake controller do you have or recommend? I may be able to borrow a simple timer unit (Curt Venturer(?)) Will this be adequate? If not then I want to buy the right one.

 

[jetboy1975]

kmvreter, you'll be fine with that trailer, just take your time and leave extra space. I towed my 19' lots of times with a regular hitch with no issues. Just be careful with the big trucks as they can suck you in. I mainly used the WDH because it came with the trailer. Didn't need it but might as well use it. Made for a more comfortable ride with less bounce. You can buy a friction bar type sway control system to be used with a regular hitch as well if you're concerned. They bolt on easy and are only around $60 Check out this page. You'll need a sway control adapter too ($35, bolts under the ball and holds the small ball mount for the sway bar)

As for the brake controller I have a Prodigy P2. It works awesome. Easy install and adjustments and relatively cheap. It's an inertial type which is way smoother operating than the timer style. If you have to pay to have it wired and installed you may want to fork out the little extra for the Prodigy.

 

[Kmvreter]

kmvreter, you'll be fine with that trailer, just take your time and leave extra space. I towed my 19' lots of times with a regular hitch with no issues. Just be careful with the big trucks as they can suck you in. I mainly used the WDH because it came with the trailer. Didn't need it but might as well use it. Made for a more comfortable ride with less bounce. You can buy a friction bar type sway control system to be used with a regular hitch as well if you're concerned. They bolt on easy and are only around $60 Check out this page. You'll need a sway control adapter too ($35, bolts under the ball and holds the small ball mount for the sway bar)

As for the brake controller I have a Prodigy P2. It works awesome. Easy install and adjustments and relatively cheap. It's an inertial type which is way smoother operating than the timer style. If you have to pay to have it wired and installed you may want to fork out the little extra for the Prodigy.

Thanks for the info.

Done a fair bit of utility towing so I've got time and space with common sense. It's a one time tow. No sway control it is. I've actually towed a heavier dual axle low utility trailer a short distance on the highway without sway but thought the camper's height and cross section might cause an issue.

Also, that heavy trailer had brakes but I didn't have a controller. Thought I might get one if I can't borrow one for this trip. It will always come in handy. I'll try fleaBay. Wiring is a snap because of the harness that came with the truck.

 

[jetboy1975]

Strong gusty crosswinds and passing trucks can be a problem. Just slow down and it's fine. Where in Ontaro are you and how far do you have to go?

 

[TechWrench]

Not looking to hijack this thread but just a continuation...

I'm looking to do a one time tow of a 19' dual axle hybrid. Actual weight is 3500 lbs and I'm not adding any gear or loading up the T4R. I have the 5000 lb weight carrying hitch plus Airlift spring bags. Upgrading to the WD hitch isn't an option for this one event so I won't have any sway control. I'm not sure how stable it was for the former user who towed it with an Equinox without WD or sway control.

Even though I'm within all the weight spec's my question is how stable will this setup be? Again, it's a one time event on the highway but whether I tow 10 miles or 1000 miles shouldn't matter, I want to be safe. Will it have alot of sway due to the high profile or will it still track OK due to the dual axles? You should be alright with the regular hitch, with a few things to consider. 1st, try to have the trailer frame ride as close to level as possible, this will equalize the load between the two trailer axles and help prevent sway from uneven axle loading. 2nd, if possible, try to have the amount of tongue weight equal to between 12 and 15% of the total trailer weight. If the tongue weight is too light, that can add to the potential for sway, and if it is too heavy, it will cause the front of the TV to ride light and cause light steering and tracking problems. Side winds and drafts caused by passing vehicles can cause sway issues, so be aware and try not to over correct when/if you do get sway.

Another question is what model of Prodigy brake controller do you have or recommend? I may be able to borrow a simple timer unit (Curt Venturer(?)) Will this be adequate? If not then I want to buy the right one.

The prodigy controllers are good, just be sure to hook it up correctly, and follow the setup and adjustment procedures. If it is not ajdusted properly, either the brakes on the trailer will lock up and cause the trailer to skid, or not grab enough and allow the trailer to 'push' the TV

 

[Kmvreter]

Thanks guys for all the info and advice. I know what being "pushed" by 2 tons feels like. The T4R brakes could handle it short term with a long coast to slow down but don't want to drive like that. I know what you mean about proper loading because I want to avoid "the tail wagging the dog."

Actually not sure if this 200 Km tow (mostly Hwy 401) is going to happen. Just planning and possibly helping out a buddy to deliver it if he can't.

Nothing personal but I'd rather not say where I'm at.

 

[Kmvreter]

...As for the brake controller I have a Prodigy P2. It works awesome. Easy install and adjustments and relatively cheap. It's an inertial type which is way smoother operating than the timer style....

Just an update. Got a Prodigy on the way.
What power level setting did you use with your 19' hybrid and which boost setting, if you used it? I realize it will need adjustment but I just want to use this as a reference starting point.

 

[jetboy1975]

I'll have to look tomorrow but I believe I have it at B2 and then set the Gain control so that I can use full manual control without locking up. To set, drive on a straight level road around 35-45km/hr, engage the trailer brakes slightly for a bit to warm them up, then stop using the manual control for the trailer. If the wheels lockup, back it off slighly and try again. Once it's set you shouldn't have to re-adjust.