What can I do to stabilize

[jminz]

Recent daystar 2.5/1" with 265/70 tires. Spidertrax.

Any hint of wind or unevenness in surface and I'm wandering all over the road. What can I do to stabilize my ride. It has been aligned twice since lift. Neither my mechanic nor alignment specialist indicated tie rods or anything needed replacing.

 

[mrpurplepenguin]

Aftermarket upper control arms.

They'll allow you to get more caster in the front suspension == your vehicle will track straighter at speed and will be less responsive to bumps, ruts, or other road imperfections.

Do you have your most recent alignment printout? I'd guess you only have 1-2* of caster right now.

 

[unevolved]

What are your alignment specs? Almost sounds like you don't have enough toe-in.

 

[jminz]

Aftermarket upper control arms.

They'll allow you to get more caster in the front suspension == your vehicle will track straighter at speed and will be less responsive to bumps, ruts, or other road imperfections.

Do you have your most recent alignment printout? I'd guess you only have 1-2* of caster right now.

Caster currently within spec


FL:
Camber .6
Caster 3.1
Toe .07

FR:
Camber .2
Caster 2.9
Toe .05

 

[jminz]

Could this be a symtom of bad sway bar end links? I'll post a pic later when I get off to show what shape they are in.

 

[gm350reratliff]

Aftermarket upper control arms.

They'll allow you to get more caster in the front suspension == your vehicle will track straighter at speed and will be less responsive to bumps, ruts, or other road imperfections.

Do you have your most recent alignment printout? I'd guess you only have 1-2* of caster right now.

This is what I was thinking.

Caster currently within spec


FL:
Camber .6
Caster 3.1
Toe .07

FR:
Camber .2
Caster 2.9
Toe .05

Actually, those don't sound too bad but it would probably make a big improvement with aftermarket UCA's and adjusting the caster to 4°. Wheels with less back spacing (or wheel spacers) will help as well.

Also, worn out parts such as tie rod ends, or control arm bushings can also cause what you're feeling. Sway bar bushings or end links don't typically cause what you're feeling.

 

[jminz]

This is what I was thinking.



Actually, those don't sound too bad but it would probably make a big improvement with aftermarket UCA's and adjusting the caster to 4°. Wheels with less back spacing (or wheel spacers) will help as well.

Also, worn out parts such as tie rod ends, or control arm bushings can also cause what you're feeling. Sway bar bushings or end links don't typically cause what you're feeling.

I'm running stock wheels with spidertrax spacers. I'm check bushings and tie rods I suppose.

 

[blackoutt]

I just got mine aligned to 4 degrees caster with SPC upper arms (3.9 actually) -.3 camber and slightly toed in and it pulls all over crowns and bumpsteers. 3/2 lift, stock wheels, all pro spacers. Every bushing, bearing, ball joint, and link in the front end is new minus the steering rack and CV shafts (but they've been repacked and booted). So I'm thinking less caster would make it a little more stable.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

I just got mine aligned to 4 degrees caster with SPC upper arms (3.9 actually) -.3 camber and slightly toed in and it pulls all over crowns and bumpsteers. 3/2 lift, stock wheels, all pro spacers. Every bushing, bearing, ball joint, and link in the front end is new minus the steering rack and CV shafts (but they've been repacked and booted). So I'm thinking less caster would make it a little more stable.

Interesting... I have mine set at 4.1 for Caster on both sides and .1 for Camber on both sides. It does drift somewhat along crowns and angled roads (depends on the severity of the angle,), but nothing a degree or two adjustment of the steering wheel while driving doesn't fix. I haven't had issues with bumpsteer on mine though, what tires and air pressure are you guys running at?

 

[jminz]

Interesting... I have mine set at 4.1 for Caster on both sides and .1 for Camber on both sides. It does drift somewhat along crowns and angled roads (depends on the severity of the angle,), but nothing a degree or two adjustment of the steering wheel while driving doesn't fix. I haven't had issues with bumpsteer on mine though, what tires and air pressure are you guys running at?

Cooper AT3 at 32psi. When I increased caster from 2 to 3 I didn't notice a huge difference, just that it rubbed much worse, which makes sense.

 

[blackoutt]

Interesting... I have mine set at 4.1 for Caster on both sides and .1 for Camber on both sides. It does drift somewhat along crowns and angled roads (depends on the severity of the angle,), but nothing a degree or two adjustment of the steering wheel while driving doesn't fix. I haven't had issues with bumpsteer on mine though, what tires and air pressure are you guys running at?

Bothers me because I see all these guys saying to run 4 degrees of caster, I get the SPC arms and had them set at the "E" setting with unknown caster but it was a lot and bumpsteered like crazy, turned them back to the "D" setting and it handled alright, got it aligned to 4 and it bumpsteers again. Wish they would have given me before numbers instead of just crashing into the alignment.

I'm running stock size Michelin LTX A/T 2's at 40psi currently. Maybe a little high but I'm sure it's come down a little as the temps dropped outside.

 

[chompster4runner]

:snacker: looking for that magic number too.

 

[MSRP.]

Silly question, but what condition are your tires? All evenly worn? Any individual tires with more wear than the rest?

 

[Lolrax]

Definitely check out those end links, I had this problem and turned out my swaybar was loose. They tightened it up and it was all good

 

[jminz]

Silly question, but what condition are your tires? All evenly worn? Any individual tires with more wear than the rest?

Tires are brand new. Lift, tires and spacers all happened at the same time.

 

[jminz]

Here are close ups of my end links and tie rod end. Anything concerning?

 

[BlackWorksInc]

Bothers me because I see all these guys saying to run 4 degrees of caster, I get the SPC arms and had them set at the "E" setting with unknown caster but it was a lot and bumpsteered like crazy, turned them back to the "D" setting and it handled alright, got it aligned to 4 and it bumpsteers again. Wish they would have given me before numbers instead of just crashing into the alignment.

I'm running stock size Michelin LTX A/T 2's at 40psi currently. Maybe a little high but I'm sure it's come down a little as the temps dropped outside.

Wait... I'm confused are you saying that you set the SPC upper plate to "E" (also are you sure you set it to "E"?) That would mean you REDUCED your Caster by 1°, not increased it (that would be setting "C").

http://www.spcalignment.com/instructions/25480-INS_WEB.pdf

Setting "E" means that the SPC logo on the upperball joint is facing the rear of the vehicle at a near 45° to position "D". I got confused by that at first too when I went to increase my Caster. That might explain the Bumpsteer (what do you mean by Bumpsteer? like the steering wheel is bouncing around over bumps?) you're feeling, less Caster means less direct steering control and less steering return.

Also did you have an alignment done after you played with the SPC upper balljoint? Because you're camber and toe will be affected with you play with the settings, not a badly as you would with the eccentric cams; but enough that it may change camber and toe biases.

[MENTION=11819]jminz[/MENTION]

First off, those pictures are huge, maybe trim them a bit next time.

Everything looks good in those pictures to me, a hell of a lot cleaner than my 4Runner's balljoints are. Can you grab the sway bar links and move them up and down, or do they feel pretty solid (they will roll a bit, side to side but I am looking for up & down freeplay)

 

[blackoutt]

Yes typo after double checking the directions, went from memory and was wrong. Went from C with unknown specs but shade tree aligned and bumpsteer to D with unknown specs but shade tree aligned and handled well then got "professionally" aligned to 3.9 caster and bumpsteer is back.

By bumpsteer I mean the wheel jerks side to side over any pot hole or patch in the road. The crown following I can deal with like you said just a few degrees of wheel tilt and its fine.

 

[jminz]

Wait... I'm confused are you saying that you set the SPC upper plate to "E" (also are you sure you set it to "E"?) That would mean you REDUCED your Caster by 1°, not increased it (that would be setting "C").

http://www.spcalignment.com/instructions/25480-INS_WEB.pdf

Setting "E" means that the SPC logo on the upperball joint is facing the rear of the vehicle at a near 45° to position "D". I got confused by that at first too when I went to increase my Caster. That might explain the Bumpsteer (what do you mean by Bumpsteer? like the steering wheel is bouncing around over bumps?) you're feeling, less Caster means less direct steering control and less steering return.

Also did you have an alignment done after you played with the SPC upper balljoint? Because you're camber and toe will be affected with you play with the settings, not a badly as you would with the eccentric cams; but enough that it may change camber and toe biases.

[MENTION=11819]jminz[/MENTION]

First off, those pictures are huge, maybe trim them a bit next time.

Everything looks good in those pictures to me, a hell of a lot cleaner than my 4Runner's balljoints are. Can you grab the sway bar links and move them up and down, or do they feel pretty solid (they will roll a bit, side to side but I am looking for up & down freeplay)

Ha, sorry about pic size, best I could do posting from my phone. I'll see if I can move them by hand.

 

[jminz]

I should also add that I do hear a clinking sound coming from front pass side when coming to a stop. And also a clink from rear when going over bumps at low speed. Neither sounds drive shaft related.