What's the real scoop about Toyota frame rust?

[MStudt]

If it's used anywhere in the state it's used everywhere. Yes the melt solutions are nasty in PA. Now, back to the frames..

Brine isn't used everywhere in the US, but is used in some places. I'm from Missouri, and brine was not used there. Missouri used salt and cinder on the roads unless something has changed since moving. Now, being in Oregon, we use cinder and brine.

[MENTION=90352]UnderFire[/MENTION] :I agree 100% people are dreaming if they think they will get a new 4 runner frame for any generation.

As the frame rot is localized to a specific region of the world. It's not the mfg fault a state or province uses corrosive materials on the road surfaces.

You'll see a recall in the coming year for 2005+ 4runners based on the current class action lawsuit against Toyota. Or, they'll choose to pay those people off rather than starting a recall.

Also, frame rot is not localized in any way. Anywhere that uses salt or brine on roads will have frame rust/rod issues. You will also have those same issues within a certain distance from the coastline. Places like Florida also have frame rust issues to salt water, and a rather salty environment. For example, the class action lawsuit was started by a Florida resistant with a 2005 4runner.

Mike

 

[jetfan186]

I doubt we will ever see a frame recall in 4 runners as the fact they are a true import from Japan. The tundras and tocumas are made in north America. So they will have safety recalls and frame campaigns on those for years.

The issue comes down to keeping your frames and undercarriages clean in the rust belt areas. Especially the inside of a boxed frame.

Frames have been rotting out in the rust belt areas since they were first imported over to North America.


It is shame. However, a little TLC and rust proofing can prevent them from rusting out.


I just weld them and even rebuild them when they get thin. If the states would quit using salt, calcium chloride etc. We wouldnt have this issue at all. Good luck getting States and provinces to do that.

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How do weld or rebuild them I have a 2001 4runner. It wont pass inspection

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[jetfan186]

Maybe you can send me in the right direction thanks

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[brillo_76]

Maybe you can send me in the right direction thanks

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Yes look at the thread Brillo Builds. It shows how I fix the 3rd gen 4 runner frames.

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[Dieselchessy]

I didn't read the entire thread, or all the other threads on this site about frame rust.

The frame is a square tube with holes in the sides and a hump up at the rear axle and the front axle. This creates a low spot in the frame that collects dirt and moisture. Due to the rear of these things sagging the grime tends to collect in the low spot at the rear lower link mounts.

Coating the inside of these frames without first getting the interior of the frame clean would be near useless.

I clean mine by parking my rig on a steep bank. That way the part of the frame that humps up over the rear axle slopes somewhat down. You can try nose down and nose up. Then go to town with a hose, pressure washer, bottle brushes, 3" pellet stove pipe brush, ect... to get the inside of the frame clean.
Hopefully when all the crap flows out the back ends of the frame by the rear bumper it doesn't include large rust flakes.
I do this in the summer on hot days. Get the inside of the frame as clean as you can with soap and water or other degreasing chemicals of your choice.

Then coat the inside of the frame with a coating of your choice.

If you don't do this and you just shove the eastwoods straw in the frame and spray away your just painting over dirt.

 

[brillo_76]

The thread was for trying to get Toyota for covering rotted frames like they did for Tocuma and Tundras. I explained as this will not happen because the 4 runners are true import vehicles. Toyota isn't responsible for the owners not cleaning their frames out. Some environments are a lot harder on the steel then others.



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[nobb]

No chance this is ever going to get covered by Toyota. What I'm really surprised about is that there's no class action lawsuit for the lower ball joint design flaw yet. It's a pretty clear design fault that has mostly likely resulted in deaths. With the large amount of aging 3rd gens still on the road driven by average people who know nothing about this, it's a ticking time bomb.

 

[Flighht2k]

How serious is this frame rust? - Ford F150 Forum - Community of Ford Truck Fans


anyone having rotten frame issues 05 f-150 - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums


Just Purchased - Rust | Jeep Wrangler TJ Forum


Frame rusting - 2014 - 2018 Silverado & Sierra - GM-Trucks.com

This is a quick search

Everything rusts.

 

[brillo_76]

No chance this is ever going to get covered by Toyota. What I'm really surprised about is that there's no class action lawsuit for the lower ball joint design flaw yet. It's a pretty clear design fault that has mostly likely resulted in deaths. With the large amount of aging 3rd gens still on the road driven by average people who know nothing about this, it's a ticking time bomb.

You never see a ball joint recall either as there isnt an easy way to fix that besides replacing the ball joints on occasion.

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[T4R2014]

20 year old ball joints failed? SAY IT AIN'T SO.

These guys are going to be complaining in another ten years when floor pans rot out consistently.

 

[brillo_76]

I still trying to figure out what ball joints have to do with rusted frames. I guess it's being seen as a safety issue. However. Suspension components and all bushings are wear components. In 2 more years all 3rd gens will be 20 years are older. They will be considered classic cars at this point. As they are 18 years old and older now. I honestly don't believe we see any recalls of any type on these now. That's what makes this thread interesting.

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[MStudt]

You never see a ball joint recall either as there isnt an easy way to fix that besides replacing the ball joints on occasion.

Ball joints were covered under a recall from Toyota in 2005. They'll never be recalled again, but they were recalled at one point.

Mike

 

[T4R2014]

The ball joint recall didn't even have anything to do with the design. It was a manufacturing defect.

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/rcl/2005/RCONL-05V225-6542.pdf

During the manufacturing process, there is a possibility that the surface of the ball portion of the Front
Suspension Ball Joint in your vehicle may have been scratched. In this condition, the Front Suspension Lower
Ball Joint in your vehicle may experience excessive wear and looseness causing increased steering effort,
reduced vehicle self-centering and noise in the front suspension. If your vehicle is operated in this condition, in
extreme cases, the Front Suspension Lower Ball Joint may separate from the knuckle causing a loss of vehicle
steering control, thus increasing the possibility of a crash.

Here's the real kicker in this

Please note that the Front Suspension Lower Ball Joint is a wear item and must be periodically inspected and
replaced in accordance with the vehicle’s Scheduled Maintenance Guide.

 

[brillo_76]

Ball joints were covered under a recall from Toyota in 2005. They'll never be recalled again, but they were recalled at one point.

Mike

Great to know. However the recall was only for 2001 and 2002 model years. Yet the same setup and part styles was used from 1996 to 2002. However, that has nothing to do with the Frame nor its safety


My Point is They will never recall the Frames or anything else on the 3rd Gens at this point. People can dream all they want its not going to happen. I just fix my own rusted frames (My Hobby) as I know rust and corrosion due to the environment is under items not covered under any mfg warranties. This is just one of these threads that I find amusing.

Just like my exhaust rusted off it should be replaced for free. Or my cab mount rotted off its a mfg defect. My response would be. You live in the rust belt. Why didn't you wash and clean your underside of your vehicle and use some soft of rust inhibitor on your vehicle. So why do you expect a mfg to be responsible for your actions. ;-)

 

[MStudt]

Great to know. However the recall was only for 2001 and 2002 model years. Yet the same setup and part styles was used from 1996 to 2002. However, that has nothing to do with the Frame nor its safety

My Point is They will never recall the Frames or anything else on the 3rd Gens at this point. People can dream all they want its not going to happen. I just fix my own rusted frames (My Hobby) as I know rust and corrosion due to the environment is under items not covered under any mfg warranties. This is just one of these threads that I find amusing.

Just like my exhaust rusted off it should be replaced for free. Or my cab mount rotted off its a mfg defect. My response would be. You live in the rust belt. Why didn't you wash and clean your underside of your vehicle and use some soft of rust inhibitor on your vehicle. So why do you expect a mfg to be responsible for your actions. ;-)

This issue isn't an isolated issue in the "rust belt". That's primarily the Great Lake's region, and extending further south into Virginia. Any Midwest/Plains state will also suffer the exact same results from roads being treated with salt, and brine. Also, the East Coast all the way to Florida also has frame rust issues. I grow up in the Midwest, and owned my 4runner there. I can tell you that the Midwest has the exact same issue as the rust belt.

People like free stuff. Who wouldn't like to get a free frame, muffler, or anything else. I sure as hell would, but I'm also not going to raise a stink about it. Instead I'll grab my grinder, scrap steel, and welder. Then fix the rust issues on my own. Plus, in a society full of self entitlement, what would you expect?

Mike

 

[brillo_76]

This issue isn't an isolated issue in the "rust belt". That's primarily the Great Lake's region, and extending further south into Virginia. Any Midwest/Plains state will also suffer the exact same results from roads being treated with salt, and brine. Also, the East Coast all the way to Florida also has frame rust issues. I grow up in the Midwest, and owned my 4runner there. I can tell you that the Midwest has the exact same issue as the rust belt.

People like free stuff. Who wouldn't like to get a free frame, muffler, or anything else. I sure as hell would, but I'm also not going to raise a stink about it. Instead I'll grab my grinder, scrap steel, and welder. Then fix the rust issues on my own. Plus, in a society full of self entitlement, what would you expect?

Mike

Isnt that the truth. People never learn free to you dosent mean it's free. I had a 1998 Sr5 5 speed tocuma that was recalled for frame rot. I had that truck for 8 years when they did the buy back in 2009. I was surprised Toyota even did that but they had an issue with the frame mfg. I still have my 2009 and its frame is not rotted out. I was grateful. However, I never suspect that to happen again and honestly surprised it even happened.

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[4Tuitous]

I just picked up a '99 3Gen with 172K on the clock. Spent its entire life until Spring of this year in South Texas, no body rust whatsoever, very minimal traces of rust on the frame...biggest reason I went for the deal. Started seeing posts here and elsewhere about this issue, now its got me wondering what I should be doing to protect this beautiful survivor...

 

[Toyota72]

Oopsie so how is the lawsuit going against Toyota? Any updates?

 

[T4R2014]

Oopsie so how is the lawsuit going against Toyota? Any updates?

Nah. Everyone ends up looking like a fool.

 

[nbach218]

All,

I'm no stranger to Toyota trucks, but I just bought my first 4Runner, a 2002 with 192K miles on it.

I had an 87 pickup that I had to sell for parts a number of years back because the frame rusted severely (along with the bed), resulting in a broken spring mount on the passenger's side rear. I'm sure the frame was in bad shape all around, but that truck ran its course and it was easier to sell it than to try any sort of repair.

I bought a 98 Tacoma with 186K miles shortly after that. It had been owned by a Toyota mechanic who said he had checked the frame and there were no issues. Sadly, three years later, when I brought it in for the Toyota recall, they were able to break through the frame and they bought the truck back. I did double my money in three years on a truck with 220K miles, though - thanks Toyota!

So I've got this 2002 4Runner now and I'm nervous about frame rust. I crawled underneath and it doesn't look much different than my Taco did. A little surface rust on the frame welds and body mounts. I don't see anything of concern right now but my Tacoma never had me concerned either until Toyota bought it back...

Some questions:

Is there any truth to what I've heard that this the 4Runner has a completely different frame than the Tacoma that makes it less susceptible to the rust-out?

Is there any truth to what I've heard that 2001+ Tacomas (and presumably 4Runners) don't generally have the frame rust issues because of something done differently than earlier models?

When I brought my Taco in for the recall, I was told Toyota would apply a rustproofing to the frame if it were found to be sound. Has anyone had Toyota apply this rustproofing (or applied it themselves) to a 3rd gen 4Runner?

Thanks in advance!

FWIW the craigslist here in Minnesota is full of 4runners needing frame repairs. I think they are like the tacos. Especially on the frame weld spot next to the muffler.