heynicebits
New member
I've been trying to find a parts list to add kdss to my TE but can't find a complete list anywhere. Does anyone know where I can find one?
Where to find KDSS parts list?
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harper7
Senior Member
Under the stickies above is the parts manual for 2010's.Most likely 2011's would be very very close.http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/92594-modifications-write-ups-quick-links.html
Don't forget to order the new frame,KDSS ECU's,LCA's and rear axle as they are all different too and have different part numbers.You can probably weld fabbed brackets on your non TE frame and rear axle if you can find a KDSS local to get the measurements. The hardest part would be wiring it.More then likely the whole truck wiring harness is different too if they followed suit with the other models. We've found they are all different.
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heynicebits
New member
Does the frame item apply since I have a TE already , just without KDSS? Also same with the electrical, the TE w/KDSS has a completely different harness than one with KDSS? I hope not. If so, Toyota is just crazy.
harper7
Senior Member
I just know the frames have different part numbers and the non-kdss doesn't have the brackets needed to attach the actuators,accumulators or brackets.
You would have to be the one that parks next to KDSS one and see if you have a KDSS frame. I saw pics of undereneath a non kdss TE of somebody asking if they had it. The LCA's were all I could see and they had the same as the SR5/Limited not the KDSS ones.
From the Toyota parts manual.
Frame Assy 4WD
w/Dynamic Suspension 51001-35A60 $5,841.90
w/o Dynamic Suspension 51001-35A50 $5,841.90
From what we've seen so far on the 5ths ,Toyota doesn't even waste a single wire when it comes to harnesses and doesn't make them universal. When they come down the assembly line in the Tahara the person working there has a print out or on a pc screen what that 4Runner model and options will be and installs the appropriate harness. If it were me making the decisions I would put a universal harness in and then sell the options /accessories and make big bucks selling/installing them.
We have all the factory manuals here and they show where the KDSS ECU and accumulator is located. The only way to tell is find that location and see if you have the connectors or the connectors for the accumulator underneath. Nobody has done it on the forum so you would be the first.
As somebody said before ,It is possible,but not probable because is it economically feasible.It would be cheaper and more reliable to sell your non KDSS TE and buy one with.
KDSS is nice and I would have ordered it on my Limited if it were an option.IMO,It was not nicer then the full time Torsen Center diff on the Limited and the reason I canceled my original order for one and went a different route.
KDSS is for better on road handling,thus the bigger sway bars
= better handling, and has NOTHING to do with more travel offroad. The hydraulic actuators push down on the thicker bar of the KDSS so that it gets the same as the non KDSS ,not more.Without the KDSS actuators pushing down or up on the thicker bar ,the travel would be less then the non KDSS.
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Intruder
New member
I'm a bit confused by this.
Toyota USA Newsroom | 2011 Toyota 4Runner Is Second Year of All-New Fifth Generation
"An array of advanced features, formerly only available in the Toyota Land Cruiser, further boosts off-highway capabilities. The Trail grade offers Toyota’s Kinetic Dynamic Suspension System (KDSS) as an option. KDSS significantly improves terrain-following ability by dynamically disconnecting stabilizer bars to allow for more axle travel, and better suspension articulation in slow, difficult terrain."
The explanations above are kinda wrong. Here is a good video to explain.
Standard sway bars are locked in place, this limits the amount of suspension travel because the sway bar "binds" the suspension (limits travel). With the KDSS, you can disconnect the mount (in a sense) to allow for more movement.
http://www.believe.co.nz/videos/kdss
Standard sway bars are locked in place, this limits the amount of suspension travel because the sway bar "binds" the suspension (limits travel). With the KDSS, you can disconnect the mount (in a sense) to allow for more movement.
http://www.believe.co.nz/videos/kdss
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harper7
Senior Member
That's marketing and their play on words. They are comparing what the travel would be with a big thick sway bar with KDSS compared to one with a big sway bar without KDSS.Notice they don't say what it's compared to.That's why is has great on road handling without losing any offroad articulation.
The skinny sway bar of the SR5/Limited/FJ has bushings too and end links with flexible bushings that let flex and bend to get max articulation without binding.All 4Runners and FJ's thru the years are like this.
Just like they say"dynamically disconnect". They use the term "effectively disconnects" also as a play on words meaning "same as if it disconnects"Have you looked where the sway bar connects . It has a bushing on the end to let it rotate up and down and it sits in bracket that is attached to the LCA. It NEVER disconnects. I know because I changed the suspension on a KDSS TE and my main goal was to see take the bars loose and see how it works and if it can be retrofitted to my LE. I thought they actually disconnected too.It's as I said before a great system to have tight handling on the road for a 2 1/2 ton truck.
The IFS front suspension on the 4Runner is a typical double wishbone or A-arm setup. The Upper ball joints rotation determines the down travel and the up travel is determined by the bump stops on the frame hitting the LCA . Pretty simple to see how much articulation you have. Take the Coil over out ,connect the ball joint back up and you'll see exactly how much travel you have as it just flexes up and down easily without the spring in the CO fighting you.
On my Limited it was the same with or without the sway bar attached and I noticed more travel with new UCA's. That is why with aftermarket UCA's have a bigger ball joint to go along with the proper angle for a lift and you gain over an inch of down travel thus best bang for your buck to gain precious down travel.
Which explanations are kinda wrong? Standard sway bars on the SR5/Limited are skinny for a 5000 lb vehicle, not locked in place and flex ,being skinny and made of spring steel,and do not bind the suspension. They may slow the down travel a little compared to running without but they do not limit or bind. I've had mine off and on for the past 2 years.They have bushings that attach to the frame and an end link with a bushing attached to the upright on the wheel spindle that allow them to rotate up or down.
Here's a better video(from our video sticky) on KDSS from Rick Hendricks Toyota too and the front components involved in the pics down below.Those end brackets with the bushings bolt to the front side of the Lower Control Arms.
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/hvWhQ1_uE0s" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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jhawk
New member
Thanks for clearing that up, that's exactly what I thought when I first drove a TE. Better onroad handing (thicker sways were obvious). They had quicker flexing offroad, though they seem to flex the same as a limited. Moguls felt better, although it might be the higher profile tire helping a lot vs limited.
I didn't like the SR5 handling wise at all.
I bought the limited because of of the center diff, I really wanted the TE but there were some limiting factors. I like the limited better. Even though it's a bit blingy out of the factory.
I got the chance to take a friends limited and his friends TE to Crystal Mountain in Colorado, his limited had the TEs wheels + duratraks, they both performed great. Minus the limited really needing that locker - a-trac isn't a complete substitute.
If someone would make a thicker swaybar and we can add sway bar disco's, I think it would be great!
