Yet Another Few Lift Questions

[TR[unner]D]

I am sure you all are going to want to murder me, because the topic has clearly been murdered, resurrected, and murdered again already. But despite my endless searching I have stumbled upon a couple of questions still. Oh and note that I am looking to get 3" lift when everything is said and done.
I found this kit that looks to be pretty solid, it comes with bilstein 5100 adjustable shocks as well as some Eibach adjustable coil springs.

https://wabfab.3dcartstores.com/mobile/product.asp?itemid=705

I just wanted your guys' input on this setup as far as the front end goes. I like that it is quality name brand stuff. Basically, I will be taking my runner out wheeling about once a week at least. I do some pretty mild stuff and would like to have some good travel up front. I like the idea of adjustability, but is this front end setup going to give me as much travel as if I did say a non adjustable OME 881 coil and shock front end setup would? Also, does it look like a quality product to you? Any input would be much appreciated.

Now for the next question. As far as the rear goes, I am looking to do the OME 890 coils and an undecided shock of some sort. I do tow a few jetskis or a pop up camper once in a while, but other than that I don't have much extra rear end weight besides maybe 75 lbs in tools and such in the trunk. Should I go with the stiffer 891 springs in the rear for when I do tow, or will they be too stiff all around? Or will the 890 springs be fine? Keep in mind that I hit trails more than I tow, so more flex/travel = a bigger smile on my face. I am going for functionality here.

One more question.. What would be the best bang for my buck as far as rear shocks that will work (lengthwise) with a 3 inch lift go? What are some of my options that will fit and allow all of my travel? I haven't been able to find a ton of information on specific shock options for the rear.

Sorry again for all of the lift questions. I'm stoked to get it lifted, I just want to do it right the first time without breaking the bank too badly. I figured that this setup will be fairly cheap with quality parts where I need them most.
Any input and experience is greatly appreciated! Thanks everybody!

 

[ARC]

First off these appear to be the exact same as what Toytec offers:
ToyTec coilover kit with Bilstein 5100 shocks

Second though they do say in stock I would call to verify as many Bilstien products are not currently available.

Third none of the options you listed are going to give you any more travel up front over stock. All you are doing with these lifts is adjusting the level of preload of the front end. You are forcing the suspension further downward at ride height than it would be stock thus losing down travel and gaining up travel. However the total amount of suspension travel remains unchanged. IF you want more travel over stock you just either do a long travel setup or a mid travel setup. Long travel is likely unrealistic for you and mid travel is going to stretch your budget a bit. Mid travel would consist of an extended travel coil over and aftermarket UCA. Long travel will be full length coil overs, UCA's and LCA's, and extend CV's at the bare minimum. To make long travel work decently you will need to spend much more than your 4runner is worth in the first place.

Fourth, and this is where my opinion starts, I would not use a lift that relies on an adjustable 5100 for that price. Don't get me wrong the 5100 is a great idea and I run them on my Tundra. But I don't wheel the Tundra at all, I just put them on to level out the factory rake a bit for cosmetic reasons only. The 5100 uses a clip set in a groove on the shock body then the spring seat rests on the clip. Though I am sure this engineered to be strong enough I have read a few stories of failure. Generally it is speculated at least some of these failures are a result of improper installation. To me why chance it when you can get a true threaded body larger diameter coil over that will also increase in performance for another $200.

Fifth, there are some actual factual downfalls of that kit versus a true coil over, and I bet you really aren't going to save any money for the following reasons:

-Unless you have access to a shop with a spring compressor you are going to have to pay a shop to disassemble your struts and then assemble the new ones. This is going to cost you a minimum of an hours labor at the local shop if you take them out and bring them down already out of the truck. (Yes using a rental spring compressor kit from Napa etc. is a possibility but a serious pain and can be dangerous depending on the kit.)

-You are going to be reusing your stock bushings, top plates, nuts etc. Do you really want your new springs and shocks outfitted with your worn out stock parts?

-Since you reused the above mentioned parts you can now longer sell your used set as a complete strut that Joe Blow from across town can put under his truck without having to use a spring compressor. Reselling used parts is what bought and built my 4runner. Not a single dime of my normal income has gone into it.

What you do have right for sure is that adjustability is a really nice feature. Now I do think this is a quality kit that will serve you well, but I think there are better options based on the reasons stated above.

Now for the rear...

The best bang for your buck is easily LC coils and matching LC shocks. The two together can be easily had for around $100. You will actually gain travel in the rear with the taller springs, however if you do not limit up travel in some way you WILL destroy the shocks by over compressing them.

Now this has been a very long answer to a long question and I hope it helps.

Other members if I missed something or have something wrong please correct me, as this is how we learn. :wave:

 

[KidVermicious]

Wabfab is just a dropshipper, and not a very good one at that. There's a ton of people out there who have had horrible customer service experiences with that company, and I'd avoid spending money with him. ToyTec on the other hand has a great rep and is a forum sponsor.

 

[TNRunner99]

Check Toytec They offer a full kit for exactly what you need. Front coilovers are fully adjustable.

 

[Fiddynut]

I put 890s on my rear and I'm happy. I have the bilstein 5125s I had to build the kit that toytec sells everyone is back ordered.

 

[TR[unner]D]

Shoot, that was very helpful. Haha thanks everybody! Especially you ARC.

I should have mentioned that I have all of the tools capable to do everything myself, including a professional spring / strut compressor that shops have. Although I do have experience with the autozone compressors of I needed to go that route. I will be installing everything myself so no need to worry about shop labor fees or anything.

I do like the idea of the fully assembled kits on toytec, and I didn't notice that they had the same kit (springs were a different color and threw me off). However, the full kits are a pretty penny and I was looking at going more of a bang for buck route so I thought I'd ask about that front end setup because I can get it for about $60 cheaper through wabfab. But if their service is garbage then I won't bother! Drop shippers can be bad news.

I see what you mean regarding the travel side of things in the front. I just assumed that a lift with a longer coil and longer shock up front would allow for more movement before bottom out than just a spacer on top of the factory coil and struts would allow for. So maybe travel isn't the correct term. I just mean that if I lift it doing taller coils and longer shocks then it will allow for more movement than if I just added a spacer. But correct me if I am wrong? Like I said I'm learning a lot about this still, hence the extensive questions haha.

I did look into the LC coils for the rear, and I can actually get a set for about $45 right now so I do like that option. But how do I count the wraps of the coil so I know I have the right ones for the 3 inch lift I'm looking to get? Also, any stock sized rear shock for that generation LC will work in the rear for my application?

Thanks again for all of the help. If I did that in the rear I would probably go with something more expensive and nice for the front. Thanks guys!

 

[ARC]

Shoot, that was very helpful. Haha thanks everybody! Especially you ARC.

I should have mentioned that I have all of the tools capable to do everything myself, including a professional spring / strut compressor that shops have. Although I do have experience with the autozone compressors of I needed to go that route. I will be installing everything myself so no need to worry about shop labor fees or anything.

I do like the idea of the fully assembled kits on toytec, and I didn't notice that they had the same kit (springs were a different color and threw me off). However, the full kits are a pretty penny and I was looking at going more of a bang for buck route so I thought I'd ask about that front end setup because I can get it for about $60 cheaper through wabfab. But if their service is garbage then I won't bother! Drop shippers can be bad news.

I see what you mean regarding the travel side of things in the front. I just assumed that a lift with a longer coil and longer shock up front would allow for more movement before bottom out than just a spacer on top of the factory coil and struts would allow for. So maybe travel isn't the correct term. I just mean that if I lift it doing taller coils and longer shocks then it will allow for more movement than if I just added a spacer. But correct me if I am wrong? Like I said I'm learning a lot about this still, hence the extensive questions haha.

I did look into the LC coils for the rear, and I can actually get a set for about $45 right now so I do like that option. But how do I count the wraps of the coil so I know I have the right ones for the 3 inch lift I'm looking to get? Also, any stock sized rear shock for that generation LC will work in the rear for my application?

Thanks again for all of the help. If I did that in the rear I would probably go with something more expensive and nice for the front. Thanks guys!

Well I sold my old struts on CL today for $100 so I got some Lotus RCAMS ordered. :lookout:

Spacers will actually cause you to lose travel where a proper coil lift will maintain the stock amount. So you are correct coils>spacers. Yes any stock length shocks should work, I got two new OEM Tokicos when I did mine and paid about $80 for the pair pretty affordable in my opinion. The lift FAQ thread has all the info for the LC coil paint codes and wrap count. Keep in mind you will also need extended bump stops like I mentioned and some longer sway bar links unless you plan to take them out.

 

[TR[unner]D]

Okay good deal. Well shoot, yeah I suppose I could sell my stock ones as well as they still have some life in them!

Yeah I read that whole post on the FAR thread and found out a lot of solid info. I just wasn't sure if I counted from the top and went around and down , or just look at the coils from the side and counted say how many wraps there were that way. But that is an awesome price for a pair for the rear. Looks like I will be going that route for the rear then! I'll look more into how to find the right rear coils.
What bump stops should I get then? I will be looking into my options for the front now. Time to start over I suppose gotta do it right the first time haha.

And thanks for clearing up the travel thing. That is exactly what I meant, just that I wanted to not hinder the travel with spacers and would rather keep my entire length of movement. I just dislike the way it looks when the front end flexes with spacers when the rear looks all good. It just looks cheesy to me and I'd rather have the entire length to play with.

Anyways, thanks again!

 

[A.Wilson013]

I post this whenever I get the chance...

WabFab Off-Road, LLC Business Review in Tuscaloosa, AL - Central & South Alabama BBB

Buy from Toytec, you'll be happy you did.

 

[TR[unner]D]

Good to know. I appreciate it! I follow him on instagram and assumed it was a good place to buy. But appearance not! I'd rather have some actual customer service, it would be more worth some extra money in my opinion. I appreciate it! I'll watch toytec, they do have a lot of good stuff and seem to be very popular.

 

[ARC]

From PM with OP

Sorry to bother you.. But if I just ended up going the route of buying some OME coils up front then I would have to get longer struts, correct? Also, what are some good options for longer struts that would work?
I appreciate it!

I am pretty sure you still need stock length shocks. Remember what I said about wheel travel being unchanged you are just moving the wheel further down its arc and ride height. So I don't see any reason why your stock struts won't work if you want to save some money.

Alright awesome. Yeah I was curious as to how that would work. I just assumed that you could only push the tire down so far until you reached the limit of the internals of the strut. But maybe 3 inches isn't so much that you would reach that point? Hmm.
I'd like to replace them while I'm in there. I'll have to look at some pricing. If I replaced them, is there a particular brand that isn't too bad that you know of? Should I just get whatever is cheap and works? Or should I look for longer ones if I replace them anyways? I've done a bunch of research and I haven't really found much. I just thought I'd ask since you seem to know what you're talking about.
Haha thanks, I appreciate it!

I have no idea on struts. I don't think you can make use of any longer struts/shocks because the limiting factor is not the struts, but likely the UBJ/UCA. I could be wrong though. There are lots of people here that know way more than I do and what I do know I learned from this and other forums. That being said I am going to move this to the open forum where we can all learn together and make this information public for future users to find.

 

[TR[unner]D]

Thanks ARC, I really appreciate it! I'll research a little bit more on front struts. If I can roll with stock size then I'll just get some good replacements.
Thanks again!!