Lets address the "elephant"/ weight in the room!

Let me start by saying that I did some search and its really funny that there are so many threads about cool mods and builds, but none really address what I'm about to talk about. if there are just delete this and I'll move my yapping on their page.

I'm sure I'm not the only person that's wondered about this.....The WEIGHT! the ELEPHENT!!! all of those mods and their added weight.
I've been looking at how much weight I have added with all of these "cool" mods and how much more I can add. Will I ever be able enjoy a trip with my family after my build is done? will I ever be able to tow? Am I just throwing money into making by 4runner useless?

Being in aviation and understanding weight and balance and the importance of center of gravity and how it effects performance and stability, has made me re-think some of my decisions.
Good news is that current lead times of fabrication shops will give me plenty of thinking and re search time to figure out a solutions, bad news is I may never have that "cool" dual swing out rear bumper or my loaded ARB drawers in the back. Or will I?
After some reading/youtube watching and asking around it appears that more than 50% of the modded 4runners are over weight. Just looking at Youtube alone and some of those "walkaround" builds look great, but are way over the GVWR. And I can guarantee you that they are, Just add the numbers and you'll see on easily you can exceed the GVWR. Then you have the other people that are pulling trailers likes of Turtlebacks and Patriots with their modded trucks who are again grossly exceeding the GVWR.
How in the world are these guys doing this? Is GVWR just a number in off-road community that's knowingly and willingly exceeded? Or am I thinking about this all wrong?
The 4Runner is not an airplane, but reading about some of the aircraft accidents that were caused from weight and imbalance issues just makes me even more aware of the negatives.
I think the vehicle is tested and rated with OEM parts and Toyota says the 4runners GVWR is 6300 lbs. Does having upgraded suspension/springs and UCAs and such change that? who knows? Toyota will never be able to test every single combination and determine that. And its not just suspension, what about the integrity of all the nuts and bolts and mounts/other parts?
Trail4runner has a pretty good article here talking about how easily you can exceed this number. Understanding Gross Vehicle Weight Rating in your 4Runner, 5th Gen 4Rs

I want to know what are you thoughts are. :rockon:

the general consensus seems to be add stiffer springs and crank coilovers higher to compensate for additional weight. I dont see any problem with it personally except that increasing the weight makes it slower.

Just doing a lift with stiffer springs and 5100's for me got rid of the nose dive and helps me carry more weight and get less swaying on turns, so it was worth it even on a stock 4runner.

Everything is a give and take. Add weight to gain capability or be tacticool, but give up speed/acceleration.

I do think about the weight and its also the same reason why I thoroughly think through my mods. I dont have much done, but everything I have done is frequently used and not just to look cool.

Yes its tempting to go out and buy all the cool stuff, but I can't justify it at this time.

Wheels and tires is one place to save. I would only put on an aluminum front bumper if I was going to do that mod and aluminum skids. Other than those it starts getting expensive to save weight.

I think a lot of people just don't think much about GVWR or think it primarily just means whether the frame will crack in half. The towing community seems far more concerned with weight ratings than the offroad community. The fact of the matter is a lot goes into the GVWR figure and it's not just strength, but takes all sorts of other things into account (handling, braking, cooling, drivetrain stress, reliability, etc etc).

Probably for most people that exceed their GVWR nothing much negative may really come of it. But I'd be concerned with the liability of getting into an accident where someone was injured and you were driving a legally overweight vehicle. You could be in some legal trouble there. Something to consider anyway.

I went for an aluminium front bumper for this very reason.

I keep a spread sheet of the weight of my mods VS the gvm. But I want a rear bumper for the utility. I keep going back and forth between Rigd Ultra Swing and a rear dual. Dual serves the purpose and increases departure angle but that’s a ton of weight.

I only have me and the Mrs and we take the rear seats out and fit the goose gear platform. Not having a roof tent can save some weight. Ground tents are next to nothing in comparison.

I’ve never seen anyone complain about issues with an overweight vehicle. Most upgrade suspension and brakes. Biggest loss seems to be fuel and speed. But I wouldn’t want to be flying down the road and attempting evasive manoeuvres with a drastically overweight rig. But Toyota more than likely air on the side of caution when rating vehicles.

Had I known how little you can fit to a 4Runner or similar sized vehicle I may have gone for a Landcruiser (not available new in Canada) or similar vehicle in hindsight. I do love the 4 runner though. My next build will be full size. But we won’t sell the runner. It’s my Mrs daily driver. Once we have children we will need a bigger rig for sure.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Wanderlost overland just did a vid on tubeyou discussing this very topic. May be of interest to you. I myself don't need every mall crawling option.

Weight is one of the reasons I'd never put a RTT brah on any vehicle.

rightyouareken said:

I think a lot of people just don't think much about GVWR or think it primarily just means whether the frame will crack in half. The towing community seems far more concerned with weight ratings than the offroad community. The fact of the matter is a lot goes into the GVWR figure and it's not just strength, but takes all sorts of other things into account (handling, braking, cooling, drivetrain stress, reliability, etc etc).

Probably for most people that exceed their GVWR nothing much negative may really come of it. But I'd be concerned with the liability of getting into an accident where someone was injured and you were driving a legally overweight vehicle. You could be in some legal trouble there. Something to consider anyway.

Click to expand...

Exactly! The liability is probably my number one concern.

SnoRnR said:

I went for an aluminium front bumper for this very reason.

I keep a spread sheet of the weight of my mods VS the gvm. But I want a rear bumper for the utility. I keep going back and forth between Rigd Ultra Swing and a rear dual. Dual serves the purpose and increases departure angle but that’s a ton of weight.

I only have me and the Mrs and we take the rear seats out and fit the goose gear platform. Not having a roof tent can save some weight. Ground tents are next to nothing in comparison.

I’ve never seen anyone complain about issues with an overweight vehicle. Most upgrade suspension and brakes. Biggest loss seems to be fuel and speed. But I wouldn’t want to be flying down the road and attempting evasive manoeuvres with a drastically overweight rig. But Toyota more than likely air on the side of caution when rating vehicles.

Had I known how little you can fit to a 4Runner or similar sized vehicle I may have gone for a Landcruiser (not available new in Canada) or similar vehicle in hindsight. I do love the 4 runner though. My next build will be full size. But we won’t sell the runner. It’s my Mrs daily driver. Once we have children we will need a bigger rig for sure.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Click to expand...

Some very valid points. I love the Landcruiser platform as well. I guess it’s gonna come down to what’s more important to me. An RTT or a rear bumper. I also tow a 3000 lbs trailer with bikes on occasion, so I have to make sure I take into account the tongue weight as well.
On a different note, Goose-Gear makes awesome
Quality stuff. I just ordered their 4Runner plate system (more weight lol)

SnoRnR said:

Had I known how little you can fit to a 4Runner or similar sized vehicle I may have gone for a Landcruiser

Click to expand...

The LC200 can only carry 45 pounds more than 4runner.

firegod33r said:

Some very valid points. I love the Landcruiser platform as well. I guess it’s gonna come down to what’s more important to me. An RTT or a rear bumper. I also tow a 3000 lbs trailer with bikes on occasion, so I have to make sure I take into account the tongue weight as well.
On a different note, Goose-Gear makes awesome
Quality stuff. I just ordered their 4Runner plate system (more weight lol)

Click to expand...

I have RTT because I need the space and its nice to be off the ground away from animals as well as snow etc. It is heavy though. The tent on its own weight almost 150 lbs and I can feel it for sure. You would also need a good roof rack to properly secure it and hold the weight of the tent and people in it.

Whippersnapper02 said:

Weight is one of the reasons I'd never put a RTT brah on any vehicle.

Click to expand...

There's one on the way that is around 80lbs and doesn't require a rack, it's a direct mount.

This video might be worth a few minutes to watch. It's not 100% on topic of this thread but at least you can bet on the the outcome between steel and aluminum mods

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RWcPZes3FM&t=560s

Charlievee said:

Wanderlost overland just did a vid on tubeyou discussing this very topic. May be of interest to you. I myself don't need every mall crawling option.

Click to expand...

Can you tell me which one exactly? I watch their stuff all the time and must have missed it. Thanks

I come from an aviation background too - 20 years in flight test and a few other things before retiring a few years ago. Weight and balance and CG calculations were part of every test flight, that resulted in a load sheet verified by weighing the airplane before most flights; and sometimes after.

One thing you never hear about the mods people do to their 4Runners is the results of testing done after mods are completed. Sure you hear about mileage results and lift issues with alignments etc. but who does performance testing? I suspect nobody - because you never hear about it. Who gets up to highway speeds and slams on the brakes to see if your newly modded 4Runner stops straight while maintaining control? Who tries evasive maneuvers on your newly lifted and loaded truck to see what happens? Who tries these tests under different road conditions and both good and bad weather? Chances are pretty good you will have to do all these things eventually. For me it would be nice to know what's going to happen before it happens unplanned.

No it's not flight test where you have a load sheet and weight and balance figures. No your truck isn't instrumented with: accelerometers, strain gauges, thermocouples, flow meters, recording systems, etc. but I think some pre and post testing is a good idea and give valuable information. Might even make things safer too!

NorthPark said:

There's one on the way that is around 80lbs and doesn't require a rack, it's a direct mount.

Click to expand...

Nah I'm good. They're pretty lame because you would have to close it all up to move. I'd only put one on a trailer.

Think about this subject a lot. I've added about 700 pounds so far. The last and by far heaviest mod was my auxiliary fuel tank, which took the spot my spare tire occupied which lead to something even heavier, a C4 rear bumper, 230 pounds. That will put me at 930 pounds. 5600 pounds when loaded with fuel is my best guess. When I install the bumper I'm going to the CAT scale to get a real weight. On the bright side, I knew where this was headed when I bought my springs...I think..

A big steel front bumper will affect the airbags in a frontal collision. My bet is the bag goes off before it should have due to the added stiffness and sharper impulse.

I've ran into this recently with an added RTT and I figured I was 500-600 over, but came in at 6250lbs. Honestly was shocked. I suspect some of the bigger builds that have full rear bumpers and such are 6500-6800lbs total.

I expected it to be slow, and honestly I wasn't worried about weight that much, but at 6250lbs with 34s on...

I average 13mpg, with around 200 miles per gas tank. It's highly impractical and has me rethinking weight.

flyrv9 said:

I come from an aviation background too - 20 years in flight test and a few other things before retiring a few years ago. Weight and balance and CG calculations were part of every test flight, that resulted in a load sheet verified by weighing the airplane before most flights; and sometimes after.

One thing you never hear about the mods people do to their 4Runners is the results of testing done after mods are completed. Sure you hear about mileage results and lift issues with alignments etc. but who does performance testing? I suspect nobody - because you never hear about it. Who gets up to highway speeds and slams on the brakes to see if your newly modded 4Runner stops straight while maintaining control? Who tries evasive maneuvers on your newly lifted and loaded truck to see what happens? Who tries these tests under different road conditions and both good and bad weather? Chances are pretty good you will have to do all these things eventually. For me it would be nice to know what's going to happen before it happens unplanned.

No it's not flight test where you have a load sheet and weight and balance figures. No your truck isn't instrumented with: accelerometers, strain gauges, thermocouples, flow meters, recording systems, etc. but I think some pre and post testing is a good idea and give valuable information. Might even make things safer too!

Click to expand...

Couldn’t agree more. I definitely plan on testing to see how the truck handles as I add weight here and there. I guess these overweight builds are just like overweight planes taking off. It’ll probably fly off, but may not meet that climb gradient or cause structural damage within the G parameters. Worse of all, the stability during a stall would be interesting.