4th Gen Suspension Options/FAQ

[xtremewlr]

Alright guys i have a question. First let me state what im working on: 2004 4Runner V8 2WD with 147,XXX on her clock. Its my daily/commuter so far but im looking to lift it 3 inches. Reason being is the tires i have on rub at full turn. The front struts are blown so it lands hard when i go over a speed bump. If im going to replace i might as well upgrade. That being said, i was wondering if any of you guys had any experience with a Dobinsons lift kit? Or would you have any suggestions on a kit. Any help is appreciated!!

Dobinsons Suspension - 4th Gen Options

 

[4Runn1nYota]

Dobinson Adj Panhard Rod vs PCK

Ive been all over, trying to get answers on why I can't have the Dobs Adj Panhard Bar over the EIMKeith PCK? I did comment on the Dobs Thread, but also wanting to ask in here, since its Suspension related.

I figured that's what the Adj Panhard Rod was for. Dobinson recommended it since im doing the LT Kit and doing 3"+ lift. I ordered the Adj Sway Bar links, the Break Line Ext, and the 3" Bumpstop Ext. figured I was all complete.

so what's the big difference over the Adj Panhard Rod and the Correction Kit from EIMKeith?? anyone know? did I make the mistake of ordering the Dobinson Panhard rod??



I appreciate all the input about this if possible.

 

[mcaninch35]

Ive been all over, trying to get answers on why I can't have the Dobs Adj Panhard Bar over the EIMKeith PCK? I did comment on the Dobs Thread, but also wanting to ask in here, since its Suspension related.

I figured that's what the Adj Panhard Rod was for. Dobinson recommended it since im doing the LT Kit and doing 3"+ lift. I ordered the Adj Sway Bar links, the Break Line Ext, and the 3" Bumpstop Ext. figured I was all complete.

so what's the big difference over the Adj Panhard Rod and the Correction Kit from EIMKeith?? anyone know? did I make the mistake of ordering the Dobinson Panhard rod??



I appreciate all the input about this if possible.

Not sure if you got an answer in the other thread or not, but the Adj Panhard only recenters your axle under the body of the vehicle, it does not correct the panhard's angle. The panhard should be as level as possible, and when you lift the truck, you also lift up the mounting point of the panhard on one side, putting it at an angle. An angled panhard has implications for body roll, handling during cornering, etc- but I also know that a lot of folks run a lift without correcting the panhard angle, so it may not be noticeable or bothersome to you. With the PCK you do not need an aftermarket panhard because you're only moving the mounting point, but the aftermarket is probably stronger. Correcting the angle is the "correct" way to do it, but again, only you can decide whether a lifted vehicle with a not completely flat panhard bar bothers you or not. I'll be lifting my Runner soon and not doing either the PCK or the adjustable bar, and if I don't like the results, I'll weld the PCK on and use the stock bar.

 

[4Runn1nYota]

Not sure if you got an answer in the other thread or not, but the Adj Panhard only recenters your axle under the body of the vehicle, it does not correct the panhard's angle. The panhard should be as level as possible, and when you lift the truck, you also lift up the mounting point of the panhard on one side, putting it at an angle. An angled panhard has implications for body roll, handling during cornering, etc- but I also know that a lot of folks run a lift without correcting the panhard angle, so it may not be noticeable or bothersome to you. With the PCK you do not need an aftermarket panhard because you're only moving the mounting point, but the aftermarket is probably stronger. Correcting the angle is the "correct" way to do it, but again, only you can decide whether a lifted vehicle with a not completely flat panhard bar bothers you or not. I'll be lifting my Runner soon and not doing either the PCK or the adjustable bar, and if I don't like the results, I'll weld the PCK on and use the stock bar.

Thanks mcaninch35. I appreciate the good info on this. yeah I ended up getting the heavy duty Adj Panhard Rod from Dobinson, and this was before realizing people were talking about the EimKeith PCK. so I was confused.. it is true everyone says do the PCK, but nothing else.. We ended up just doing the Panhard Rod for now. but Im going to look at the PCK later on, if I feel it is an issue.. (which pretty much means, I want it just to be safe lol) its easy to do so I can just get it done. all I need it to get it cleaned up, welded, and install the Panhard Rod into the pck. hopefully before going off road.

 

[NHToyo73]

Hello all, i've searched all over for pics of stock suspension but can't find what i'm looking for. Would one of you fine gents be able to identify these springs? I just bought this 04 v6 with 165k, its got 5100's but i can't identify the springs :ybrick:

 

[Bluesky 07]

[MENTION=635746]NHToyo73[/MENTION], Toyota marks their springs like that to indicate the side on which they should be installed. Not sure if other manufacturers make similar marks so that may or may not be of help.

 

[orbos86]

Hey everyone! This may be buried, and I'm not 100% sure this is the best place to post, but I'm just trying to figure out what would be a good option for my 2008 4Runner Limited in terms of the new suspension. I currently have XREAS, but I'm wanting to give it a bit of a lift and level it out. I read a lot about Bilsteins and Old Man Emu. Is one better than the other? Which has the most lift while remaining under that 3" threshold (don't wanna replace other stuff right now).

Is there a best place to buy the new shocks and springs? I've also noticed there are several choices of each, and I'm not sure what would be best for me. Most city/freeway driving, but I live in Utah and love going up in the mountains or out in the desert.

Any advice would be truly appreciated. Thanks so much!

 

[Tironeous]

Hey everyone! This may be buried, and I'm not 100% sure this is the best place to post, but I'm just trying to figure out what would be a good option for my 2008 4Runner Limited in terms of the new suspension. I currently have XREAS, but I'm wanting to give it a bit of a lift and level it out. I read a lot about Bilsteins and Old Man Emu. Is one better than the other? Which has the most lift while remaining under that 3" threshold (don't wanna replace other stuff right now).

Is there a best place to buy the new shocks and springs? I've also noticed there are several choices of each, and I'm not sure what would be best for me. Most city/freeway driving, but I live in Utah and love going up in the mountains or out in the desert.

Any advice would be truly appreciated. Thanks so much!

General consensus seems to be Old Man Emu shocks are stiff. This may be good if you’re fully loaded with bumpers, skids, a RTT, a drawer system... their springs are highly regarded and they have a number of options depending on the weight of your vehicle.

Bilstein 5100 is tried and true and very widely used. It’s likely best to achieve the lift with a longer spring (like an OME or Eibach). This will result in better ride quality and longer shock life than preloading the original spring.

You’ve also got Eibach who are newer to the shock game. Their shocks are valved differently than Bilstein to allow for more comfort. Eibach springs are highly regarded and they make springs for many aftermarket kits (Toytec, some of wheelers springs, etc). I’ve read some think their rear springs are a bit soft and the truck can sag when loaded. YMMV.

I don’t know too much about Dobinsons other than the use twin tubeshocks vs mono tube. It’s my understanding mono tube are generally considered better but I’m not 100% sure. A lot of people really like their stuff so I’m sure someone will chime in.

I suggest doing research and really thinking about how you will actually use your truck. This forum has a ton of great info. I’ve found the YouTube videos by Shock Surplus to be really helpful too.

One last thing, I forgot to answer where to buy. It seems Wheelers Off-road has really competitive prices. Free shipping and no sales tax in the US. They also give 10% off your first purchase when you make an account. There’s usually a pop up when you visit the site. They email a code that’s good for 48 hours ONLY so don’t signup until you’re ready to buy. They are another good resource to call and bounce some questions off of.

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[Tironeous]

So I have read through a good portion of all of this and I haven't found an answer to my question. So I am looking at doing the fox 2.0 coilovers in front and then fox struts and springs in the back (the kit from yotamafia). I plan on putting 255 80's on 17in TRD wheels but I still would like to maintain towing capability on my v8. Is the suspension going to change my ability to do so?

You should consider 6112 as an alternative to Fox 2.0. The rear springs will have the biggest impact on if you’re sagging when towing. You don’t want something too tall or stiff because it will be rough when you’re not loaded. If you tow a lot of may be worth or. Or look at airbags for when you tow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FH-cVXSJT5I&feature=youtu.be


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[orbos86]

General consensus seems to be Old Man Emu shocks are stiff. This may be good if you’re fully loaded with bumpers, skids, a RTT, a drawer system... their springs are highly regarded and they have a number of options depending on the weight of your vehicle.

Bilstein 5100 is tried and true and very widely used. It’s likely best to achieve the lift with a longer spring (like an OME or Eibach). This will result in better ride quality and longer shock life than preloading the original spring.

You’ve also got Eibach who are newer to the shock game. Their shocks are valved differently than Bilstein to allow for more comfort. Eibach springs are highly regarded and they make springs for many aftermarket kits (Toytec, some of wheelers springs, etc). I’ve read some think their rear springs are a bit soft and the truck can sag when loaded. YMMV.

I don’t know too much about Dobinsons other than the use twin tubeshocks vs mono tube. It’s my understanding mono tube are generally considered better but I’m not 100% sure. A lot of people really like their stuff so I’m sure someone will chime in.

I suggest doing research and really thinking about how you will actually use your truck. This forum has a ton of great info. I’ve found the YouTube videos by Shock Surplus to be really helpful too.

One last thing, I forgot to answer where to buy. It seems Wheelers Off-road has really competitive prices. Free shipping and no sales tax in the US. They also give 10% off your first purchase when you make an account. There’s usually a pop up when you visit the site. They email a code that’s good for 48 hours ONLY so don’t signup until you’re ready to buy. They are another good resource to call and bounce some questions off of.

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Thank you!

 

[orbos86]

I ended up ordering the following kit: TTAFCS-HA-0309 - Toytec/Bilstein coilovers for 03-09 4Runner

I'm super excited to delete the XREAS and install this new suspension. Does anyone know a pair of wheels and tires that would add some beef without needing to cut away a whole bunch of stuff? Is there a thread somewhere with that type of information? Right now I'm just on the stock Limited 2008 wheels (18") with whatever tires they are.

Any advice would be great!

Thanks!

 

[Bluesky 07]

I recommend Spidertrax spacers to widen the stance. See the link in my sig for an install writeup & before/after pics, though they don’t do the improvement justice. My “X-REAS delete...” link may also be of interest as it also has a writeup & links to the relevant FSM sections. I’m also happy to answer any questions as best I can.

 

[Tironeous]

I ended up ordering the following kit: TTAFCS-HA-0309 - Toytec/Bilstein coilovers for 03-09 4Runner

I'm super excited to delete the XREAS and install this new suspension. Does anyone know a pair of wheels and tires that would add some beef without needing to cut away a whole bunch of stuff? Is there a thread somewhere with that type of information? Right now I'm just on the stock Limited 2008 wheels (18") with whatever tires they are.

Any advice would be great!

Thanks!

Nice buy! How large are you looking to go on the tires? If you’re looking to replace the wheels I recommend aftermarket 17” wheels. You’ll gain extra tire on the sidewall. You can look at OEM 5th gen wheels or aftermarket. Aftermarket wheels will generally be lighter and have a 0 or negative offset. That type of offset will reduce the possibility of a large tire rubbing by pushing it out away from things (just like a spacer). You may still need to trim some stuff, remove mudflats, and push the liner forward.

Tires can range from something a little bigger than stock like a 265/70/17 or about 31.5”. To 275/70/17 or 32”. Or a 255/70/17 which is also 32” but narrower and likely lighter than a 275 (lighter and better on gas). Or just go big and go 285/70/17 33” tire.

Some popular all terrain tires are BFG KO2, Falken Wildpeak A/T3W, Goodyear DuraTrac, Cooper AT3, and various others.


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[orbos86]

Nice buy! How large are you looking to go on the tires? If you’re looking to replace the wheels I recommend aftermarket 17” wheels. You’ll gain extra tire on the sidewall. You can look at OEM 5th gen wheels or aftermarket. Aftermarket wheels will generally be lighter and have a 0 or negative offset. That type of offset will reduce the possibility of a large tire rubbing by pushing it out away from things (just like a spacer). You may still need to trim some stuff, remove mudflats, and push the liner forward.

Tires can range from something a little bigger than stock like a 265/70/17 or about 31.5”. To 275/70/17 or 32”. Or a 255/70/17 which is also 32” but narrower and likely lighter than a 275 (lighter and better on gas). Or just go big and go 285/70/17 33” tire.

Some popular all terrain tires are BFG KO2, Falken Wildpeak A/T3W, Goodyear DuraTrac, Cooper AT3, and various others.


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Dang, thanks so much for the advice and response. I really like the look of these wheels, SCS Ray 10 (17 X 8.5) in Matte Dark Bronze. I have the Shadow Mica color 4Runner and think it looks great!

Not sure if there is a specific tire that fits on these out of the ones you listed or if it’s basically in wheel fits all, but I’m hoping to investigate what you mentioned and try to discover something that will look good.

Would those wheels have that offset that help with the anti-rubbing or would some spidertrax be smart to add some more width?

These forums are friggin great. Thanks to everyone who helps out. Its awesome.

 

[orbos86]

I recommend Spidertrax spacers to widen the stance. See the link in my sig for an install writeup & before/after pics, though they don’t do the improvement justice. My “X-REAS delete...” link may also be of interest as it also has a writeup & links to the relevant FSM sections. I’m also happy to answer any questions as best I can.

Thank you, thank you. I will definitely use your XREAS delete post! That’s great. Also, I’m definitely considering some spidertrax for the wider stance to help with potential rubbing. The wheels I’m eyeing are the SCS Ray 10 (17 X 8.5) in Matte Dark Bronze. Just gotta figure out a good tire to put on em that look good, won’t rub like crazy, and can be used in wide variety of settings.

 

[Tironeous]

The SCS Ray10 is a nice wheel with a -10mm offset. For reference, the stock wheels are +25 so you’re essentially pushing the wheels out 35mm. It’s hard to say for sure where you’ll rub. You’ll most likely want to plan on pushing the fender liner forward and remove the mud flaps. It varies by truck.


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[Bluesky 07]

Thank you, thank you. I will definitely use your XREAS delete post! That’s great. Also, I’m definitely considering some spidertrax for the wider stance to help with potential rubbing. The wheels I’m eyeing are the SCS Ray 10 (17 X 8.5) in Matte Dark Bronze. Just gotta figure out a good tire to put on em that look good, won’t rub like crazy, and can be used in wide variety of settings.

About tires, I bought Michelin LTX A/T2s in the stock size b/c they’re the best balance I found between reality (95% driving on the pavement, 5% mild to moderate trails), looks, durability, and off-road capability. Just doesn’t make sense for me to run an aggressive AT tread with an 82-mile r/t commute.

 

[punkcroc]

You should consider 6112 as an alternative to Fox 2.0. The rear springs will have the biggest impact on if you’re sagging when towing. You don’t want something too tall or stiff because it will be rough when you’re not loaded. If you tow a lot of may be worth or. Or look at airbags for when you tow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FH-cVXSJT5I&feature=youtu.be


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Thanks for the reply, I ended up going to one of my local fab guys (westcott engineering) and he does installs as well. He steered me away from fox towards the bilstein 6112/5160 system. Just more performance for the same money. Theyre always on backorder so Im scheduled early feb for installation though.

 

[orbos86]

The SCS Ray10 is a nice wheel with a -10mm offset. For reference, the stock wheels are +25 so you’re essentially pushing the wheels out 35mm. It’s hard to say for sure where you’ll rub. You’ll most likely want to plan on pushing the fender liner forward and remove the mud flaps. It varies by truck.


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Thank you. I guess we'll just have to see what happens! Gotta wait for wheels to come in stock, so could be months still, haha.

 

[orbos86]

About tires, I bought Michelin LTX A/T2s in the stock size b/c they’re the best balance I found between reality (95% driving on the pavement, 5% mild to moderate trails), looks, durability, and off-road capability. Just doesn’t make sense for me to run an aggressive AT tread with an 82-mile r/t commute.

That is smart. Honestly, I don't even commute that much anymore since Covid, and it's mainly my wife's vehicle for hauling a couple kids >.<, so do I need chunky tires, no, do they look cool...yeah I'll have to do some research and see what's the best option. Thanks again.