5th Gen 4Runner Safety

1engineer

1engineer

Moderator
Recently a thread on a Body Mount Chop (BMC) called into question the possibility of reducing the effectiveness (if any) of that feature. It made me think of the 4Runner and safety in general, hence this post.

I would like you to post a short paragraph on YOUR OPINION of the 5th Gen 4Runner's safety aspects. It can be about anything as long as it involves the OEM safety features.

I have something to say too but I want to wait until several of you post as to not cloud anyone's opinion. Thanks!
 
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i have a feeling something like :croc: is about to happen... in preparation for that i will preemptively :yield:

but since you asked for it, honestly i think the weight of the 4runner is a slight OEM safety feature, ~4700lbs is pretty dang heavy and mv = mv after all... and IIRC there are many airbags spread throughout this thing, side, front, etc.

for the record: iihs.org 4runner information

now remember to please be gentle with me, :hiding: :yield:
 
"Safety"

fart.jpg
 
Safety was probably the top reason I purchased my 4r, it switches places with performance (and it looks good also).

After reviewing this forum and reading about them for a couple of years before I purchased mine, I was convinced the 4r was great in the safety department. I cannot say how my mind would be swayed if the 4r was lower in safety, but really, most new cars now days rate pretty high compared to cares a decade or more ago.

Not that I am a paranoid person or anything, I will drive a classic car without even giving a thought to safety, but if I have the option to choose, I will take safety into consideration on a car purchase.

But I feel I am pretty unbiased as I was not a 4r fan nor a Toyota fan, never owned one before. I truly looked broadly at every vehicle available that fit my desires, and the 5th gen 4r came out on top.
 
In my opinion,
Any modifications done to a vehicle makes it less "safe". It is the sole responsibility of the owner to understand what those modifications does. If safety is truly the #1 factor in determining whether or not you should perform that mod (lift, larger tires, ANYTHING electrical, etc) then don't do it.

Taking that into account, I understand the ramifications that a lift kit will do. You will effectively increase the possibility of roll over during an accident. You WILL lose fuel economy, although not necessarily a safety concern but it's apparent to me that some are disappointed after the fact.

If you install something electrical from something as simple as an aftermarket radio to lights all over the vehicle, you are directly affecting the original intent of the OEM electrical harness and all of it's duties. Sure you can wire up a separate circuit to power and control those lights but you are effectively changing the load, albeit minimal, to the alternator and the rest of the charging system.

Even installing an aftermarket deep cycle battery will affect it. Our alternators are not designed to properly charge a deep cycle battery. I realized this after more research into why my dual deep cycle batteries were slowly discharging. And I mean SLOWLY. It took almost 2 years of incident free driving to realize that the alternator did not bring a deep cycle battery up to spec. There's a whole story to this but I won't clutter up this thread with that.

To address why I think this thread was started; A body mount chop, regardless of how you box it in or weld supports, will make it less safe in a crash. Some people may think they can make it stronger than factory and while that may be true, you've changed the dynamics of what is supposed to happen during a collision. Maybe that BMC is stronger but you've made another area weaker. Possibly to the point that it will cause more extensive damage than what was originally intended.

Bottom line, mod all you want but understand what you are doing to a product that was tested and tested and tested again.
 
Factory Nav

I maintain that the inability to use anything in navigation while in motion creates a safety risk instead of preventing one. I assume most drivers would try to program guidance before leaving, while sitting at a train, stoplight, etcetera. However, in a rush most of us will get on the road headed the right direction and then start looking for directions. Be honest, how many people really need directions out of their own subdivision or driveway?! So instead of selecting a nice open stretch of no traffic to program the gps for directions, I'm supposed use voice commands to get directions. That might be fine, except the vehicle it too noisy above 20mph to recognize voice commands to input a detailed address that it doesn't already know. I can't tell you how many times I've tried this and it's nothing but an exercise in futility, the voice recognition is crap above 20mph, and worthless above 40. I can't even get it to properly change a radio station while cruising straight on the interstate. :redbrick:

So now I have pull over to the shoulder and stop to put in the address (creating a hazard for other drivers). Well that's not going to happen. So instead I grab my phone and have to pull up the app, and get directions loaded into it. So instead of being an attentive driver who's occasionally pushing an easy to find button on the dash while looking out as much as possible, I've now become an frustrated (can't use features I paid for), pissed off (features which are supposed to help don't work), and distracted driver who's got only one hand available while holding the phone trying to type on the tiny little phone keyboard which I'm holding much lower than the factory nav unit (means I'm looking away from the road for longer periods of time). Safety feature? No, it's an anti-lawsuit measure. Toyo made it so that drivers aren't distracted by factory vehicle features while driving, and it's the driver's choice to use a mobile device while in motion.

I can't wait to dump the factory head unit which requires a complicated box and expensive box to modulate a signal in order to override it's "safety" features. Soldering an aftermarket's head unit parking brake sensor wire back to ground is a much simpler although more expensive solution. Although in doing so I could also get a head unit that runs all Android apps instead of a few selected apps the manufacturer decides are important. This upgrade will be secondary to ditching the :censored: safety hazard of factory tires! I'm not going to start on those as my 4Runner loses traction on dry pavement routinely!
 
I think any sort of mod that is done(especially mods for off-roading) diminish the on-road safety of the vehicle. I think most of us are aware of that, but it doesn't hurt to point it out from time to time.

As far as the OEM safety of the 4Runner goes, I have a positive opinion of it as I do for Toyota vehicles overall. it has airbags all over the place and a stout frame. The results of the overlap test make me a little nervous(which in my opinion is compounded by a BMC). Also, I would like to see Toyota revisit the panic braking behavior of the 4runner. It really needs to have a more linear application of the brakes. When it reacts so violently, I have a tendency to back off of the brakes a little, and that is not a good thing. My 2011 FJ reacted the same way.

All of that being said, I still feel plenty safe in my ride.
 
I haven't read the other posts, but one thing that concerns me is the Partial overlap frontal impact of the 4Runner and how it crushes into the passenger cabin. A few other mid-size SUV's bounced off the wall sooner than the 4Runner allowing a safer amount of room for the front passenger. Looking at the video, the airbags do a good job in keeping the upper portion of the dummy safe.

Now, as far as positive safety features go, all vehicles in general have come a long way. I think the integration of ABS with stability control and anti-slip do a good job at preventing an accident in the first place. If an accident cannot be prevented then the active safety features come into play; front airbags, knee airbags, curtain airbags, crumple zones and much better frame designs that strength the cabin and permit the outer structures to take most of the impact.

Technology changes in safety usually get better, so I could say that I feel safer putting my 2 daughter's, a 1.5 year old and a 4 year old, in the 4Runner than in my 06 Tacoma or in our 07 Camry that we replaced with the 4Runner.

Edit: Here is the 4Runner IIHS overlap test: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q70jNH-FnVY
Here are the top rated ones: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjynD0ZW420
 
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I feel pretty safe in my 4Runner, especially since I seem to be the only one on the entire damn road that's paying attention to what's going on.
 
I don't have any opinions about safety...that's why we have the NHTSA. They give the 2013 4runner 4/5 starts in frontal impact, 5/5 in side impact, and 3/5 in rollover tests.
Learning from you all, I know that the component that is modified during the body mount chop is the highest strength steel used in the frame. No direct loads are on that part of the frame, so it's purpose has to be related to crash-worthiness.
Assuming Toyota knows their sh*t, and they spent the money to use high MPa steel in that area...removing it logically has to degrade either the front or side impact crash tests. In my humble opinion.
Not saying I wouldn't modify mine if I ever feel the need for bigger shoes...but know it is a trade-off.
 
If I were King, I'd require technology that kills cell phones while the motor's running.

Safety? Lifts, oversized luggy tires, suspension alterations, wheel spacers, hundreds of pounds of bumpers/winches, frame alterations, all reduce the engineered-in integrity or dynamics or safety of the vehicle. Very much? Me not know, but guessing this is where 1E is headed.
 
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This here is my safety, sir.


No, seriously, I'm the reason I stay safe on the road, not my vehicle. If I fail to keep myself safe and my vehicle picks up the slack, that's a bonus, but beyond making sure the brakes work and the wheels aren't falling off and my seatbelt is fastened, I don't pay any particular attention to the safety features of any vehicle I'm driving.

Until they get in my way, and then I swear at them and curse the ancestry of the lily livered engineers that installed them and the candy ass lawyers that made them do it and the dumbass sue-happy society we live in.
 
Antman said:
I feel pretty safe in my 4Runner, especially since I seem to be the only one on the entire damn road that's paying attention to what's going on.
Click to expand...

This and what [MENTION=49649]KidVermicious[/MENTION] said, I don't have any data but my spidey sense tells me that random accidents can, do and will happen but I am much more likely to get into one in a car or life in general by making poor choices such as.....driving while drunk, driving while texting, driving while looking back at the kids in the back seat, driving while getting sexual favors, driving like a jack a$$, driving to fast for the conditions, driving when tired but to stubborn to stop for the night etc are far more likely to cause accidents/harm and decrease my "life span" then if I drive a Ford or a Volvo.

No, I am not saying driving a motorcycle or a 1960's sedan is just as safe as a modern car but I am saying that if you take out the "extreme cases" and assume Toyota Avalon vs. Mercedes S600 that the difference in safety ratings wouldn't be the reason I buy one or the other.

I would like to spend more time comparing some modern crash data as because of my "thoughts" above it was not a priority and I just assumed that the 4runner was a "safe" vehicle to drive.

What I do believe in is modern accident avoidance features (all should have the choice to turn off) such as traction control, vehicle skid control, back up cameras, lane departure warnings, blind spot monitoring etc for the average driver. I like to think of myself as above average and that those features don't help me out as much as someone who tends to exhibit some of the behaviors mentioned above. Do these make us better drivers......I don't believe so but they help make up for lack of driver skill and awareness (even the best of us are not perfect).
 
rydr1 said:
Here is the 4Runner IIHS overlap test: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q70jNH-FnVY
Here are the top rated ones: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjynD0ZW420
Click to expand...

The best small overlap video I've seen is the Volvo XC90. https://youtu.be/lPL0Vi_8fiI It deflects the impact and barely slows down or changes direction (acceleration). If the wheel wasn't sheared off you might not even notice the crash! That seems way better than trying to absorb the impact, which requires a stronger structure and more energy absorbing stuff.


Bevo said:
Also, I would like to see Toyota revisit the panic braking behavior of the 4runner. It really needs to have a more linear application of the brakes. When it reacts so violently, I have a tendency to back off of the brakes a little, and that is not a good thing. My 2011 FJ reacted the same way.
Click to expand...

The panic braking feature ("Brake Assist") is annoying. I assume in the 5th gen it works like my 4th gen. If you hit the brakes harder than a moderately fast stop it automatically applies maximum braking force disproportionate to
how hard you are pressing the pedal. I'm perfectly capable of stomping on the pedal if I need to panic stop, so I'd prefer if the feature wasn't there or if it was more subtle or linear (rather than what seems like on/off).

Not a stock safety feature, but on my wish list: I think electronic driving aids are a good idea, even if they are only slightly helpful, and I would like to see more of them. I think infrared night vision projected on a heads up display would be awesome, and some BMWs already have night vision and some already have heads up displays. It would be helpful to see people and animals by the side of the road at night and in bad weather. A highly advanced system could process the images for you and outline potential objects, but that would be more difficult to program. And you could have extremely bright infrared headlights with a wide beam that the camera can see but that don't blind other drivers (except, temporarily, their infrared cameras). You could even get around blinding other cameras by flashing the infrared headlights in sync with your camera but out of sync with other vehicles' cameras. I could DIY something, but high power infrared LEDs are expensive, and infrared filtered incandescent lights are hard to focus and emit enough red light to be questionably legal.

This would be a good one for a DIY project.
SFH 4761 OSRAM Opto Semiconductors | Mouser

I like safety technology, but not entertainment technology. I don't want satellite radio, navigation, voice control, touch screens, etc. My smartphone can do all that better, anyway, and when I want to upgrade I can buy a new one from a couple years ago for $200.
 
Why do I have the feeling that this thread is going to eventually end with somebody's feelings being hurt?......
 
1engineer said:
Recently a thread on a Body Mount Chop (BMC) called into question the possibility of reducing the effectiveness (if any) of that feature. It made me think of the 4Runner and safety in general, hence this post.

I would like you to post a short paragraph on YOUR OPINION of the 5th Gen 4Runner's safety aspects. It can be about anything as long as it involves the OEM safety features.

I have something to say too but I want to wait until several of you post as to not cloud anyone's opinion. Thanks!
Click to expand...

I'm going to go try and find something OEM and change it.
 
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