5th Gen - KDSS Compatible Lower Control Arms!

TOTAL CHAOS said:
Thanks for posting up. That is a normal amount. Per our Installation Instructions, there may be some contact at full lock :)

TOTAL CHAOS
WWW.CHAOSFAB.COM
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Grinding off the steering stop won't potentially cause issues to the rack? I know the titan lift kits some companies sold had too big of steering stops which caused the rack to press against it and potentially blow the rack apart. Then again, i blew out 6 of those racks on no lift kit:wacko:
 
honda250xtitan said:
Grinding off the steering stop won't potentially cause issues to the rack? I know the titan lift kits some companies sold had too big of steering stops which caused the rack to press against it and potentially blow the rack apart. Then again, i blew out 6 of those racks on no lift kit:wacko:
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You will not have issues when trimming the steering stops and running TOTAL CHAOS LCA's. At full lock there is slight contact of the ball joint cradle and the arm. This prevents the rack from overextending. If you trimmed the steering stops with stock LCA's, there will certainly be problems.

TOTAL CHAOS
WWW.CHAOSFAB.COM
 
Swarty said:
You guys going to do LT with KDSS too?
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In short, LT with KDSS isn't really a viable option. They will always compete with each other and negate the benefits of the other, especially off-road. You'll spend a lot of money and time on LT and KDSS will hold it back. Which one makes more sense will depend on your setup, requirements, and driving style. True LT works best without sway bars off road, but it can be sketchy to say the least on pavement, let alone in an unpredictable situation. This is why many with LT will opt for an aftermarket sway bar on the rear axle to reduce "scary sway" while keeping it off-road savvy. Your best bet is to wait for something to need repair on your KDSS system and remove it in favor of the setup I mentioned above. Or jump the gun and go for it sooner. Hope this helps :thumb3:

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MTN4RNR said:
In short, LT with KDSS isn't really a viable option. They will always compete with each other and negate the benefits of the other, especially off-road. You'll spend a lot of money and time on LT and KDSS will hold it back. Which one makes more sense will depend on your setup, requirements, and driving style. True LT works best without sway bars off road, but it can be sketchy to say the least on pavement, let alone in an unpredictable situation. This is why many with LT will opt for an aftermarket sway bar on the rear axle to reduce "scary sway" while keeping it off-road savvy. Your best bet is to wait for something to need repair on your KDSS system and remove it in favor of the setup I mentioned above. Or jump the gun and go for it sooner. Hope this helps :thumb3:
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Or hurry up in inventing the "KDSS Off" switch...
 
MTN4RNR said:
A few benefits that I know of over OEM are that you can service the poly bushings and the LBJ without having to replace the whole arm which is what the dealer will do with any excessive bushing wear, or lower ball joint failure. That and they'll play friendlier with the angles when lifted over stock, allowing more free movement and higher clearance at the LCA bottom. I like the fact that if you have a LBJ issue with these on the trail, you can easily have parts for a replacement versus needing to carry an entire OEM LCA because you cannot service the stock LBJ.
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Just an FYI, you can service the bushings on the OEM LCA (KDSS) without replacing the whole arm

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/259371-15-toyota-4runner-kdss-w-king-shocks-clunk.html#post3037437
 
borfoo3 said:
Just an FYI, you can service the bushings on the OEM LCA (KDSS) without replacing the whole arm

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/5th-gen-t4rs/259371-15-toyota-4runner-kdss-w-king-shocks-clunk.html#post3037437
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That’s true. You can replace the bushings, if they’re not seized, which can make it near impossible. I have also heard from others that it’s not uncommon for dealerships to replace the whole lower when the bushings go depending on whether or not they’re difficult to remove. But you’re right, they’re not impossible to replace.
 
MTN4RNR said:
In short, LT with KDSS isn't really a viable option. They will always compete with each other and negate the benefits of the other, especially off-road. You'll spend a lot of money and time on LT and KDSS will hold it back. Which one makes more sense will depend on your setup, requirements, and driving style. True LT works best without sway bars off road, but it can be sketchy to say the least on pavement, let alone in an unpredictable situation. This is why many with LT will opt for an aftermarket sway bar on the rear axle to reduce "scary sway" while keeping it off-road savvy. Your best bet is to wait for something to need repair on your KDSS system and remove it in favor of the setup I mentioned above. Or jump the gun and go for it sooner. Hope this helps :thumb3:
Click to expand...

On the rear I agree since you increase the angular travel of the solid axle. LT front is only from a longer LCA though. Not a larger angle than extended travel shocks already offer or people would trashing their CVs. KDSS would allow the same angle of travel already offered by the stock LCA which shouldn’t limit anything. Right now at full flex with KDSS I’m only limited by the bump stops and shock travel. With longer arms that statement should still be true but the arms would reach further just like if I didn’t have KDSS.

I could see the leverage difference causing the KDSS sway bar to put an extra load on the extended LCA but even that seems like a straightforward engineering question.

As a side note the LT on the raptor comes with a front sway bar and not a rear for this very reason. The pivot point of IFS system allow full travel with a sway bar and that doesn’t have any disconnect system.
 
Swarty said:
On the rear I agree since you increase the angular travel of the solid axle. LT front is only from a longer LCA though. Not a larger angle than extended travel shocks already offer or people would trashing their CVs. KDSS would allow the same angle of travel already offered by the stock LCA which shouldn’t limit anything. Right now at full flex with KDSS I’m only limited by the bump stops and shock travel. With longer arms that statement should still be true but the arms would reach further just like if I didn’t have KDSS.

I could see the leverage difference causing the KDSS sway bar to put an extra load on the extended LCA but even that seems like a straightforward engineering question.

As a side note the LT on the raptor comes with a front sway bar and not a rear for this very reason. The pivot point of IFS system allow full travel with a sway bar and that doesn’t have any disconnect system.
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It’s not that KDSS will technically limit your travel, but it’s the high speed versus low speed that will play effect. Low speed articulation will be fine, but it’s at higher speeds when the KDSS valve is locked out that you will find that it limits suspension movement because it won’t allow for independent articulation between the front and rear, taking away from the performance and valving of whatever shock you have installed.
 
MTN4RNR said:
That’s true. You can replace the bushings, if they’re not seized, which can make it near impossible. I have also heard from others that it’s not uncommon for dealerships to replace the whole lower when the bushings go depending on whether or not they’re difficult to remove. But you’re right, they’re not impossible to replace.
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Mine were rusted in quite bad. It took a bit of 'convincing' for them to come out with penetrating fluid, oil and hammer/ chisel. If they don't pop out, use the hammer/ chisel to deform the bushing housing into itself and it'll pop off. There's enough clearance in the bushing to make it work.

They are serviceable for sure. Don't let anyone be lazy on you and pass the bill for a new LCA unless you need an excuse to go LT :keyboard:
 
borfoo3 said:
Mine were rusted in quite bad. It took a bit of 'convincing' for them to come out with penetrating fluid, oil and hammer/ chisel. If they don't pop out, use the hammer/ chisel to deform the bushing housing into itself and it'll pop off. There's enough clearance in the bushing to make it work.

They are serviceable for sure. Don't let anyone be lazy on you and pass the bill for a new LCA unless you need an excuse to go LT :keyboard:
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Yeah I remember seeing the photos of your OEM bushing replacement. My initial comment was less for the mechanically inclined / determined and more for someone who might have a shop or dealership do their work. But personally, I’d rather upgrade versus replacing the bushings not because they can’t be replaced, but I like the added benefits that come with the TC product.
 
Swarty said:
You guys going to do LT with KDSS too?
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No plans to incorporate KDSS into our Long Travel kits. Stock width is going to be the only KDSS compatible option.

Speaking of stock width! We are still working on getting photos of these arms INSTALLED on a KDSS equipped 4Runner. Mostly close ups of all of the components. We released these not too long ago and don't have customer shots yet. Thank you for your patience!

TOTAL CHAOS
WWW.CHAOSFAB.COM
 
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