Thai
Elite Member
What does the EPA show? Maybe i am outdated with what i remembered.
5th Gen vs. 4th Gen ( Full Time 4wd etc.)
- Thread starter sapper843
- Start date
What does the EPA show? Maybe i am outdated with what i remembered.
Koz
New member
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kingpin748
New member
What's the problem here? Everyone knows the 5th is far superior to the 4th.
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JB.
New member
In terms of "get where you're going capability", nothing to be concerned with.
It can be looked at a lot of different ways, but here's one that shakes out in favor of part-time. Leaving it in 2wd unless you really need 4WD will help you avoid going too fast for conditions.
In slick road conditions without VSC, AWD mode would be significantly safer by reducing rear wheel spin causing possible loss of control. VSC takes care of most of that, though.
Think of full-time 4WD as a luxury, because that's mostly what it is. Much more useful than most luxuries, but a luxury nonetheless.
JB.
New member
Excellent. That'll calm things down.
Koz
New member
VSC is important to avoid losing control, which should not be needed if you know how to drive in bad weather. I've had it for many years and I can count on one hand how many times it has kicked in. Now on the other hand, full time 4WD with a LSCD has helped more then I would want to count.
Koz
JB.
New member
In most cases you could, of course, achieve an eventual running speed in 2wd equal to 4wd but it's much easier to get an appreciation for how slick it is in 2wd which may result in many people keeping the speed lower than they might otherwise.
Huh? I know you like donuts and you also know what stops you from doing them with VSC on.
I love the 4Runners FT4WD and, yes, there are aspects of it that enhance safety but it's a complicated equation and I'm not sure it always nets out safer (e.g., above) so I don't bother trying to present it that way. There are a lot of nice things about it, though, that I would miss were it gone. Very practical things, but mostly, just nice things to have.
Curt Sauve
New member
Part time 4x4 is for the "back to it's roots" type people that live in the South, and use their "rig" to run trails or rocks. They don't have to deal with changing weather conditions such as going from dry pavement to black ice under blowing and drifting snow. If you live above the snow line, don't even consider any SUV without AWD capability. If you live south of I10 you probably don't even know what these weather terms mean, if you live in ND, well,..... get used to it.
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Just read through this thread, and want to throw in my two cents...
To the OP, either the 4th or the 5th gen will be great. I wouldn't make my decision on which generation to get based soley on the type of 4wd system. They'll each work, and it's just important to know how to drive each (which is easier with the 4th gen because you can use 4hi without any changes in your driving habits).
I was born and raised in the Sierra Nevadas. Driving to Kirkwood has been a weekly habit since I was sixteen. My first car was a cheap little Toyota Celica (fwd) with crappy tires. I was broke and didn't know any better. In foul weather, I just drove slow and carefully, and never had any problems.
When I was eighteen I bought a 4X4 Toyota pickup. I had to get out to lock the hubs. The weather around here is famous for changing very quickly. My pickup was terrible in weather until the hubs were locked. Not knowing any better, I drove it in 4X4 if there was any chance of weather. It never effected anything. I just had to be careful about turning too aggressively on dry pavement or the wheels would skip. Never a problem.
I currently drive a 4th gen 4Runner (V6), and I love it. It is a beast. I love the versatility of the 4X4 system. I'm going to drive this truck until it dies, and when I replace it, it'll be with a new 4Runner (I have an affinity for the trail edition:guitar3
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The point I'm trying to make it that the 4th gen has a great system, but the 5th gen will work great too, and the 5th gen trail edition is a more off-road capable vehicle. The 5th gen is just a more traditional system. If I had a part-time 4X4, I'd switch into 4WD in any foul weather. No big deal. Some are way over-thinking it. Just don't corner as hard.
To the OP, either the 4th or the 5th gen will be great. I wouldn't make my decision on which generation to get based soley on the type of 4wd system. They'll each work, and it's just important to know how to drive each (which is easier with the 4th gen because you can use 4hi without any changes in your driving habits).
I was born and raised in the Sierra Nevadas. Driving to Kirkwood has been a weekly habit since I was sixteen. My first car was a cheap little Toyota Celica (fwd) with crappy tires. I was broke and didn't know any better. In foul weather, I just drove slow and carefully, and never had any problems.
When I was eighteen I bought a 4X4 Toyota pickup. I had to get out to lock the hubs. The weather around here is famous for changing very quickly. My pickup was terrible in weather until the hubs were locked. Not knowing any better, I drove it in 4X4 if there was any chance of weather. It never effected anything. I just had to be careful about turning too aggressively on dry pavement or the wheels would skip. Never a problem.
I currently drive a 4th gen 4Runner (V6), and I love it. It is a beast. I love the versatility of the 4X4 system. I'm going to drive this truck until it dies, and when I replace it, it'll be with a new 4Runner (I have an affinity for the trail edition:guitar3
. The point I'm trying to make it that the 4th gen has a great system, but the 5th gen will work great too, and the 5th gen trail edition is a more off-road capable vehicle. The 5th gen is just a more traditional system. If I had a part-time 4X4, I'd switch into 4WD in any foul weather. No big deal. Some are way over-thinking it. Just don't corner as hard.
First you say that the EPA doesn't show a significant difference and now you say this?
LOL, look it up yourself Thai. You're so good at getting facts and figures, right? So why ask me to do your legwork for you?:hello:
Curt Sauve
New member
I don't mean any offense JB, but this is reaching. You're speaking about the concern of the driver, which is not a benefit of the mechanics of the vehicle. In other words, 2WD will do nothing to keep a driver from driving too fast for conditions. That is a choice of the driver. I understand the point you're trying to make, but it is not an accurate comparison. Everything being equal with two drivers driving appropriately for the conditions, and the 4WD will provide better traction.
To illustrate this further, examine this quote for the website http://www.4x4abc.com/jeep101/safe.html
"4WD/AWD safety - Is 4WD/AWD safer on snow and ice? [snip] However, once moving the physics for all vehicles are equal. 1WD, 2WD, 4WD, 6WD etc. All motor vehicles need traction for safe steering - 4WD/AWD does not provide extra traction for steering. All cars need traction for safe braking - 4WD/AWD does not provide extra traction for braking. In that sense 2WD is "safer" - it leaves you stranded early and keeps you out of trouble. The trouble only 4WD/AWD owners might get into."
This was written by somebody who has never driven in the snow. I've driven all types on ice, and there is a night and day difference in steering traction between a RWD vehicle and a FWD vehicle, and between a FWD vehicle an AWD vehicle.
But the last part, where "2WD is safer" because it "leaves you stranded early and keeps you out if trouble," is the worst sort of logical fallacy.
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JB.
New member
It's a long thread that started to meander (hard to believe, I know). My "reach" was in the spirit of zeroing back in on the purpose of the thread and allaying the concern of the thread starter - your aforementioned driver - about the possible need to spend extra money he may not have had for a vehicle he didn't sound like he needed or wanted. If the, admittedly, too absolute sounding 2wd remark made the decision easier or clearer, that was its purpose. My reading was he just wanted to know if it was okay to not buy a Limited.
I prefer sticking to mechanicals too, even if the subject is safety. Way easier than trying to work in the complexities of possible behavioral effects.
SeattleMike
New member
I have a Trail, chose it over the Limited knowing basically what the differences were and after 38k miles and every kind of weather driving, I would still choose it over the Limited because it looks better and slipping from 2Hi to 4Hi takes all of about 2 seconds. If I was driving in town all day, during a longish winter, I might have gone the other way. If I was driving mostly highways during that same longish winter, I'd choose the Trail.
In my opinion, the only regular benefit to the Limited's torsen diff is when you frequently have to make turns on mixed traction surfaces, like city streets in snow and ice and bare pavement. My area and lifestyle doesn't meet that criteria, so I got the better looking trim level and I pay more attention when the weather is snowy/freezy.
In my opinion, the only regular benefit to the Limited's torsen diff is when you frequently have to make turns on mixed traction surfaces, like city streets in snow and ice and bare pavement. My area and lifestyle doesn't meet that criteria, so I got the better looking trim level and I pay more attention when the weather is snowy/freezy.
Thai
Elite Member
As usual, WEAK!
oblivionis
New member
I think the real debate here is what is better, 4Gen ability to switch between 2WD and full time 4WD or 5Gen AWD. If you agree that 2WD is more efficient than AWD than the 4Gen is better since you'd drive in 2WD most of the year and only keep it in 4WD during winter. But if AWD is as efficient as 2WD than the 5Gen is better since you don't have to switch back and forth between 2WD and 4WD. I would just like to add that this is for people that use the 4Runner as their daily driver and not hardcore off road stuff which is a whole different discussion.
So the question is: is 4Gen 4WD in 2WD mode more efficient than 5Gen Limited AWD???
So the question is: is 4Gen 4WD in 2WD mode more efficient than 5Gen Limited AWD???
