KNorm92
New member
Looks super cool man!
5th Gen Wheel & Tire Thread
- Thread starter MikeDeuce
- Start date
Tire and wheel novice so I have to ask. How can 265-70-17 tires rub when they are a stock size? Offset difference of the wheel? Larger wheel width (this should actually decrease the chance of rub, no?) I have a brand new 18 LE 4WD and I want to fit 17" in wheels and "slightly" wider and more aggressive looking tires but want ZERO rub. Please enlighten me.
I'm assuming that the rub on these stock sized wheels and tires was caused entirely by the 1.25 spacers?
285/70 Falken Wildpeak AT3W paired with SCS RAY10 in brushed copper finish!
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Those tires look huge! How much lift and modification to make them fit?
Angonemoto
New member
rzgkane: Without a doubt.
Im sure that is the problem since the tires are stock spec. The rubbing was so minuscule but enough for me to not want to hear it anymore so we pulled the flaps off. In the spring when we get a chance to drive terrain where the suspension will encounter more articulation I suspect I will get some rubbing again.
Im sure that is the problem since the tires are stock spec. The rubbing was so minuscule but enough for me to not want to hear it anymore so we pulled the flaps off. In the spring when we get a chance to drive terrain where the suspension will encounter more articulation I suspect I will get some rubbing again.
Jetboy
New member
The first part is a quote from another thread. From me a few months ago.
-
The one tire I would stay away from is Toyo AT2. I've had a LOT of balancing problems with them. So far I've had 7 tires to get 4 that sorta balance. 2 are good enough to use up front and 2 are only able to be static balanced - so they're kinda only used on the rear tires (and yes that means I don't rotate them). None of the 7 could be balanced with road force balance without having so much weight that you'd have to double or triple stack tape weights on the rim and they usually don't stay on when you do that. I only have 35k miles total - and they were the second aftermarket set, so they haven't had a ton of miles on them.
The plus side is that they have proven to be really durable in all sorts of terrain and have great traction on the rocks. They're pretty quiet on the street. And they're pretty good in snow/ice conditions. I'm probably going to ditch the whole set and buy something else in the spring. I have one last offroad trip planned this fall and then I'll be running on my street wheels/tires until spring most likely.
I think it may be just an issue with this particular size or something. Lots of good reviews on them. Maybe I'm just unlucky? I have no idea. All I can say for sure is that my experience would push me toward something else just for balancing issues. Everything else was good.
Flash forward to yesterday. I finally got some time to go to the tires shop. Local discount tire. I had a phone conversation with Toyo's customer service folks and then took the tires to the shop. I have 2 brand new tires with less than 20 miles on one of them, and maybe 1000 on the other. And I'm currently at 7 tires so far - 3 of them were rejects. One of the set of 4 had a bulge from an old patch in the tread area. Discount Tire didn't think it was safe to work on that one. No problem. I agreed after looking at it. Not one of the other 3 would balance. Keep in mind 2 of them are basically brand new. The other has about 10-15k miles on it - and is about half way worn out. (yeah they wear fast for the first half of the tread, the lower tread is harder rubber I'd bet).
Anyway toyo then basically said that they don't trust what I'm doing with them because I didn't have the tire shop mount them on the vehicle. As if I'm taking them home and putting them on what? A 1 ton with 6x5.5 wheels? WTH? And we argued for about 30 minutes about whether it matters at all what they're going on if 3 consecutive brand new tires couldn't be balanced when brand new. If they can't balance new - why would the vehicle they're going on matter? Their general claim was that this was such an anomaly to have 7 out of round tires for one customer that it must be my vehicle (yes - even though they couldn't balance them in the shop brand new). - and yes we tested the wheel runout and balance. We also put a different tire on the wheels and both balanced and road force balanced them. - Perfectly round wheels, low weights on other tires.
They apparently think that I must be abusing them by using them offroad. Somehow I'm doing it even before I leave the tire shop. I'm kind of a badass like that. They wilt under my strong gaze. But at the same time they told me it was perfectly fine to run them at 15psi on the trails, and recommended I not go over 26psi for highway driving. Yeah - they said 26psi is the correct street pressure for a 4runner with those tires, I heard them correctly. 35psi is way too high. They also agreed that they were the appropriate tires for a 4runner.
The tire shop guy also spoke with them on the phone and had the same argument. In the end - Toyo did agree to buy them back and either send a new set or just credit back through the supply chain the costs and the tires are going back to Toyo (or in the trash I don't know what actually happens to them).
Discount tire was excellent to work with. No issues whatsoever with them. They spent a good deal of time messing around with my junk. Never charged me for anything after the original purchase, and for the difference in cost of the new tires compared to what I paid for the other ones.
So - I chose not to replace them again with more of the same. At that point I'd be putting on tires 8-11. At some point it's just not worth repeating the same foolishness.
I really loved the performance offroad. I only had one flat the entire time. But I suspect I need to eat some crow and accept that at least Toyo's P rated tires are not built well enough to use offroad - or possibly even on road. With the exception of the one tire with a rock through the tread, none of the others had any visible bulging or other sign that they were breaking down. I don't know what else I can really conclude about why they were so problematic. I've argued quite a bit on here over the years that LT tires are overkill and P rated tires are fine for on and offroad use. I'm kinda mixed on it now. Is it a manufacturer specific problem? Or just an anomaly? I'm not sure.
I don't do a lot of hardcore offroad use. But I also ended up buying a complete 2nd set of wheels/tires for highway use because I got so tired of the steering wheel vibrations from those tires. So for my replacements I ended up just buying Cooper AT3s in 285/75/17. I was on the fence between STT Pros in a 285/70 or AT3 in a 285/75. I decided that I rarely go in deep mud, and I usually get high centered rather than stuck from tire traction, so the taller tire is going to be better for me than the more aggressive one. And they should run pretty quiet too, which is pretty standard for my offroading to drive a few hundred miles of highway each direction. They're almost 34" tall, hopefully they fit without too much cutting. We'll find out maybe next week. Since I only put them on for offroad trips, they only get maybe 2-4k miles a year. I doubt I'll regear or anything like that.
Anyway - long story, but that's my saga about toyo AT2s. I've defended P rated tires for a long time on here. They've been all over Moab and through the Rubicon without any complaint. Great traction overall in the dirt. But just wouldn't stay round. And that's a deal breaker for an all terrain tire IMO.
-
The one tire I would stay away from is Toyo AT2. I've had a LOT of balancing problems with them. So far I've had 7 tires to get 4 that sorta balance. 2 are good enough to use up front and 2 are only able to be static balanced - so they're kinda only used on the rear tires (and yes that means I don't rotate them). None of the 7 could be balanced with road force balance without having so much weight that you'd have to double or triple stack tape weights on the rim and they usually don't stay on when you do that. I only have 35k miles total - and they were the second aftermarket set, so they haven't had a ton of miles on them.
The plus side is that they have proven to be really durable in all sorts of terrain and have great traction on the rocks. They're pretty quiet on the street. And they're pretty good in snow/ice conditions. I'm probably going to ditch the whole set and buy something else in the spring. I have one last offroad trip planned this fall and then I'll be running on my street wheels/tires until spring most likely.
I think it may be just an issue with this particular size or something. Lots of good reviews on them. Maybe I'm just unlucky? I have no idea. All I can say for sure is that my experience would push me toward something else just for balancing issues. Everything else was good.
Flash forward to yesterday. I finally got some time to go to the tires shop. Local discount tire. I had a phone conversation with Toyo's customer service folks and then took the tires to the shop. I have 2 brand new tires with less than 20 miles on one of them, and maybe 1000 on the other. And I'm currently at 7 tires so far - 3 of them were rejects. One of the set of 4 had a bulge from an old patch in the tread area. Discount Tire didn't think it was safe to work on that one. No problem. I agreed after looking at it. Not one of the other 3 would balance. Keep in mind 2 of them are basically brand new. The other has about 10-15k miles on it - and is about half way worn out. (yeah they wear fast for the first half of the tread, the lower tread is harder rubber I'd bet).
Anyway toyo then basically said that they don't trust what I'm doing with them because I didn't have the tire shop mount them on the vehicle. As if I'm taking them home and putting them on what? A 1 ton with 6x5.5 wheels? WTH? And we argued for about 30 minutes about whether it matters at all what they're going on if 3 consecutive brand new tires couldn't be balanced when brand new. If they can't balance new - why would the vehicle they're going on matter? Their general claim was that this was such an anomaly to have 7 out of round tires for one customer that it must be my vehicle (yes - even though they couldn't balance them in the shop brand new). - and yes we tested the wheel runout and balance. We also put a different tire on the wheels and both balanced and road force balanced them. - Perfectly round wheels, low weights on other tires.
They apparently think that I must be abusing them by using them offroad. Somehow I'm doing it even before I leave the tire shop. I'm kind of a badass like that. They wilt under my strong gaze. But at the same time they told me it was perfectly fine to run them at 15psi on the trails, and recommended I not go over 26psi for highway driving. Yeah - they said 26psi is the correct street pressure for a 4runner with those tires, I heard them correctly. 35psi is way too high. They also agreed that they were the appropriate tires for a 4runner.
The tire shop guy also spoke with them on the phone and had the same argument. In the end - Toyo did agree to buy them back and either send a new set or just credit back through the supply chain the costs and the tires are going back to Toyo (or in the trash I don't know what actually happens to them).
Discount tire was excellent to work with. No issues whatsoever with them. They spent a good deal of time messing around with my junk. Never charged me for anything after the original purchase, and for the difference in cost of the new tires compared to what I paid for the other ones.
So - I chose not to replace them again with more of the same. At that point I'd be putting on tires 8-11. At some point it's just not worth repeating the same foolishness.
I really loved the performance offroad. I only had one flat the entire time. But I suspect I need to eat some crow and accept that at least Toyo's P rated tires are not built well enough to use offroad - or possibly even on road. With the exception of the one tire with a rock through the tread, none of the others had any visible bulging or other sign that they were breaking down. I don't know what else I can really conclude about why they were so problematic. I've argued quite a bit on here over the years that LT tires are overkill and P rated tires are fine for on and offroad use. I'm kinda mixed on it now. Is it a manufacturer specific problem? Or just an anomaly? I'm not sure.
I don't do a lot of hardcore offroad use. But I also ended up buying a complete 2nd set of wheels/tires for highway use because I got so tired of the steering wheel vibrations from those tires. So for my replacements I ended up just buying Cooper AT3s in 285/75/17. I was on the fence between STT Pros in a 285/70 or AT3 in a 285/75. I decided that I rarely go in deep mud, and I usually get high centered rather than stuck from tire traction, so the taller tire is going to be better for me than the more aggressive one. And they should run pretty quiet too, which is pretty standard for my offroading to drive a few hundred miles of highway each direction. They're almost 34" tall, hopefully they fit without too much cutting. We'll find out maybe next week. Since I only put them on for offroad trips, they only get maybe 2-4k miles a year. I doubt I'll regear or anything like that.
Anyway - long story, but that's my saga about toyo AT2s. I've defended P rated tires for a long time on here. They've been all over Moab and through the Rubicon without any complaint. Great traction overall in the dirt. But just wouldn't stay round. And that's a deal breaker for an all terrain tire IMO.
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Throwback
New member
Jetboy
New member
Yeah. They're E rated. Only way they come in 285/75/17.
. So far I've put around 800 miles on them. Smooth as can be. No imbalance perceptible at any speeds. Just as quiet as my street tire set - I've yet to swap them back. Might not need to have 2 sets now... They're not very aggressive tread pattern. So they're not going to be very good in the mud. I live in the desert and rarely go in the mud, so it's not a huge issue for me. If money were no object I would have probably gone for the ST Maxx, but they're about 10lb per tire heavier and over $100 per tire more expensive. I couldn't really justify the cost difference in both tires and fuel costs for my use where they likely wouldn't give me any measurable benefit other than looking cool. If it existed I would almost certainly have chosen the Cooper ATW over the AT3 though. I think the tread design is better for my overall needs. But they don't make it in that size.
My mileage since putting them on has hovered right about 15.2mpg on the computer. So adjusted for height maybe 16mpg. With my street tires that measure 33" tall, but P rated and much lighter weight, I get more like 17mpg reported in daily driving and 19ish reported on the computer on the highway. I can't say highway mpg yet on the new ones, but I'm sure it's more like 16. So the mpg hit is real and pretty significant - 2-3mpg in most situations. The power difference is pretty obvious too. That's my primary reason to swap back to the street tires. I don't know how gearing would help. I think 4.56 is still too low for me, but if there were 4.30 gears available I'd go for those. I might swap in 4.56 this spring to see how I like it.
As between the two - the AT3s are much nicer for every day use. No more steering wheel shimmy. I can't compare offroad performance yet. Haven't been out anywhere worth mentioning other than snowy parking lots.
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Faust301
New member
I have these rims in 17x9 5.71 backspace or 18mm and tires (265/70r17 E). Before the lift they did not rub at all. After my lift I added some 1.25 spacers and had to remove the front muflaps and move the front fender liners to not rub
2016 4Runner SR5
Senior Member
Wheel spacers are the cause of the rub, not the lift.
Faust301
New member
ABSOLUTELY! 110% agree
how bad would this setup rub on the stock suspension? i have an icon stage 2 setup sitting in my garage, just haven't had time to get it installed.
Looking to get new wheels. Got a 2" lift right now on a TRD PRO with 285/70/17 KO2.
Wheel I am interested in is in these two specs.
17x9
Offset: -12
Backspacing: 4.5"
or
17x9
Offset: 1
Backspacing - 5"
Have stock TRD Pro wheels on right now but don't like the look because th wheels are narrow and want more of a aggresive look.
Would I any of these two cause rubbing ?
Wheel I am interested in is in these two specs.
17x9
Offset: -12
Backspacing: 4.5"
or
17x9
Offset: 1
Backspacing - 5"
Have stock TRD Pro wheels on right now but don't like the look because th wheels are narrow and want more of a aggresive look.
Would I any of these two cause rubbing ?
With 285's I think your gonna rub with the -12 offset wheels.
I already rub on the front wheels when reversing at full lock on my 2” lift with stock TRD Pro wheels & 285/70/17. Would the extra 2” or 2.6” extra cause a problem ? The stock wheels vs the new wheels are same backspacing but more negative offset and wider.
Stock
Offset: 4mm
Backspacing: 4.5”
Width: 7”
New:
Offset: -12mm
Backspacing: 4.5”
Width: 9”
Stock
Offset: 4mm
Backspacing: 4.5”
Width: 7”
New:
Offset: -12mm
Backspacing: 4.5”
Width: 9”
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