5th gens sales keep climbing

[4FL]

I think the Jeep GC sells so many is that it starts out at a lower price, seems Jeep always has some sort of special on them (at least around where I am at), and just looking at it, looks more "street" than off-road which attracts people who have an interest in an SUV, but not in one going off-road or even looking like it can.

A lot of those Jeep GC have street tires, meaning like they came off a performance car or something; low profile, aggressive street tread, and the GC kind of sits down on them, like a highway patrol SUV or something.

 

[dredawg]

I do not know, I think for 2017 it will be the same platform, but the Patrol and Armada are different platforms pre-2017. The Armada is based on the Titan platform.

But maybe you are implying that, and that the Patrol is just Nissan's entry in other markets for this SUV class.

Correct. The previous Armada was based on the Titan platform..

However, I am referring to the newly introduced Armada for 2017, it is sold in other world markets under the Patrol name which has a long history..I believe as far as back as the Land Cruiser. I lived in Australia for a short while and the Patrol was just as popular as the Land Cruiser when it came to offroading.

 

[Fomer_FJ_owner805]

Funny thing I've noticed here in Los Angeles- I see an awful lot of face lifted 5th gens of all varieties but hardly any early model 5th gens (and mostly they are limited models). I really like the way early model 5th gen trails look!

looked on cars dot com only 20 Trail T4R with KDSS in the ground with in 100 miles of LA, thats not many for the second largest city in the USA, mall crawler or not.
BUT as a former FJC owner 4R was my 1st and foremost replacement choice. I expect most FJ owners coming back to T4R like me or replacement for FJs. I regret selling my FJ. Most FJ owners were waiting for a Gen 2 FJ but we all got the boot. 1st and last FJC were the same sad the FJC never worked out. FJC was a great community.

 

[sn_85]

I would not consider the Armada to even be the -slightest- bit off-road trail worthy....its just an obnoxious fat *****.



It really comes down to only the 4R and Jeep Wrangler.



There soon will be new competitors, well sort of - Jeep Wrangler pickup, Ranger, and Bronco....all a few years out.

Yeah it's obviously a POS...



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ip6zolLErQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ByzsT08RS4c

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62uj9re1cQg



The Patrol Y62 (which is what the Armada is built off of) is one of the most off road capable full size SUVs in other parts of the world. These things kill it in sand dunes in Dubai. The V8 is big, nasty, and offers plenty of torque. It would not be very hard to mod the Armada and make it very nice overland vehicle.

I do not know, I think for 2017 it will be the same platform, but the Patrol and Armada are different platforms pre-2017. The Armada is based on the Titan platform.



But maybe you are implying that, and that the Patrol is just Nissan's entry in other markets for this SUV class.

Correct. The 1st gen Armada was based off the Titan. The 2nd gen Armada which was just released is based off the Patrol Y62. It doesn't have the same off road goodies like lockers or terrain select but the underpinnings are exactly the same. ARB already sells air lockers for the Y62 and Kings, Radflo, and OME make aftermarket suspensions for the Y62 which would drop right into the Armada. And those side vents are actually functional so that you can put a snorkel right over it!!!



As I posted earlier, you could buy the Armada SL 4x4 for about $55k and then add air lockers, wheels and all terrain tires, and a new suspension and would still be $25-30k less than a brand new Land Cruiser. I think it's a great overland platform.

 

[4FL]

Correct. The previous Armada was based on the Titan platform..

However, I am referring to the newly introduced Armada for 2017, it is sold in other world markets under the Patrol name which has a long history..I believe as far as back as the Land Cruiser. I lived in Australia for a short while and the Patrol was just as popular as the Land Cruiser when it came to offroading.

Yes, they are pretty popular, I rode in one across part of Russia once, loved that thing. I see quite a few of them when I am out in Russia and central Asia.

Surprisingly, last year when I was in central Asia, I saw a lot of 4th gen 4runners, never seen any before up until that point.

 

[Terra Firma]

Warning! Pure Speculation to follow, but I found it very interesting so look into it if you'd like:

2017 Highlander and its new 3.5L GR-FKS and 8sp drivetrain. 295hp and 263ft/lbs. I bet refreshed 4Runner will feature same powertrain combination, hopefully tweaked from the Highlander as the MotorTrend testers did not love the programming.

2017 Toyota Highlander SE AWD First Test Review

Hoping the increasing sales numbers along with growing off-road marketplace keeps Toyota thinking about the 10%ers that use these things for intended off-road functionality!

 

[BlackWorksInc]

I'm gonna say that the "Hemi" marketing is paying off, along with the general state of the economy.

Which marketing the one where the valve seats fall out or the other head issues? Gobs of power in those engines, reliability isn't so much in my experience.

ever made?
remember the Gladiator and Wagoneer

Think one of biggest reasons for increased sales is low $$$ per gallon!

Forgot about the Wagoneer and I had to actually look up the gladiator. Didn't realize the Wagoneer was built BoF, thought it was similar to the Cherokees and Grand Cherokees with Chrysler's BS "Unit-Frame" (aka Unibody) design.

I don't consider the 5th gen a mid-size. That nose is just massive relative to the 3rd and 4th gens.

Yeah, well the Tacoma is huge compared to the Toyota Truck and 1st gen Tacoma; it's still "mid-sized." Full-sized SUVs are Land Cruisers, Expeditions, Sequoias, Armadas, ect.

Warning! Pure Speculation to follow, but I found it very interesting so look into it if you'd like:

2017 Highlander and its new 3.5L GR-FKS and 8sp drivetrain. 295hp and 263ft/lbs. I bet refreshed 4Runner will feature same combination, hopefully tweaked from the Highlander as the MotorTrend testers did not love the programming.

2017 Toyota Highlander SE AWD First Test Review

Hoping the increasing sales numbers along with growing off-road marketplace keeps Toyota thinking about the 10%ers that use these things for intended off-road functionality!

Why would you want a front-wheel drive engine with no capable transfercase or drivetrain in a 4Runner?

Post Note-

Didn't someone post pictures of a stock Armada flexing and the how horrible the rear independent suspension travel was? They may be built similar to the Nissan Patrol, but so far I've heard they are far less capable.

 

[Terra Firma]

Why would you want a front-wheel drive engine with no capable transfercase or drivetrain in a 4Runner?

Edited, I foresee that "powertrain" (8 speed in the 4Runner) obviously with Transfer case on it and all, but I digress..... Lets hope actual pictures of 6th gen are "Leaked" soon.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

Edited, I foresee that "powertrain" (8 speed in the 4Runner) obviously with Transfer case on it and all, but I digress..... Lets hope actual pictures of 6th gen are "Leaked" soon.

I doubt it, MANY people have been sorely unimpressed and unhappy with the Tacoma's 6spd transmission, I seriously doubt that if Toyota can't understand how to program a 6-spd to be both fuel-efficient and usable in a Truck/SUV scenario that they'd accomplish that with a rather pointless 8-spd. Additionally the only rear wheel drive 8-spd Toyota makes at the moment is in the Land Cruiser, which unless they are making a 5.7L 6th Gen, I do not foresee being used as the transfercase and running gear are meant for the Land Cruiser not the Tacoma/4Runner.

 

[gm350reratliff]

I'm betting the 6th gen doesn't happen until 2019, if at all. There will be no 6th gen (or it will be a very eco-friendly, uni-body version) due to the almost certain higher MPG mandates that will be coming if a certain politician gets elected in November.

 

[Justinmpd]

I wish I could have found a trail in white

 

[gm350reratliff]

I wish I could have found a trail in white

They're still making them. Should be fairly easy. Although we had to wait 3 months for ours.

Now try finding a Cement colored double cab TRD Pro tundra west of the Mississippi. So far, it's impossible.

 

[BlackWorksInc]

They're still making them. Should be fairly easy. Although we had to wait 3 months for ours.

Now try finding a Cement colored double cab TRD Pro tundra west of the Mississippi. So far, it's impossible.

LoL We just PDI'd one last week, I think it's still sitting in the lot.

Wait, that's a Tacoma... my bad.

 

[sn_85]

Post Note-



Didn't someone post pictures of a stock Armada flexing and the how horrible the rear independent suspension travel was? They may be built similar to the Nissan Patrol, but so far I've heard they are far less capable.

Yeah out of the box it doesn't have great suspension travel or articulation. Which is why I would upgrade the suspension to either Kings, Radflo, or OME which already make them for the Patrol Y62. The things that the Armada lacks as compared to the global Patrol is hill descent, multi-terrain select, and a sway bar disconnect system (sounds similar to KDSS). It still retains the BOF structure and V8 that everyone lusts for. I don't think it's ever going to tackle the Rubicon or anything but for most overland style off reading an upgraded Armada could absolutely do it. I posted a few youtube videos earlier in this thread and I think it could definitely surprise a few people.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Koddo]

People that think the Armada, or any full size truck/SUV for that matter, being trail worthy do not have very much experience off-roading.

These vehicles are simply too large (mainly wide) with approach/departure angles similar to that of a corolla (exaggerating). They are heavy and unwieldy in any real rough trail circumstance. They are ok for what I call "main" dirt roads. The trails that come off the main road....they are utterly useless (AZ speaking). They may work in the deserts of Africa, but here in the western US, not-at-all.

Hell I consider my 4R almost too large for most trails....I end up getting the brush cutters out for the branches that would really cause some damage....i've resigned myself to letting some scratch the paint. Also the breakover angle, approach and departure are ok but not great (I'm also not lifted).

My dad's 2 door TJU Rubicon with 3-4 inch lift and 33's is probably what I consider the sweet spot for a trail rig, in terms of dimensions, and that is still compliant and drive-able on-road. That thing is a beast....bulletproof 4.0 engine and front and rear lockers. Someday that beauty will be mine.

 

[dredawg]

People that think the Armada, or any full size truck/SUV for that matter, being trail worthy do not have very much experience off-roading.

These vehicles are simply too large (mainly wide) with approach/departure angles similar to that of a corolla (exaggerating). They are heavy and unwieldy in any real rough trail circumstance. They are ok for what I call "main" dirt roads. The trails that come off the main road....they are utterly useless (AZ speaking). They may work in the deserts of Africa, but here in the western US, not-at-all.

Hell I consider my 4R almost too large for most trails....I end up getting the brush cutters out for the branches that would really cause some damage....i've resigned myself to letting some scratch the paint. Also the breakover angle, approach and departure are ok but not great (I'm also not lifted).

My dad's 2 door TJU Rubicon with 3-4 inch lift and 33's is probably what I consider the sweet spot for a trail rig, in terms of dimensions, and that is still compliant and drive-able on-road. That thing is a beast....bulletproof 4.0 engine and front and rear lockers. Someday that beauty will be mine.

Actually the Armada would be a closer competitor to the Land Cruiser, size wise, and they are generally regarded as the vehicle of choice when it comes to off-roading in many parts of the world... Middle East, Africa, Australia..and many others. The UN uses Land Cruisers solely for their peace keeping missions, and so does ISIS. LOL

They may not be the idea vehicle size in your neck of the woods.. but there is a whole other world outside of the U.S. :wink2:

 

[Koddo]

This board ain't for no ferners, dag nab it! Except our Canadian brethren ;]

You keep your African peacekeeping rice totin Nissan Patrols outta this!

 

[sn_85]

People that think the Armada, or any full size truck/SUV for that matter, being trail worthy do not have very much experience off-roading.

These vehicles are simply too large (mainly wide) with approach/departure angles similar to that of a corolla (exaggerating). They are heavy and unwieldy in any real rough trail circumstance. They are ok for what I call "main" dirt roads. The trails that come off the main road....they are utterly useless (AZ speaking). They may work in the deserts of Africa, but here in the western US, not-at-all.

Hell I consider my 4R almost too large for most trails....I end up getting the brush cutters out for the branches that would really cause some damage....i've resigned myself to letting some scratch the paint. Also the breakover angle, approach and departure are ok but not great (I'm also not lifted).

My dad's 2 door TJU Rubicon with 3-4 inch lift and 33's is probably what I consider the sweet spot for a trail rig, in terms of dimensions, and that is still compliant and drive-able on-road. That thing is a beast....bulletproof 4.0 engine and front and rear lockers. Someday that beauty will be mine.

So the Toyota Land Cruiser which is a full size SUV is not trail worthy? The owners of Land Cruisers do not have much experience off-roading? That's what you're saying. Gotta be shitting me. Get off your high horse and put the ego away. Everyone has a different definition of off-roading and yours is not the right way nor the wrong way.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Koddo]

Yes, Landcruisers are not trail worthy. They once were when they were a practical size. Now they are monstrous and overloaded with luxury.

They are are too large, the approach/departure angles not great anymore, too expensive for anyone to consider taking on even modest trails - would you want to scratch your new 90k SUV?

You are wrong my friend. Like I said, if you are overlanding in the deserts of Africa its a different story.....or riding up and down dunes like a Saudi.

I don't have an ego, just practicality. And anyway you cut it, NEW landcruisers and other full size trucks/suvs are just too big nowadays. They are fine for a jaunt down a nice wide dirt trail with few obstacles. But as soon as you hit that tight turn, rock in just the right spot, a ledge that is over 20 percent, or a road that isn't well maintained for a width of 10 feet - you're done.

My definition of off-roading is pretty modest. I don't rock crawl or have a trail rig with 35+ inch tires. Just armed with the knowledge that current day full size vehicles are very much limited by their dimensions.

 

[sn_85]

Yes, Landcruisers are not trail worthy. They once were when they were a practical size. Now they are monstrous and overloaded with luxury.

They are are too large, the approach/departure angles not great anymore, too expensive for anyone to consider taking on even modest trails - would you want to scratch your new 90k SUV?

You are wrong my friend. Like I said, if you are overlanding in the deserts of Africa its a different story.....or riding up and down dunes like a Saudi.

I don't have an ego, just practicality. And anyway you cut it, NEW landcruisers and other full size trucks/suvs are just too big nowadays. They are fine for a jaunt down a nice wide dirt trail with few obstacles. But as soon as you hit that tight turn, rock in just the right spot, a ledge that is over 20 percent, or a road that isn't well maintained for a width of 10 feet - you're done.

My definition of off-roading is pretty modest. I don't rock crawl or have a trail rig with 35+ inch tires. Just armed with the knowledge that current day full size vehicles are very much limited by their dimensions.

You do realize we have deserts here in North America don't you? You ever been to southern Cal, AZ, NV, Southern Utah? We also have sand dunes. Maybe you've heard of St. Anthonys sand dunes in Idaho or Sand Dune NP in Colorado. Tons of people like a place called Pismo Beach in CA for their dunes. I've also seen groups of LC200 take on the Alpine Loop and Black Bear Pass.

But I guess none of that is really considered off-roading or trail worthy to you :crazy: