America this week, what the hell?
- Thread starter amalik
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You just got lucky buddy..........honestly :angel:. I chime in because American "conservative" posters on this site just have issues tolerating a different opinion civilly, so they always end up making it "personal" by trying to label and discredit some of your less "conservative" American poster members. The "modus operandi" is kind of easy to illicit. :hatsoff:
Thefishguy77
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Apparently by your statement so do you. You seem to have a problem with conservative views. And there for interject your opinion to create strife? Is that just what you do for kicks? If so you're ruining the reputation of Canada for being polite. Just saying :hatsoff:
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Gunslinger-13
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It's not all one sided. Both sides are slinging crap and both sides are acting foolishly at times.
Why is it that you only see this as one sided? Do you seriously not see the liberals doing the same thing to the conservatives. it's a circle jerk...
Personally I only debate logically, never insult, make personal comments and always keep it respectful. At times I will show my distaste, but never in a rude or pretentious way. And I don''t ignore people and quit speaking with them when they challenge me with facts/truths. I actually love it when someone brings something to the table worth cogitating on and discussing. Especially from an opposite perspective as mine.
Just factual and logical debate.
I guess that's why I get ignored most of the time.
Heck buddy, you've insulted me personally in this very thread and I have not returned the favor...
I think people on both sides have the hate and finger pointing to the other side blinders on. It gets old fast.
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See what I mean.....you can't disagree and still be respectful. So now you try to stop me from posting because I am a Canadian who has been "inpolite" to you, lol. Your definition of "conservative" if different from the rest of the free world.
Thefishguy77
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How was I impolite. I nearly pointed out what you said in your statement. I never once tried to stop you from posting. I can't see how someone could get so wrapped up in an Internet board chat room that they would stop someone from posting. To me that's the essence of our 1st amendment. Freedom of speech, religion, press, assembly, and petition. I may not agree with someone point of view and my even vocally oppose it. But I will still stand up for them if someone tried to tell them they can't speak it. In America today the Constitution and The Bill Of Rights are coming down to a point that they o my apply if you are willing to stand up for them.
I would never and I say never try to prevent someone from speaking no matter their country's laws.
You comment in post number 302 could be taken as insulting very easily. But I was just pointing out you are doing exactly what you're speaking against. Nothing more. Sorry if I offended you. That was not my intent. I generally have the ability to offend people if I so choose. This was not one of those choices.
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I would never and I say never try to prevent someone from speaking no matter their country's laws.
You comment in post number 302 could be taken as insulting very easily. But I was just pointing out you are doing exactly what you're speaking against. Nothing more. Sorry if I offended you. That was not my intent. I generally have the ability to offend people if I so choose. This was not one of those choices.
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Please reread my post just above yours as I was refering to myself jokingly as "impolite" due to your post #303 above. And no offence was meant either, I believe in civil discourse and will respect your opinion if you also respect mine.
Gunslinger-13 said:
If you think I insulted you which you seem to believe, please re-read any of your posts that you quoted me prior to that perceived "insult" and see if anything you yourself posted could be taken as an "insult". Seriously.
Gunslinger-13
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I just re-read them all and can't come up with anything. The internet is a weird place to communicate though, so how about you point it out to me?
So you saying "Well, you have a lot of work to do then" in response to me stating that I train LEO, Military, Civilians and RCMP was not intended as a jab/insult of sorts?
I don't really see how it could be taken otherwise, but again internet can be weird to communicate, so if it wasn't an insult, what was your intent?
ETA: Thinking about it further- if you took my statement on "Monday morning quarterbacking" as an insult, it was not intended as such, it is merely pointing out that perspective is a powerful thing, as everything is relative to the observer and if you haven't been in extremis/situations like we are discussing it is hard to have perspective on how they go down and how actions/reactions go. Nothing insulting about not having experience in CQB or hand to hand combat, Taking down a 300 lb man who is fighting for his life,etc- it's just something most people DO NOT have experience with and thus don't have the proper perspective to know when "Things are under control" or not, wether they "look" like it to the untrained eye/inmdividual or not.
It would be like me trying to make sense of something I don't do and know little about, have little experience with- I wouldn't be a good authority on something like that.
I hear it all the time from people who know little to nothing of these interactions, "why did that cop shoot him, he was 10 feet away and just had a knife..." I can close a ten foot gap and stab someone to death in less than 2 seconds, it's dangerous, but to someone who doesn't know this or who hasn't been trained or experienced this is seems different than reality. SO again perspective and training can change ones thoughts on observing situations like this.
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BrianSD_42
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Protesters shut down Minneapolis freeway during rush hour
Rush hour protest shuts down Minneapolis freeway - CNN.com
In related news CBS local in MN posted a poll (highlighted below) and both options are basically "Yes I support the protest movement" LoL.
http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2016/07/13/news-click-protesting-on-freeways/
:snacker:
Rush hour protest shuts down Minneapolis freeway - CNN.com
In related news CBS local in MN posted a poll (highlighted below) and both options are basically "Yes I support the protest movement" LoL.
http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2016/07/13/news-click-protesting-on-freeways/
:snacker:
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Gunslinger-13
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Look, here's the deal. Officer involved shootings, let's take the Falcon Heights, MN incident for instance- come down to two simple possibilities 99.99% of the time.
Either the officer was not acting malicious, but escalated and jumped the force continuum far too quickly because of poor self control of his fight or flight response, to which he should be terminated and held civilly liable as well as his leadership/department if they knowingly/willfully violated the seven liabilities of supervision; OR he escalated justly based off a real perceivable threat meeting the objectively reasonable standard of review, and he should be cleared accordingly.
The latter being the most likely, the former being possible but not probable.
Either way it went down, I will hold off final judgement until the facts are in.
Either the officer was not acting malicious, but escalated and jumped the force continuum far too quickly because of poor self control of his fight or flight response, to which he should be terminated and held civilly liable as well as his leadership/department if they knowingly/willfully violated the seven liabilities of supervision; OR he escalated justly based off a real perceivable threat meeting the objectively reasonable standard of review, and he should be cleared accordingly.
The latter being the most likely, the former being possible but not probable.
Either way it went down, I will hold off final judgement until the facts are in.
If you interpret that as an insult, well you either have very thin skin for someone with strong opinions or you are taking yourself much too seriously. I don't see insults (was your term not mine) just disagreement about an event and an outcome. You once again assume that only you here can understand this situation because you have more situational knowledge (as stated by you so that means only you know what you are talking about and you are right). Don't personalize internet discourse, I don't. Respect my opinion and I will respect yours.
Now, we are in total agreement. I have highlighted a very key & important part of your sentence that says a lot.
Gunslinger-13
New member
I never once stated nor assume that "I am the only one who knows..." that's BS. I specifically asked you if you have experienced situations like this and you said yes, but didn't expound upon what that is.
I gave reasons as to why some peoples oopinions are worth more than others in a given lane. For instance. I teach CQB and H2H combat, I literally train folks in these exact scenarios, so yeah my opinion likely holds more weight than someone who say cooks for a living or sells real estate.
Just like if you had subject matter expertise in a given focus we were discussing and I did not. Your opinion would hold more weight.
This is not a "I'ma know it all and you are not" moment. It's purely reality based on the logical extension of someones expertise in a given discipline being more valid than someone without that expertise.
I never made anything personal except to discuss personal experience that would DIRECTLY change how one perceives if the officers had the gentleman "under control" or not, which they definitely DID NOT. You stated that they had him under control from what you saw- perspective, yours. I gave you a counter point as to the flaw in that perspective- given my knowledge and expertise of that EXACT situation.
I will state it again, having someone under control is not having them fighting you vehemently and seemingly reaching for a gun. That IS NOT under control. A person is not under your control when he is actively resisting your arrest, he is not under control when he makes a move to his pocket, especially given the fact he was called in for brandishing a firearm.
The thickness of my skin has nothing to do with a jab made at me. It doesn't bother me at all. I only brought it up when you started telling everyone that ONLY conservatives are being a certain negative way to liberals, when clearly that is not the case.
Thefishguy77
New member
Why are you so angry. You a reading thing in to what he said. He in no way said only he could understand. He does have vastly more experience than most of the rest of us so he was trying to give some prospective. He in no way attacked you. But you went on the offensive. Take a breath and calm down. Let's at a minimum be civil.
As for a solider/combat veteran having thin skin. Not likely! There are some I'm sure. But as my friends that are active and retired and my family members that are active and retired will tell you. They don't have thin skin. They usually don't even give a crap about petty stuff that drives the rest of us up on soapbox. After all when someone is trying to kill you day in day out. A long line in traffic of someone having a bad day at work. is fairly low key.
Gun slinger thank you for your service to the country and the community.
And no I am not attacking you at all. Intended or not your posts today read angry.
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This post about sums you up, "an expert thus you are right". As for the "insult/jab", your perception is your reality, we disagree and you have taken offense due to perception over the net, seriously? Good luck!
The sentence in your post (two) above that I highlighted "real perceivable threat meeting the objectively reasonable standard of review" refers to threat (assessment), perception, judgement to be held to a "standard"...........OBJECTIVELY REASONABLE<- those are key words that peers and non-peers will always disagree on. Disagreement is good, we can't all fall in line and this can influence a "standard".
Absolutely no anger here, your perception is inaccurate.
BrianSD_42
New member
I watched both the Bush speech (~7 min) and the Obama speech (~40 min) and I thought they both did a great job honoring the fallen. At no point did I think there was a vs. mentality or disagreement between the conservative and liberal presidents. Frankly if people acted as polite and cordial towards each other as these two presidents, this country would probably be in a much better place.
President Obama brought up many excellent points and if anything he extended the smallest oil branch out to the protest movement while at the same time chiding them to be more realistic. He said roughly to the people protesting "you know how dangerous these neighborhoods are, you know about the violence, you know both these men had guns, that needs to be considered in context"
Frankly he and the MN governor jumped the gun bigtime on these latest shootings. They both invoked race when there is no proof or history shown. All the facts were not in at the time and still are not known. If the president had kept his wild speculation comments to himeself it is possible this week may have been less violent.
President Obama brought up many excellent points and if anything he extended the smallest oil branch out to the protest movement while at the same time chiding them to be more realistic. He said roughly to the people protesting "you know how dangerous these neighborhoods are, you know about the violence, you know both these men had guns, that needs to be considered in context"
Frankly he and the MN governor jumped the gun bigtime on these latest shootings. They both invoked race when there is no proof or history shown. All the facts were not in at the time and still are not known. If the president had kept his wild speculation comments to himeself it is possible this week may have been less violent.
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Thefishguy77
New member
Let's not forget the beer summit. And if I had a son he would look like Travon. He has constantly jumped the gun on everything. It's a little scary he has the ability to go to war with how much he leaps before he looks.
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Gunslinger-13
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Again, nowhere have I stated I am an expert and thus right and you are wrong.
I said that an experts opinion holds more weight In the area of their expertise. Pretty simple.
_#1_
New member
I'm a CDL truck driver instructor from Colorado...
A truck driver (who has no association with me) flips his truck on I95 in PA...
A Canadian comments "you got your work cut out for ya eh..."
That's a jab and an insult. Lets not deny that.
Maybe you're more fluent in French ThorInc, in which case you can use Google Chrome to translate.
A truck driver (who has no association with me) flips his truck on I95 in PA...
A Canadian comments "you got your work cut out for ya eh..."
That's a jab and an insult. Lets not deny that.
Maybe you're more fluent in French ThorInc, in which case you can use Google Chrome to translate.
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