Anyone running 255/80/17 Tires Pizza Cutters

[LJ75 Driver]

Got my 255 STMaxx installed today. No lift, no rub. I'm pretty stoked. Now just gotta get the lift ordered...

 

[tackleberry1145]

Got my 255 STMaxx installed today. No lift, no rub. I'm pretty stoked. Now just gotta get the lift ordered...

ETA: Screw it. Just ordered the Maxx's from discount tire direct, lol
Nice! Same color as my TE....makes my decision easier, lol. I've got a toytec suspension lift on mine. These tires and a lift will be a good looking combo.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk

 

[LJ75 Driver]

I love it... my wife even more. These are the perfect tire in my opinion. Now I just gotta play with the pressures. I had them set at 35psi all the way around but it's got a little swim to it going down the road. Gonna try 45f/40r.
I got some spodertrax spacers yesterday too, but without the lift they rub. So that accelerated my plans

 

[MyanRagahis]

Got my 255 STMaxx installed today. No lift, no rub. I'm pretty stoked. Now just gotta get the lift ordered...

Looks nice. Conroe huh? I want to say I've seen your ride once or twice pulling out of the shopping strip close to the Chuys on the 45 feeder! Its the only other red TRD I've seen yet.

 

[LJ75 Driver]

Probly my wife. It's her truck, she works down off research Forest.

 

[tackleberry1145]

Just a heads up, Amazon has these at $187 today, which figures since I ordered mine from Discount the other day, lol.

 

[LJ75 Driver]

Ouch... I talked discount down to $202/tire. Oh well!

 

[romanleader]

255/80/17 coopers

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[ayeyothisiskyle]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are 255s just for saving gas while running 33s? What are some other advantages of this?

 

[blacksheep4]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are 255s just for saving gas while running 33s? What are some other advantages of this?

That's definitely an advantage due to less surface contact and air resistance. Wider tires are going to outperform pizza cutters in really deep, soft stuff when aired down. They will "float" you over it, whereas the skinnier tire is going to want to plow through. Some people think wider tires look cool, I agree but I personally prefer the tall skinnies for looks and performance. Less wear on steering components and bearings, a little bit taller to give you more differential clearance, a little easier on drivetrain perhaps, and cheaper! Of course bigger tires of any size are going to have a negative effect on MPGs and longevity of certain components, but for the best combo of off road and daily driveability I don't think you can go wrong with Cooper St Maxx 255/80r17 (there's a reason that most military vehicles use tall skinnies). Here's some reading if you really want to get into it:

http://www.overlandexperts.com/docs/articles/offroad_tire_taller_or_wider.pdf

 

[(none)]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are 255s just for saving gas while running 33s? What are some other advantages of this?

255s don't rub at stock offset like wider tires, Narrower tires can be better in rain/sand/snow/mud. To me they seem to follow the ruts in the roads less than wider tires. Might get some gas mileage advantages with the c-rated tires, but a 60lb/tire E-rated tire isn't going to get you much.

 

[romanleader]

I went from 22 mpg to 18. Quite pleased with mine so far.

 

[thatmaceguy]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are 255s just for saving gas while running 33s? What are some other advantages of this?

This is the most in-depth discussion I've found. Expeditions West: Tire Selection for Expedition Travel

 

[Jetboy]

Expeditions West: Tire Selection for Expedition Travel

FWIW - that is a garbage article. It's just factually wrong on a lot of the physics. I'm not sure who wrote it, but it's one of those things that just won't die.

Tall skinny tires have advantages for some things - mostly highway related. It's very rare that a narrower tire will out perform a wider one - all else equal - in offroad terrain, but there are some circumstances. If higher ground pressure were ever beneficial - you wouldn't air down narrow tires. Rather you'd want to maximize tire pressure. I've never found that to have any advantage outside of highway use.


What's usually missed in the discussion is that it's very rarely a tradeoff between the same height tire in two different widths. Tire size is often limited by factors like axle strength or gearing. Generally the question is whether a taller narrower tire is better than a shorter wider tire - comparing two options with similar weight that can be run effectively on the same vehicle. In that case - taller narrower tires are often a better choice than a comparable shorter wider tire. The longer narrower contact patch when aired down is often advantageous as compared to a wider shorter contact patch. Higher ground clearance can be better than lower tire pressure. And sometimes the opposite is true. But that's more the real debate to me.

 

[thatmaceguy]

FWIW - that is a garbage article. It's just factually wrong on a lot of the physics. I'm not sure who wrote it, but it's one of those things that just won't die.

Well, if you read the article, it's right there...

By: Scott Brady, Expedition's West
Date: 3/28/2005 (revised 4/17)

So far he's the only person I've seen try to approach the question quantitatively instead of just throwing out anecdotes. I just wish he'd followed through and showed the math in full. I think his simplifications work against him.

If higher ground pressure were ever beneficial - you wouldn't air down narrow tires. Rather you'd want to maximize tire pressure.

I think that's a bit disingenuous. The author of the article clearly stated he was considering the two tires at equal pressures of around 15psi, so it follows that he's assuming you already understand that there are tangible benefits to airing down. My interpretation was that there might be a middle ground where you've balanced tire deformation and coefficient of friction.

Generally the question is whether a taller narrower tire is better than a shorter wider tire - comparing two options with similar weight that can be run effectively on the same vehicle. In that case - taller narrower tires are often a better choice than a comparable shorter wider tire. The longer narrower contact patch when aired down is often advantageous as compared to a wider shorter contact patch. Higher ground clearance can be better than lower tire pressure.

More to the point, though, is that we're not even talking about extreme differences in tire width. The most common tire sizes I've seen on a 5th gen are 275 or maybe 285 section, which is *only* about 0.75 to 1.25 inches wider than a 255 section tire. What does a thumb-with of extra rubber gain you in traction? Would you trade that for an extra inch of ground clearance? Does either decision make a significant difference?

 

[Jetboy]

Well, if you read the article, it's right there...

By: Scott Brady, Expedition's West
Date: 3/28/2005 (revised 4/17)

So far he's the only person I've seen try to approach the question quantitatively instead of just throwing out anecdotes. I just wish he'd followed through and showed the math in full. I think his simplifications work against him.



I think that's a bit disingenuous. The author of the article clearly stated he was considering the two tires at equal pressures of around 15psi, so it follows that he's assuming you already understand that there are tangible benefits to airing down. My interpretation was that there might be a middle ground where you've balanced tire deformation and coefficient of friction.



More to the point, though, is that we're not even talking about extreme differences in tire width. The most common tire sizes I've seen on a 5th gen are 275 or maybe 285 section, which is *only* about 0.75 to 1.25 inches wider than a 255 section tire. What does a thumb-with of extra rubber gain you in traction? Would you trade that for an extra inch of ground clearance? Does either decision make a significant difference?

The problem is that his quantitative "analysis" is easily demonstrably wrong. At 15psi in two tires of the same height but different width, the contact surface pressure will be exactly the same. You simply divide the individual tire load by the tire pressure to calculate contact area - since the two would have the same weight and pressure, contact area would be the same. So everything that is discussed related to mechanical keying would be indifferent at the same tire pressure. The difference - at the same pressure - is that a narrower tire will have LOWER ride height. So given two tires of equal height, different width, the wider tire will maintain higher sidewall height at 15psi than the narrow tire. The narrow tire will as a result have lower ground clearance. The coefficient of friction will be identical for both as will the surface area.

The wider tire will allow you to run lower pressure, with lower contact pressure, with more ground clearance. That is just a physical fact. And given that - the only scenario where a narrower tire is beneficial is where you have a limited depth of a fluid that you need to move through and solid foundation underneath. Driving through water for example. Or shallow snow. On most surfaces a wider tire will allow lower pressure, lower contact pressure, float higher in any non-solid material, and perform better. In the case of rocks - they're a lot like asphalt. Have you ever seen a race car with narrow tires? there's a reason.

Where narrow tires perform well is on the highway. Or where they are an alternative to a shorter wider tire. In our case we're discussing marginally different widths and marginally different tire height. The constraints mean almost all the tires are going to be pretty similar. For offroad use - I'll take the biggest tire I can spin. For highway driving - a narrower tire is probably optimal.

 

[snuffleupagus]

Anyone running the Toyo Open Country AT II in 255/80/17? Looks like it's a good 8lbs lighter than the ST MAXX, might be a good option.

 

[JSparky]

Regarding Scott Brady's piece. The article is clearly biased and he states that right off the bat when he describes this as a "position paper". What Brady has provided is what I would consider an interesting anecdote modeled after the aesthetics of a scientific research article but is far from what I would describe as a piece of empirical, objective, or rigorous research. There is no clearly defined research question, we don’t know what rationale was used to include or exclude evidence, what kind of qualifications the author has to be analyzing these data, and not to mention that the entire piece is framed as an argument. There is an inherent conflict of interest as well, the author's own vehicle is fitted with 255/85R16's (tall narrow tires). It may look and feel like a piece of science but it’s not, and honestly that makes it at least misguiding, if not deceitful.

Secondly, this article deals specifically with off-road performance, a place the majority of 4Runner’s do not spend their time, so take that into consideration when reading this. I’d like to think that Michelin or Goodyear have developed some comparatively rigorous testing protocols for determining ideal tire height:width ratios. Mounting taller, narrower tires on a vehicle with the added weight of racks, bumpers, skid plates, etc, then what came on a vehicle from the factory, seems counterintuitive for me for the majority of driving conditions, notably cornering and high-speed maneuverability.

In my own experience, when you’ve got one or two tires in the air, the wider the tire is on the ground the better chance you’ve got at contacting and wrapping over something that will give you traction. Odd-shaped and sloping boulders come to mind, where a narrow tire would slide off killing your line while a wider tire would help keep you on-track. I'd like to know how systems like ATRAC function in this equation as well. There’s just so many variables though, you’d almost need a sliding scale to go about this objectively.

Lastly, positions and arguments have a funny way of stemming from feeling the need to justify, in the present case the fitment of a skinnier tire relative to a particular vehicle’s limitations or saving money on a less expensive tire. All I mean by that is that it’s important to be honest with ourselves. It’s perfectly reasonable and respectable to go either way, just don’t try and call it something else.

 

[Jetboy]

I absolutely do think that narrowish tires are better for highway use on the 4runner. I wish there were more 34x10.5 17 tire options in a C range. There's no street tires in that size. And there's just not really any tall narrow tires that aren't 60lbs each.

 

[IslandJim]

Here in central Florida there is not really a need to "air down". Running through sugar sand is the only time you may find it beneficial to air down. Has to be a lot of sugar sand though as I would prefer to stay aired up. Most of the terrain we have in central and south Florida are swamps, marshes, and our hills are 6' tall and a half mile wide. So mud and water holes are our most common terrain challenges.
Have always liked the "military tires" and look forward to getting some nice mud tires in 255/80/17. Its nice that they should fit on stock OR rims also.

Edit; oops now I see that someone had 255/75's on a stock setup...will prolly look at those instead.