Baited into getting a Brand New 1 Year Old T4R Limited

[Eagle]

It is of high value to get as many opinions and takes on a scenario as possible.

Only if you value baseless speculation and generally incomplete legal analysis.

I disagree as I feel that a court would recognize that decoding a VIN for verification of model year is an unreasonable burden for a purchaser.

Hence my previous statement: "At that point, the burden would then be on the OP to show that there was an excuse or other exception to his acceptance." The OP may be able to argue that there was no reasonably way to identify the goods as nonconforming.

please name me a state or jurisdiction where comitting fraud isn't technically illegal?

It's not an issue of whether or not fraud is illegal. The laws are the laws. And it isn't "technically" illegal; it is or it is not.
The issue is that you are presuming there is fraud here when you do not know enough information to be able to make such a presumption. It is also illegal for the OP to be transporting marijuana on his 750 mile trip... or pay his "assistant" less than required minimum wages...


The OP asked about the comparative value of $2500 of upgrades/services vs. the one-year of depreciation, not ramblings about Kansas statutory law that is likely inapplicable.

 

[AnthonyMV]

this thread is

So Gay

 

[waltuo]

I love lamp.

 

[TRD 4RNR]

Maybe the OP is on another 4 day 750 mile trip :fishing:
:lookout: I'm sure they'll be back to fill us all in..

 

[Jayhawk5G]

You are a piece of work. You just love to argue for the sake of arguing. You open with I disagree to just about everything and then your point seems to be more in agreement. This is a total waste of time.

If piece of work equals being tired of all the ****weeds on here who choose to not only have their own opinion but then blast everyone who has a differing one then yeah that's me. It adds more aggregation when the person doing it is an idiot...

Only if you value baseless speculation and generally incomplete legal analysis.

Your speculation is as baseless as anyone else's as we are all privy to the same limited information. I'm not giving legal analysis as I'm not a lawyer and there is limited information. If the dealership says no, he one has two options retain a lawyer and sue or STFU. That's about as complete as you can get...

Hence my previous statement: "At that point, the burden would then be on the OP to show that there was an excuse or other exception to his acceptance." The OP may be able to argue that there was no reasonably way to identify the goods as nonconforming.

So you agree but argue to be a ****...

It's not an issue of whether or not fraud is illegal. The laws are the laws. And it isn't "technically" illegal; it is or it is not.
The issue is that you are presuming there is fraud here when you do not know enough information to be able to make such a presumption. It is also illegal for the OP to be transporting marijuana on his 750 mile trip... or pay his "assistant" less than required minimum wages...

I put "technically" because some people on here think that a dealership is allowed to break the law and if you don't catch them up front then that's too bad. Technically even if people don't pursue anything, the dealership is still breaking the law. We are all presuming something here, no one knows the real story or if the whole thing is bull****. So your presumption is better than mine? That is a lame argument to try and make.

The OP asked about the comparative value of $2500 of upgrades/services vs. the one-year of depreciation, not ramblings about Kansas statutory law that is likely inapplicable.

I guess the law prohibiting murder in Kansas isn't applicable anywhere else right. I mean just because you can't kill people in Kansas doesn't mean you can't kill them in Illinois? I didn't ramble , I posted our statute to point out that all states have one similar and so while it would be pointless to pursue on the criminal side, civil court may offer recourse. It doesn't matter if he wants a 2013 or $2,500 if the dealership says no his only other option to compel them is court...

 

[AnthonyMV]

Sigh.....

So GaySo GaySo GaySo GaySo GaySo GaySo GaySo Gay

 

[Eagle]

I guess the law prohibiting murder in Kansas isn't applicable anywhere else right.

Actually, no... it is not. If you commit murder outside of Kansas, the Kansas law will not come into play.

 

[Jayhawk5G]

Actually, no... it is not. If you commit murder outside of Kansas, the Kansas law will not come into play.

You are right, the Illinois law that reads the exact same as the Kansas one would... because certain crimes are illegal everywhere in the United States regardless of the separate jurisdictions that prosecute the crimes.

Who is being argumentative just for the sake of it now?

 

[Eagle]

You are right, the Illinois law that reads the exact same as the Kansas one would... because certain crimes are illegal everywhere in the United States regardless of the separate jurisdictions that prosecute the crimes.

Your argument is merely circular reasoning. Yes, crimes are illegal... but the question is when is a particular action a crime.

"Murder" is a criminal act, a legal conclusion. To say committing murder is also illegal in Illinois presumes the fact that it was actually murder. Perhaps the killing would be murder in Kansas but would be defensible homicide in Illinois... In that case the exact same act would have different legal consequences in Illinois than it would in Kansas. That it why it is necessary to know the applicable law before offering analysis.

The legality of acts varies greatly between states -- just look at gay marriage, gun possession, marijuana possession... Unlike murder, which is (hopefully) not at issue here, different states have vastly different approaches to these. Fraud, which I believe was your initial allegation, is similar -- the specific application of the elements of fraud will vary from state to state. it does little good to attempt to offer legal analysis when you do not know what to analyze.



That being said, I'm happy to let you win the argument... mostly because it seems apparent that your sole objective is to win, regardless of whether you are right. You've done a wonderful job convincing me that murder is illegal in Kansas and that I should not consult you for legal advice.

Best of luck OP. If you are real, fill us in with some details.

 

[philsey]

@jayhawk
@eagle

How about you two give the mental masturbation a rest? You do realize the OP was trolling, don't you?

 

[Jayhawk5G]

Your argument is merely circular reasoning. Yes, crimes are illegal... but the question is when is a particular action a crime.

"Murder" is a criminal act, a legal conclusion. To say committing murder is also illegal in Illinois presumes the fact that it was actually murder. Perhaps the killing would be murder in Kansas but would be defensible homicide in Illinois... In that case the exact same act would have different legal consequences in Illinois than it would in Kansas. That it why it is necessary to know the applicable law before offering analysis.

The legality of acts varies greatly between states -- just look at gay marriage, gun possession, marijuana possession... Unlike murder, which is (hopefully) not at issue here, different states have vastly different approaches to these. Fraud, which I believe was your initial allegation, is similar -- the specific application of the elements of fraud will vary from state to state. it does little good to attempt to offer legal analysis when you do not know what to analyze.



That being said, I'm happy to let you win the argument... mostly because it seems apparent that your sole objective is to win, regardless of whether you are right. You've done a wonderful job convincing me that murder is illegal in Kansas and that I should not consult you for legal advice.

Best of luck OP. If you are real, fill us in with some details.

Here was my first post in this thread.

If they told your assistant when they went to pick it up that it was a 2012, and you still took it and still used it then I think you need to negotiate. However it sounds like after everything that was agreed too they attempted to give you a model year old vehicle when you agreed to price based on a 2013.

If they didn't make you aware and you had to find out by checking the VIN then they were trying to hose you and can figure out the 750 miles themselves. Go for the new 4Runner!

I have never been trying to win anything. I came into this thread curious, and then upon reading the initial post gave an opinion. I put some of that first post in bold to make the point that I wasn't speaking in absolutes and I did not presume to know the actual situation.

I'm tired of getting my specificity picked apart because people want a semantic battle. My point remains that just because we all may be in different areas of the country it doesn't mean our laws vary drastically on some major issues. The OP's question wasn't can I ride a donkey backwards down the street in Paducka, Kentucky. That scenario would have a very narrow and specific answer. Once again if giving legal analysis is I believe you should contact an attorney if you don't get resolution from the dealership and you think you have been wronged, then again I'm guilty.

The end of your last post just proves you are here to be self-aggrandizing and argumentative. Your first post in this thread agrees with what I have been saying, "follow up yourself and if unsatisfied you would need to contact a lawyer." So what are you arguing except semantics?

@Philsey - I'm done, I just think people need to be more polite to one another on this forum in general...

 

[Stifler]

@jayhawk
@eagle

How about you two give the mental masturbation a rest? You do realize the OP was trolling, don't you?

Cyber Circle Jerk

 

[AnthonyMV]

Exchange numbers......

So GaySo GaySo GaySo GaySo GaySo GaySo Gay

 

[Shamish]

I don't think you can be held responsible if you go to the next county. Remember when Bo and Luke would evade Rosco P. Coltrane by scootin' over to Chicasaw County? Rosco and Enus (or Cletus) had to stop at the county line.

Long story short, the dealer is responsible if you file a claim in the right county. If you're in the wrong county, you're SOL.

God I miss the '70s...maybe if I am good my heaven will a warm summer day in 1979 in my old neighborhood with my mom and dad and all my friends...

 

[nw_4Runner]

So GaySo GaySo GaySo GaySo GaySo GaySo Gay

Not trolling here, but, seriously, please, enough with the "so gay" thing. Or at least throw in a "so heterosexual" every once in awhile.

 

[Curt Sauve]

I don't think you can be held responsible if you go to the next county. Remember when Bo and Luke would evade Rosco P. Coltrane by scootin' over to Chicasaw County? Rosco and Enus (or Cletus) had to stop at the county line.

Long story short, the dealer is responsible if you file a claim in the right county. If you're in the wrong county, you're SOL.

God I miss the '70s...maybe if I am good my heaven will a warm summer day in 1979 in my old neighborhood with my mom and dad and all my friends...

I'd take Daisy Duke to Chickasaw County:frisky:

 

[drodecker]

Resolved new vehicle purchase

First off, let me thank you the responses. After posting here, I read the initial comments the next morning from JCA21 & RIDE and made the decision to firmly require that they provide me with the correct vehicle year. Though I was mentally prepared to negotiate for a credit given the reality that there was a contractual fact against my case as pointed out by many of you (Lineman & K O).

It turned out to be an relatively painless discussion. Again they admitted fault and didn't complain at all about the mileage, passage of 5 days of time, nor the empty tank of gas that it was returned with.

They told us that they didn't have the exact VIN that I was sold on, but that there was an identical 2013 model & color. My spirits lifted! About 90 minutes later it got delivered and ironically it was the exact VIN I was looking for; the car that came out of the port just days earlier!


:trophy:

I'll post a picture to my profile in a moment. This is a significant upgrade from my 1998 4Runner with 210k mi.

 

[98Roamer]

Great glad it worked out. :girl:

Is the pic of your assistant?

 

[Stifler]

obviously not a troll.... congrats... now pics of the assistant or it didn't happen! lol (And get out of that Handicap spot!)

 

[AnthonyMV]

I'm sorry

Not trolling here, but, seriously, please, enough with the "so gay" thing. Or at least throw in a "so heterosexual" every once in awhile.

Their argument was getting so hot n heavy.......maybe they needed to "cool off".
"You" know what I mean? No?