TRD Off Road will have available 33" tires stock. Won't have the same stance as the Pro and Trailhunter as it won't have the wide flares [more like the Limited].
Best speculation of a 2023 6th generation I have seen
- Thread starter peter78
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TRD Off Road will have available 33" tires stock. Won't have the same stance as the Pro and Trailhunter as it won't have the wide flares [more like the Limited].
Honestly the biggest two knocks I can think of with the new Tacoma is the lack of an A4WD transfer case and the lack of a front locker on TRD Pro and Trailhunter trims.
The first point is somewhat remedied by the Limited's full-time 4WD (which has its own pros and cons) but the latter would have to be addressed in the aftermarket.
Overall, the Tacoma has been a very strong showing by Toyota. If the 6th gen 4Runner ever comes to fruition, it's going to be a huge upgrade over the 5th gen. I'm already drooling over the idea of a TRD Off-Road 4Runner with factory 33s, front sway bar disconnect, and the new powertrains. It does get me thinking how Toyota expects to differentiate the Land Cruiser over its cheaper siblings.
The first point is somewhat remedied by the Limited's full-time 4WD (which has its own pros and cons) but the latter would have to be addressed in the aftermarket.
Overall, the Tacoma has been a very strong showing by Toyota. If the 6th gen 4Runner ever comes to fruition, it's going to be a huge upgrade over the 5th gen. I'm already drooling over the idea of a TRD Off-Road 4Runner with factory 33s, front sway bar disconnect, and the new powertrains. It does get me thinking how Toyota expects to differentiate the Land Cruiser over its cheaper siblings.
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Jetboy
New member
I agree with this question. What would Toyota put in the LC that would differentiate it to be more extreme on the off-road end unless it goes full Bronco/Wrangler, which has been mostly ruled out. Short of 35's, lockers, and a TTv6, what else is there? Unless it was just an modernized LC70. But a mid-range LC70 is around $45k USD, so it would probably need a lot of upgrades to get into the $70k range.
I'm coming around on the value proposition of the new taco if the price is effectively capped by the Ranger Raptor. The 405hp Raptor Ranger is a bit more extreme than the Tacoma TRD Pro and it starts at $57k. I think that's effectively a bit of a price cap on the TRD Pro taco and Trail Hunter models at around $60k. If the TRD Pro taco is $55k, that isn't a terrible value proposition.
Blackwatch
New member
TFL said their source had the 2.4 turbo hybrid in the LC. At 326 hp and 465 torque that's plenty of power for a 4R sized SUV. Then the GX550 should have a better engine than the LC. Rumour has had the detuned 3.44 tt (348hp/405 torque) in it but that would result in lower torque numbers than the 4R TRD Pro and LC so maybe it get's the Sequoia motor (437hp/583 torque)?
Hopefully the Raptor keeps the TRD Pro's price under control. I think the Raptor will be more popular than the Pro. Lots of people will want that "Raptor" name on their truck since they can't afford the big Raptor.
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Jetboy
New member
I think the turbo 6 and 10 speed will still be a significant upgrade over the hybrid turbo4 for the GX, even at a 350hp tune, but I can't see the GX getting the hybrid because - where would you put the batteries? I'm guessing it'll have the same 2.4 turbo/hybrid setup. Maybe it'll have a bigger battery and higher performance ev side? That could be a meaningful change. I can see a front locker and KDSS, but I assume KDSS will also go in the next gen 4Runner. A front locker might justify $1,500, not $15,000. I have no idea what else there would be.
The Bronco Raptor is $30-50k more than the Ranger Raptor. So maybe there's going to just be a huge price gap with pretty similar equipment.
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syndicate1
New member
It's nice to see the Limited Tacoma is full time 4wd. They did a great job.
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TexasFunRunner
New member
I've finally had some time to look over the new Tacoma pics and specs, I'm really liking the design and features, I think Toyota hit a home run. It will be very interesting to see what design language and features make it over to the Land Cruiser and 4Runner.
I'm very interested to learn more about the Adaptive Variable Suspension (AVS), it would seem likely that this feature would make its way into the Land Cruiser and 4Runner. I wonder if this is a copy of the Lexus version of Adaptive Variable Suspension (AVS), has anyone looked at this feature?
Either way, lets hope its and upgrade over the failure prone 4Runner X-REAS Suspension.
I'm very interested to learn more about the Adaptive Variable Suspension (AVS), it would seem likely that this feature would make its way into the Land Cruiser and 4Runner. I wonder if this is a copy of the Lexus version of Adaptive Variable Suspension (AVS), has anyone looked at this feature?
Either way, lets hope its and upgrade over the failure prone 4Runner X-REAS Suspension.
Jetboy
New member
I think that's the same as the tundra. Shocks with a solenoid to vary the damping force. Toyota calls s bunch of different things AVS though, so it's hard to know what it really is. Used to be called TEMS by Toyota in the 80s but I think it's still the same basic system. I'd really like to have rear adjustable shocks for my tundra. The factory Bilstein are okay unloaded, but with a few thousand lbs in the bed or a heavy trailer I double the rear weight and they can't keep up. AVS makes perfect sense for a truck that varies weight a lot. Usually Toyota pairs it with air springs in the Lexus GX and Tundra.
The adjustable height and damping system in the LX is pretty close to the holy grail of suspension imo. Has 5 inches of height adjustment but also variable damping and variable effective spring rate. And it's coil assisted so it's still functional in a failure. The ability to go to max height and softest spring rate is a feature I don't think exists in any other system. ORI struts can do it, but not on the fly. And it's been very reliable despite the complexities. Super cool setup. But I don't think they'll put it in a Tacoma. It's only an option on the top LX trims. I wish they would!
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yes tacoma looks pretty solid , interior is nice upgrade and exterior looks good. The engine I'd prefer a v6 turbo but expected the the 4cyl options.
i-FORCE MAX hybrid powertrain 326 n horsepower and 465 lb.-ft. of low-end torque at 1700 rpm. Which is pretty solid for low end and will probably be tuned in aftermarket
iforce 2.7 turbo not sure of the specs .
gomiami
Member
Jeep had to make that announcement to get publicity and nothing more. To actually make a difference, they better install a lot of them at each trailhead...not just a token charger. Nothing says fun like waiting in line to get your overpriced rig charged up.
thatoneguy
New member
So they've shown that the iForce MAX hybrid engine does 465 lb-ft of torque at a nice low 1700RPM. They've said that the non-hybrid regular 2.4L turbo does 317 lb-ft of torque at an unspecified RPM. Wouldn't the hybrid be capable of putting out the max electric torque at any engine RPM? In other words, is it likely that the non-hybrid engine (the one I'm more interested in) will make its 317 lb-ft of torque at about the same 1700RPM? That's a whopping 2700RPM earlier than the venerable 4.0L makes its (lesser) max torque. Power is a function of torque PER time period (power at an rpm=torque*rpm/5252 for english units), but with this much of a numbers and low RPM advantage, you could really have a situation where this new non-hybrid engine makes more power and pulls harder at 2500rpm or so than the 4.0L/3.5L did at 3500rpm, for example.
I do hope they offer both engines in the new 4Runner. They made the hybrid iForce MAX mandatory in the Sequoia. I would prefer they did not do that to the 4Runner.
I do hope they offer both engines in the new 4Runner. They made the hybrid iForce MAX mandatory in the Sequoia. I would prefer they did not do that to the 4Runner.
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TexasFunRunner
New member
I suspect it was for their token sacrifice to the greenwashing gods.
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I just drove a 2023 Highlander rental with the turbo-4. My only gripe was the sound of the engine — like a high-strung Corolla.
Assuming this will be the choices for the next 4Runner, I’m looking forward to the i-FORCE MAX. I’m also guessing we’re also seeing what the 4Runner’s interior will basically look like.
Assuming this will be the choices for the next 4Runner, I’m looking forward to the i-FORCE MAX. I’m also guessing we’re also seeing what the 4Runner’s interior will basically look like.
TexasFunRunner
New member
I took the CarBuzz 4Runner rendering and put it side by side with the Tacoma Trailhunter for design and style comparison. Looking at the current generation of course show differences so I would expect the same will hold true with the new 4Runner.
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Blackwatch
New member
If the same engine/trim options exist in the 6th gen 4Runner as the 4th gen Tacoma a TRD Off-Road hybrid with 326 hp and 465 torque is very appealing.
The big question will be how much of a price increase vs the potential future repair costs due to the reliability issues it will most likely have. No way the turbo or battery will last 250,000 - 300,000 miles.
The big question will be how much of a price increase vs the potential future repair costs due to the reliability issues it will most likely have. No way the turbo or battery will last 250,000 - 300,000 miles.
gomiami
Member
You make an excellent point and those are great numbers right out of the gate. My concern is whether or not the iForce MAX hybrid engine is still doing it 150-200k later. If it has durability, it will be superior. If it doesn't...
Jetboy
New member
FWIW, turbo looks really easy to access. That's a huge plus for long term ownership. They'll need to be replaced periodically. Tundra would be much more appealing with an i6 for the same reason. I think it's a big win on that issue. No need to pull the cab just to access the turbo!
MAST4R
New member
LOL, lemme guess, Ford?
gomiami
Member
My neighbor had one of those. I actually didn't believe him until he showed me a repair bill and I saw the labor...
TexasFunRunner
New member
My son-in-law is a Toyota master technician, besides pulling the cab on the new Tundra for turbo work they are finding it faster to pull the cab for some other repairs as well.
