Freakin' Dealer! Huntington Beach Toyota

[mrblah]

Seems silly to me that a dealership would spend the time to install one of these and then ask the customer if they want to buy it?

Are they provided to the dealerships at a deeply discounted price with the money to be made on the activation/monthly subscription fees?

From what I've been told is the dealers install them because it allows them to easily immobilize/monitor/move the vehicles around their lot, and once the car is sold, they market it as an alarm. Basically, they trying to push the cost of the unit to the consumer for an item that has no use off of the dealer lot.

 

[spetka]

Seems silly to me that a dealership would spend the time to install one of these and then ask the customer if they want to buy it?

Are they provided to the dealerships at a deeply discounted price with the money to be made on the activation/monthly subscription fees?

I installed car audio and alarms for a long time a while back, and had friends that worked for (and started) some of these companies. The way it at least worked back then was the dealers would contract these companies to install a "security device" on their vehicles as soon as they got to the lot. I believe this is insurance related. They save money on insurance if their vehicles are protected. Then they try to sucker YOU into paying for their security device along with a very hefty markup. The guys I knew doing the installs worked piecemeal and would get a small amount per unit, like $1.50, so the goal was to install as many as possible as fast as you could in order to make a decent hourly rate. So you will see corners cut, crimp connections, dangling wires, etc. You will probably also see wrong wires probed (sometimes see small holes in wires possibly taped up). The funny thing about these devices is the "deactivation unit" is simply the key without the handle. Some cheapskates I have known have glued/screwed a piece of plastic/metal to the fron tand taken it out when leaving the car. I have seen crimps detach on the starter wire leaving the car very "secure", and replaced them all the time with real alarms. The funny thing was when somebody told me they had an alarm I would show them how fast I could hotwire their car with that since it led me directly to the starter wire and ignition without needing a test light/meter.

 

[flyrv9]

Take it back and tell them you want another vehicle that has not been molested or undo the deal so you can go to a reputable dealer. Make a big stink in the showroom on their busiest day, threaten to sue and go to the media. Whatever it takes.

 

[jordanrb81]

Here it comes

Ok stupid question... don't the 4Runners come with an alarm... and all the other kit, from the factory isn't this system redundant redundant? I mean I am not a computer genius by any stretch but wouldn't any car that is using satellite navigation also be able to use the same systems sort of in reverse, am I nuts, I mean the software knows were you are on the planet because of the transponder coming from the car, couldn't one use that same transponder to locate the car? isn't that baked into the vehicle when you drive it off the lot?

 

[mrblah]

Ok stupid question... don't the 4Runners come with an alarm... and all the other kit, from the factory isn't this system redundant redundant? I mean I am not a computer genius by any stretch but wouldn't any car that is using satellite navigation also be able to use the same systems sort of in reverse, am I nuts, I mean the software knows were you are on the planet because of the transponder coming from the car, couldn't one use that same transponder to locate the car? isn't that baked into the vehicle when you drive it off the lot?

yes and no. . Some toyota models come from the factory with a deactivated alarm system that has to be "activated" like my tundra. Meaning the factory alarm is there, but if you don't pay to activate it, it only works as keyless entry. However, with my tundra, it was really easy to activate. All I had to do was buy a shock sensor and window glass break sensor and it was plug and play.

When I bought my 4runner, i thought i could do the same thing like I did to the tundra, but I didn't find a oem part number for a glass break sensor or shock sensor, so I'm assuming it doesn't exist for the 4runner.

Because we have keyless entry and a immobilizer, the 4runner's security system that their would be factory options to convert it to a full fledge security system like my tundra, but honestly, I don't know. To be honest, I really didn't look too deep into it after I found that POS Karr system under my dash.

 

[Redsoxx1918]

Ok stupid question... don't the 4Runners come with an alarm... and all the other kit, from the factory isn't this system redundant redundant? I mean I am not a computer genius by any stretch but wouldn't any car that is using satellite navigation also be able to use the same systems sort of in reverse, am I nuts, I mean the software knows were you are on the planet because of the transponder coming from the car, couldn't one use that same transponder to locate the car? isn't that baked into the vehicle when you drive it off the lot?

They do. And anyone who is capable of defeating the factory alarm will be able to defeat an aftermarket alarm. If they want your 4runner bad enough, they will pull it onto a flatbed with 45 seconds....I’ve see it done....and drive it away. Those alarms are just money making scams.


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[EddieV4runnin]

Take it back and tell them you want another vehicle that has not been molested or undo the deal so you can go to a reputable dealer. Make a big stink in the showroom on their busiest day, threaten to sue and go to the media. Whatever it takes.

Really????

 

[Titanpat57]

Late to the party Jim....congratulations....but there ain't fo nukin way I would drive that truck another foot....they should take it back , replace the wiring harness (whatever they cut into) or give you another truck...F that....and if they won't ..I'd get Toyota involved immediately!!

 

[omegatr4]

Won't the dealership warranty the work since the installed it? So if anything goes wrong they are on the hook for it?

 

[9405t4r]

From what I've been told is the dealers install them because it allows them to easily immobilize/monitor/move the vehicles around their lot, and once the car is sold, they market it as an alarm. Basically, they trying to push the cost of the unit to the consumer for an item that has no use off of the dealer lot.

That is exactly what i heard when buying my previous car. Although i bought it used, I didn't realize they will donit for new cars as well.

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[9405t4r]

That is exactly what i heard when buying my previous car. Although i bought it used, I didn't realize they will donit for new cars as well.

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It was a Camaro and in SoCal as well.

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[Matt fe2o3]

What a mess... id be pissed if that was my truck.

I hate it when dealers do this type of work... because they don't care about the work itself.

Nothing but heartburn looking at that. In 1995 my wife bough a new Mustang that had some type of Pro-Lock thing installed. The slip keys would wear and had to be wiggle city to get the thing to start - at least with the primary code key as it wore.

I looked to tear it out and and then looked away after I saw how far that shit seemed to be wired in. Glued in the last good slip key and that was it until we scrapped it a few years ago.

I don't get it. Especially with chipped keys why anyone would have an anti theft. A SPOT asset tracker - OK sure - that's cool (and moar better) - but to butcher a harness on new vehicles like that? Ugghhh.

 

[mrblah]

Nothing but heartburn looking at that. In 1995 my wife bough a new Mustang that had some type of Pro-Lock thing installed. The slip keys would wear and had to be wiggle city to get the thing to start - at least with the primary code key as it wore.

I looked to tear it out and and then looked away after I saw how far that shit seemed to be wired in. Glued in the last good slip key and that was it until we scrapped it a few years ago.

I don't get it. Especially with chipped keys why anyone would have an anti theft. A SPOT asset tracker - OK sure - that's cool (and moar better) - but to butcher a harness on new vehicles like that? Ugghhh.

I really want to remove mine, but I didn't want to risk any more damage to the wiring harness since I'm not known for my patience or finesse.

 

[catrains]

with these comments I would be very angry that the dealership installed this and hacked up the wiring .. I would report this to toyota..

good you reported this dealerships poor handling of this stupid install on the forum.

any wiring cut I would solder and heat shrink as crimps do corrode / create intermittent electrical failures.

 

[Bumbo]

- but to butcher a harness on new vehicles like that? Ugghhh.

That would be my main concern... I really go out of my way not to modify factory electrical.

Sometimes you cant help it when when going heavy into a dual battery project, but there are ways to keep things whole and clean.

 

[Bumbo]

with these comments I would be very angry that the dealership installed this and hacked up the wiring .. I would report this to toyota..

good you reported this dealerships poor handling of this stupid install on the forum.

any wiring cut I would solder and heat shrink as crimps do corrode / create intermittent electrical failures.

For the comments about soldering, its totally fine, but there is more to it than just that. If you do solder, just be sure to add some type of strain relief in areas where you may be seeing movement or flex.

I think its safe to mention that good quality crimp connectors are generally tinned copper. They use them in marine environments in conjunction with adhesive lined shrink to keep the moisture out, which is really the bigger concern. If its good enough for boat people, its good enough for inside a Toyota. Aerospace, solder joints would probably fail inspection.

Also when soldering, be sure to use solder and a flux that does not require cleaning. The wrong flux can actually promote corrosion. Kester 243 No Clean is what I use for that.

 

[flyrv9]

Yes really!

 

[catrains]

well years ago I did repair and install radar systems. also worked in the marine commercial not the recreational marine ..

all the connections require lugs to be soldered .
my boat a 20 foot wellcraft I had to redo all the connectors as they corroded.
not being a toyota expert but GM I do know this type work on any wire cutting requires a solder job .. its in the shop repair manual on how to fix damaged/cut wires .. gives a detailed procedure .

Toyota ?????

 

[Bumbo]

well years ago I did repair and install radar systems. also worked in the marine commercial not the recreational marine ..

all the connections require lugs to be soldered .
my boat a 20 foot wellcraft I had to redo all the connectors as they corroded.
not being a toyota expert but GM I do know this type work on any wire cutting requires a solder job .. its in the shop repair manual on how to fix damaged/cut wires .. gives a detailed procedure .

Toyota ?????

If you soldered professionally that's one thing... different industries have their own specifications and make you follow procedure. I've been soldering for at least 20 years and I had to warm up to the idea of crimping connections. Its external contamination and moisture that are the biggest issues, a crimp done right is excellent as well.

I have no idea what Toyota tells their technicians to follow.

I just bring my own real world experience into the mix, and so do you.

Most hobbyist don't solder at an expert level... let alone own a decent regulated iron... its easier for a novice or average joe to get a better result crimping due to the mechanical consistency that comes from a ratchet crimper.

That said, if you know what ur doing, you know what ur doing. I have no problem with soldering.

 

[nglayton]

Back in 2010, I "ordered" my TE. Once it arrived, I went to pick it up about 45 miles away from my house. On the way I counted 6 (Yes, SIX) Toyota dealerships that I passed on the way to get mine.

All I'm trying to say is, you've got options.

Putting up with that cr@p is ridiculous. I almost walked when they drilled the license plate into the front bumper plastic...........I would have walked if they had done anything like that.

They also tried to 'sell' me the floor mat package, quoting it was already installed at the factory. When I declined and told them to take them out they just threw them in for free. But at least I didn't have to pay a subscription fee to make those work.