I feel frustrated as a lifelong Toyota fan. Anyone else?
- Thread starter thedamartini
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v_man
New member
BlairB
New member
Great post!
Gecko
New member
Curious... where did you hear this info? I have heard on multiple occasions from multiple sources that the Tundra and Sequoia have been on the chopping block for several years because Toyota "loses money on every one they sell." Far from being profitable, but something that Toyota feels they need to have in North America. The lack of profitability was also noted as part of the extremely long life cycle... it takes much longer for the Tundra/Sequoia to pay for themselves.
mybabydaddy
New member
Excellent read. And Gecko’s response really does make quite a bit of sense... (which makes me laugh, because now I equate my company to the likes of Toyota... large, global, slow to respond to market shifts/demand, products geared towards older trends, etc., etc.). :cry2:
Jetboy
New member
One of the auto mags had it in the last few years. Toyota was around $3,000 per unit. F series was $900ish. Ram was $800ish, and Silverado was around $650. At full MSRP the big 3 have huge profit margins built in, but they have so many incentives that it goes down fast. I think they average around $5k per truck in incentives where Toyota is maybe $1k or less.
I think the long game looks good for the Tundra. I've never talked to anyone who actually has or had one that didn't like it. The only complaint I ever hear is bad mileage. They're slowly building a reputation among contractors, although that market is moving to commercial vans more and more.
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Honestly I blame the consumer. People keep buying Toyotas based mainly on reputation for reliability. While that is partially true, as far as features and all the rest on any given model, most other cars are ahead of Toyota. An example is the interior of the Tundra...WTH??? also.. Look how many times the Camry has been redone versus other models in Toyotas range. It has changed the Camry so much in recent years because it has had to in order to keep pace with other brands. Toyota is all about the money and will not change a model until it needs to. An then when it changes any given model it will be conservatively. This 4 will prob be my last Toyota. But lol, it will be years before I get something else. By then the aluminum bodied, diesel Jeep Wrangler will hopefully have all the bugs worked out of it.
Ausumm
New member
Me too. I always wanted one, but never had the chance.
My observation did not include anyone here!
As I drive around, I automatically think that everyone driving a 4R is just as delighted to be at the wheel as I am.
But evidently, people in my area who drive 4Runners...
aren't nearly as thrilled about it as I am.
Juicy
New member
I notice that too, I see one and then I look at the driver and it's some 80 y/o guy, a middle aged woman that looks like she wouldn't even walk on a gravel driveway or a soccer mom that is on her way to get her venti soy whatever. :laugh:
Toyota definitely depends on its reputation for sales. Most of the trucks and SUVs are so outdated. Even the 4runner is outdated when compared to "competitors" (obviously doesn't have many direct ones, but vehicles like the Grand Cherokee that roughly compare are much nicer inside and "modern"). Toyota is lagging, really wish they would redesign their current models before releasing all these cool but never-going-to-see-the-road concepts.
rihavens
New member
I am not reading through all these posts, but Toyota in America is a volume brand. They compete with Honda, Ford, Chevrolet, Kia, Dodge, and Nissan. They do not have a performance division. They do not have an SUV division. Let's look at FCA. Fiat is small cars, Dodge is volume cars, Ram is trucks, Jeep is SUV and Chrysler is luxury. You can argue they are not successful, but Americans can't look at a POS 200 and differentiate between that and a Jeep Grand Cherokee Summit. Hyundai is just now realizing this with the launch of the Genisis brand. Nobody wants a 65,000 Hyundai. Americans will, however, buy a $65,000 Genisis. Other countries can market their whole line through one brand. America Can't. That's why we have Lexus, Genisis, Infinity, Acura, and Cadillac. The Toyota brand is watered down? Because Lexus is the star child.
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Senorlechero
New member
Ummm..... Camry is the best selling car in America, Corolla is the best selling car of all time. Toyota didn't HAVE to change anything, even the MY17 Camry outsold everything else on the road. The MY18 is a huge leap forward.
Saying Toyota is all about the money...well duh. It's a business. Businesses are about making money. I'm not sure why you would say that like it's a bad thing, that they wouldn't just frivolously change a model if they don't need to seems like a very good business model IMO.
LandCruiser
New member
I used to be like you, but then I realized that Toyota will NEVER sell me the cars and trucks that I want in the US.
They don't care.
They make up all sorts of excuses like emissions and crash safety, but it's just a lie. They have gone far from the customer base in the 1980s and early 1990s that made them a household name, and they feel that they no longer need us.
I see the next new crossover or Camry, and I have literally no desire to buy one.
They don't care.
They make up all sorts of excuses like emissions and crash safety, but it's just a lie. They have gone far from the customer base in the 1980s and early 1990s that made them a household name, and they feel that they no longer need us.
I see the next new crossover or Camry, and I have literally no desire to buy one.
TacoRunn0517
New member
So then why does Toyota make 'better' vehicles available for customers outside the US? Are they more demanding? Will they walk if Toyota starts making their vehicles differently? Does Toyota disrespect the US customer base? To say that they are lying when it comes to their reasoning(s) is a strong claim. Curious if you have any basis to make the statement.
mnofpeace
Member
To use someone elses idea...its sort of, down to the money.
Yes, toyota makes more worth while, off-road vehicles, and maybe on road too, for other markets. But in the country where people sue over how hot a cup of coffee is, where the govt must restrict and regulate things because the populace is THAT stupid, where in the past thousands of people would die from simple accidents that they caused themselves...then Toyo has to make cars that can pass the smell-test of the USA (minimum mpg, airbags everywhere, electronic driver aids galore). Add to that the tariffs and taxes they have to deal with importing cars, when that same populace, and their govt reps, scream about America 1st (not just the Trumpians, so dont hate me please), pressing them to open factories within the boarders. Along with the simple fact that the USA market needs vehicles that the rest of the world just doesnt need, like big SUVs that also have to be able to travel longer distances because, thank goodness, our country is HUGE compared to every other country...HUGE and has a very very good roadway system.
It just doesnt make it worth their bottom line to give the US market so many great off-road selections, as, say, Australia or the middle east.
But thats cool...we do get their 'world-market' archetecture in the T4r, and if we try real hard, we can also get relatively well kept LCs as well.
...hey, glass half-full, ya know :whoo:
Yes, toyota makes more worth while, off-road vehicles, and maybe on road too, for other markets. But in the country where people sue over how hot a cup of coffee is, where the govt must restrict and regulate things because the populace is THAT stupid, where in the past thousands of people would die from simple accidents that they caused themselves...then Toyo has to make cars that can pass the smell-test of the USA (minimum mpg, airbags everywhere, electronic driver aids galore). Add to that the tariffs and taxes they have to deal with importing cars, when that same populace, and their govt reps, scream about America 1st (not just the Trumpians, so dont hate me please), pressing them to open factories within the boarders. Along with the simple fact that the USA market needs vehicles that the rest of the world just doesnt need, like big SUVs that also have to be able to travel longer distances because, thank goodness, our country is HUGE compared to every other country...HUGE and has a very very good roadway system.
It just doesnt make it worth their bottom line to give the US market so many great off-road selections, as, say, Australia or the middle east.
But thats cool...we do get their 'world-market' archetecture in the T4r, and if we try real hard, we can also get relatively well kept LCs as well.
...hey, glass half-full, ya know :whoo:
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Juicy
New member
So is the fog automatic or it there a button to turn it on and off?
Jetboy
New member
It's push button. Do you think whoever made the marketing video with the fake mountain just bought some leftover CGI from a video game?
<iframe width="720" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/r8n5DPZoGjo" frameborder="0" gesture="media" allow="encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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MN4runnerman
Senior Member
I’ll just put a big fan on my chase vehicle. Honestly what’s the point of that? Drop a banana peel or throw a turtle shell before using a lame smoke screen.
BTW I’m not a frustrated Toyota fan. Everything’s good in the 3rd gen world.
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