Inv4drZm's Build Thread

[Inv4drZm]

The winchline spooled around my brother's bumper definitely wasn't just used to get me unstuck...



Optional obstacle called 'Soup Bowl'

GX tried it. Didn't make it.





Brother tried it and he actually made it up. Trail leader seemed to think it was the first IFS to make it through that obstacle.





So of course I had to try it, but threw in the towel, still many miles of trail left. I need more belly clearance, more on that later.













Blew a tire off the bead:





Another tire off the bead. This one took at least an hour to change due to the incline the truck was on.



While we changed the tire darkness set in and we still weren't sure how far away from camp we were so we ended up doing some night wheeling, which I thought was a lot of fun. Others not so much. Call me crazy but blasting Alice in Chains with the windows rolled down at night was great. I highly recommend it.

Overall morale was pretty low, we have been wheeling for 12 hours that day, driving for even longer, and finally arrived at camp at midnight and started setting up tents. Not to mention we were only 5 miles into the 22 mile Rubicon.

 

[Inv4drZm]

Day 9

Rubicon Day 2
Travel to Dirty Dozen campground just after Rubicon Springs.









I accidentally beached my whale. Needed a short winch back then I was on my way.







Black FJ's braided brake line sheared, we very luckily were able to pinch the line, and it didn't leak the rest of the trail as far as I was aware.



Right before 'Decision Tree'

Hint: Kool kids klub in the back took the far left line and it seemed easier. Sorry no pics for some reason.



Made it to the campground:





Found a nice spot to cool off at:



I made some trail repairs that evening while at camp. I either tagged one of my mufflers on a rock or a skid plate flexed up enough to hit the exhaust such that it cracked in half at one of my butt welds making the truck sound obnoxious. The trail fix worked extremely well using two Mountain Dew cans and 4 hose clamps sized for CV shafts.







Day 10

Rubicon Day 3

We spent chilling at Dirty Dozen campground, Rubicon Springs, and hiking around exploring. And cooling off in the pools.

Day 11

Rubicon Day 4

Back on the trail heading up Cadillac Hill and into civilization. Got a head start on our way back home by staying at a hotel in Nevada.

 

[4RunnerAquasport]

Just out for a leisurely drive this summer?

Good Stuff!!! Looks like a really good group too!

I really need to get out of Florida soon. Doubt I'm ready for the Rubicon though.

 

[Inv4drZm]

Day 12

Drive from Nevada to Wyoming for some more camping, with a quick stop at the Bonneville Salt Flats.

But first some more fixes in our hotel parking lot.

My high-tech Mountain Dew can blew out on the interstate so a quick run to Home Depot and I brought back a thicker sheet of aluminum to wrap it with, along with two yard sticks and two tape measures. Guess what for? Reset my toe again, steering wheel was crooked. I unthreaded my tie rod around 1 turn, and on the first try the toe was perfectly centered and on that day I was the luckiest 4Runner owner alive. :sobbing:



We got lost looking for the Salt Flats, but it made for some great wheeling and great pictures:
















Instead of camping, it was late so we found a hotel and did some of the trails the next day.

Day 13

Wyoming

 

[Inv4drZm]

Day 14

Drive home. Made it home at 9pm.

Day 15

Drive the 4Runner to work.



Aftermath:










































Thoughts and Mods:

My only two breakdowns was my alignment moving twice, and my exhaust crack, so not too bad. About half the group had some sort of body damage from the Rubicon so my brother and I made it out lucky, no damage. The alignment really shouldn't be moving with my Taco Tabs so I'll have to look further into that, and a higher clearance exhaust might be in my future. I added spacers to my bumpstops multiple times before the trip, but need to space them even further still to avoid rubbing, the rear rubbed when crawling, the front still rubbed when bottoming out hard. The skid plates and sliders took a beating, the front skid is being held on by 3 of the 4 bolts and my factory fuel tank skid looks terrible. Wheels are scraped to heck, probably one of the downsides to pushing them out 2-3" and using them as sliders.

Other than that, the new front suspension, aluminum fender liners, sliders, skids, bumpers, new storage drawers, 37's, all worked very well.

Some future mods for next year will be to:

• Increase ground clearance as much as possible by raising the t-case crossmember and building all new skid plates (1/8" AR400)
• Raise the rear lower shock mounts to flush with the bottom of the axle tube and swap to 14" coilovers.
• Potentially relocating the fuel tank or swapping to an FJ tank and mount it up higher. If I can gain even 2 inches in underbelly clearance, its equivalent to moving from 37" to 41" tires.
• Maybe re-link the rear (3 link?) so I can raise the fuel tank if I use the FJ tank.
• My front IFS arms took a beating, and I've been eyeballing the JD Fab LT kit or the Marlin kit as a future replacement for my TC kit to gain more arm clearance, more travel, and push the tire even further forward so I could potentially run 39's.

It would be wise of me to look into upgrading the steering rack, my brother's stopped working shortly after wheeling with 37's, and the GX with 37's had some issues early on the Rubicon with power assist only working in one direction for a short while (just like my brother's failure). I feel like I might be next.

Mushy Crap

Thanks to everybody that made the Skunks on the Run an amazing adventure, and to you guys that have been helping me since day 1. I had a great time wheeling with my twin brother and one of my best friends, along with meeting new and old friends from across the country at some of the coolest trails around. I'm grateful for everyone that helped spot on obstacles as well as take pictures or help organize the trail runs. This was easily our greatest adventure yet, but I'm sure we'll try and top it next year.

 

[bbix333]

Awesome. I was up in South Lake Tahoe the other weekend - saw a few FJs staging at 50 and Ice House Rd - wonder if it was you and your friends.

If you want to try a more challenging route - hit the Dusy-Ershim trail Dusy-Ershim | FWD Club of Fresno

 

[Inv4drZm]

Awesome. I was up in South Lake Tahoe the other weekend - saw a few FJs staging at 50 and Ice House Rd - wonder if it was you and your friends.

If you want to try a more challenging route - hit the Dusy-Ershim trail Dusy-Ershim | FWD Club of Fresno

You might have seen us, though I think there was a Toyota group shortly after us too.

There is already talk of doing this trail next year so we might be trying it sometime.

 

[Broke_Runner]

Curious what rear lca mount skids are those? I bonked one of my mounts and don’t wanna completely obliterate it

 

[Inv4drZm]

Curious what rear lca mount skids are those? I bonked one of my mounts and don’t wanna completely obliterate it

They are from All-Pro, but no longer being sold, which is a shame because they are great.

I need to weld them to the frame like what my brother did to keep them from rotating downward, but I hit them all the time definitely worth it for the protection.

 

[Broke_Runner]

They are from All-Pro, but no longer being sold, which is a shame because they are great.

I need to weld them to the frame like what my brother did to keep them from rotating downward, but I hit them all the time definitely worth it for the protection.

Damn I only came across the total chaos ones how much did the all pros originally run ya if you don’t mind

 

[rdruss]

So you had a crooked steering wheel and one turn on tie rod straightened it out. Hmmm .. I see you have "taco Tabs" so LCA should be locked in place, What do you think caused your steering wheel to be crooked?
Just curious. I'm not a believer in correcting steering wheel with tie rods as it seems to me one wheel would be out of toe with respect to the other and adjusting both the same amount would'nt correct steer wheel.
Or am I missing something?

 

[BackOff]

Great trip report Inv4derZm!
Thanks for sharing your adventure.

I am wondering about the rack too.
You ever feel the temperature of the rack unit after a hard trail?
Are these things overheating?

Guess you saw that "tummy tuck" on the 5th gens.

Did you make some metal spash guards? Engine bay, guess i missed that mod.

Yours was my favorite one in the group... guess i am biased though.

/cheers

 

[Inv4drZm]

Damn I only came across the total chaos ones how much did the all pros originally run ya if you don’t mind

$120 or so is what I have on my old spreadsheet.

 

[Inv4drZm]

So you had a crooked steering wheel and one turn on tie rod straightened it out. Hmmm .. I see you have "taco Tabs" so LCA should be locked in place, What do you think caused your steering wheel to be crooked?
Just curious. I'm not a believer in correcting steering wheel with tie rods as it seems to me one wheel would be out of toe with respect to the other and adjusting both the same amount would'nt correct steer wheel.
Or am I missing something?

The LCA 'should' be locked in place but the UCA heims that I use to adjust the camber and caster can't move, and unless the tie rods bend (no evidence of that) the only other option is that the LCA moved or I have a bent spindle(s).

I'd bet the LCA moved somehow, the Taco Tabs aren't flush against the cam tabs, so the cam tabs might be flattened/bent (I know one is) allowing some extra play. Either that or since I'm using the maximum caster Taco Tabs, it's putting extra stress on the bushings by cocking the arm at an angle to the frame and potentially wearing or slicing the bushings. I haven't looked closely at them since the trip but I've heard this could be an issue.



I would say you are definitely missing something LOL. Toe is what you use to correct your steering wheel, and tie rods are the only way to adjust toe.

Let me try to explain it a bit further. Start with adjusting camber and caster which is typically adjusted with the LCA cams, in my case its the UCA heims threading in and out so I start with camber, then fine tune the caster if I have any adjustment range left. This is with the LCA pivoted all the way forward in it's maximum caster setting like I mentioned.

After camber and caster are good, then you adjust toe because camber and caster can change toe. You notice this effect whenever your steering wheel is crooked after wheeling, likely your tie rods haven't moved, bent, or came unthreaded, it was the LCA cams that moved causing a shift in toe. While adjusting toe there are two variables you need to balance, you want very slight toe in, and also the steering wheel needs to be straight.

• The steering wheel can be straight but toe could be 5 degrees positive to either side which would cause terrible wear and effect handling. This is why you can't simply guess which tie rod to adjust if your steering wheel is crooked after a trail, you have to know what side of the vehicle shifted to properly center the steering wheel.
  
• Same goes for the opposite, toe could be perfect but the steering wheel crooked.

Just my explanation of what I've learned, hope it makes sense.

 

[Inv4drZm]

Great trip report Inv4derZm!
Thanks for sharing your adventure.

I am wondering about the rack too.
You ever feel the temperature of the rack unit after a hard trail?
Are these things overheating?

Guess you saw that "tummy tuck" on the 5th gens.

Did you make some metal spash guards? Engine bay, guess i missed that mod.

Yours was my favorite one in the group... guess i am biased though.

/cheers

They probably get pretty hot, I know the GX on 37's had issues early on the Rubicon with power steering only working in one direction shortly after an obstacle he used a front locker on and was trying to steer. We let it cool down in the shade for 20 minutes and it started working properly again. He kept from abusing too hard the rest of the trail and didn't have any more issues. Maybe a larger reservoir, cooler, and some heat shielding will alleviate some issues, maybe it just needs a Tundra or Landcruiser rack. 37's at 15-10psi are pretty difficult to turn.

Yes, I need the tummy tuck, or my own version.

Fender liners, starts on page 54, finished on page 56. I love those things.

Don't worry, mine was my favorite too!!

 

[rdruss]

The LCA 'should' be locked in place but the UCA heims that I use to adjust the camber and caster can't move, and unless the tie rods bend (no evidence of that) the only other option is that the LCA moved or I have a bent spindle(s).

I'd bet the LCA moved somehow, the Taco Tabs aren't flush against the cam tabs, so the cam tabs might be flattened/bent (I know one is) allowing some extra play. Either that or since I'm using the maximum caster Taco Tabs, it's putting extra stress on the bushings by cocking the arm at an angle to the frame and potentially wearing or slicing the bushings. I haven't looked closely at them since the trip but I've heard this could be an issue.



I would say you are definitely missing something LOL. Toe is what you use to correct your steering wheel, and tie rods are the only way to adjust toe.

Let me try to explain it a bit further. Start with adjusting camber and caster which is typically adjusted with the LCA cams, in my case its the UCA heims threading in and out so I start with camber, then fine tune the caster if I have any adjustment range left. This is with the LCA pivoted all the way forward in it's maximum caster setting like I mentioned.

After camber and caster are good, then you adjust toe because camber and caster can change toe. You notice this effect whenever your steering wheel is crooked after wheeling, likely your tie rods haven't moved, bent, or came unthreaded, it was the LCA cams that moved causing a shift in toe. While adjusting toe there are two variables you need to balance, you want very slight toe in, and also the steering wheel needs to be straight.

• The steering wheel can be straight but toe could be 5 degrees positive to either side which would cause terrible wear and effect handling. This is why you can't simply guess which tie rod to adjust if your steering wheel is crooked after a trail, you have to know what side of the vehicle shifted to properly center the steering wheel.
  
• Same goes for the opposite, toe could be perfect but the steering wheel crooked.

Just my explanation of what I've learned, hope it makes sense.

Thanks for response. Personally I think the LCA adjustment feature is just wrong ( it worked fine on several million vehicles I realize). You have the adjustment cams in the same plane, then you cock one forward, one backward to achieve a desired setting, only possible(?) because they are in a pliable rubber bushing, but up and down movement over bumps has to be restricted (In my opinion). I like the Taco tabs because can set both front and rear same so LCA can follow terrain more freely, not in a cocked bind.
I have SPC uppers so can get the caster/camber I need there, also can move LCA forward/backward equally to get some camber. I agree with being able to adjust toe with the tie rods but ideally would'nt we want them both adjusted the same? That way each tire is toed same amount. So if an alignment is done, all new components, everything in spec, each wheel toed same, steering wheel centered and come back from wheeling and steering wheel off center, unless find something that got moved, would'nt something have to be bent? Not arguing, just making sure I have a handle(somewhat) on what's happening on our 4Runners.

I think the LCA should be designed like a motorcycle swingarm.

 

[Inv4drZm]

Thanks for response. Personally I think the LCA adjustment feature is just wrong ( it worked fine on several million vehicles I realize). You have the adjustment cams in the same plane, then you cock one forward, one backward to achieve a desired setting, only possible(?) because they are in a pliable rubber bushing, but up and down movement over bumps has to be restricted (In my opinion). I like the Taco tabs because can set both front and rear same so LCA can follow terrain more freely, not in a cocked bind.
I have SPC uppers so can get the caster/camber I need there, also can move LCA forward/backward equally to get some camber. I agree with being able to adjust toe with the tie rods but ideally would'nt we want them both adjusted the same? That way each tire is toed same amount. So if an alignment is done, all new components, everything in spec, each wheel toed same, steering wheel centered and come back from wheeling and steering wheel off center, unless find something that got moved, would'nt something have to be bent? Not arguing, just making sure I have a handle(somewhat) on what's happening on our 4Runners.

I think the LCA should be designed like a motorcycle swingarm.

Toe will always find center, so each tire when driving down the road will have the same toe-in or toe-out. Whether the rack is perfectly centered and each tie rod is the same length I'm not sure.

The easiest way for an alignment to get messed up while wheeling is if the cam gets bumped by a rock and rotates a little, or enough pressure gets placed on the tire (maybe by winching against something hard) the bushing deflects and allows the cam to flatten the tab and then the cam can rotate easier. Polyurethane bushings in the stock control arms should prevent some of this issue because they are harder than the factory rubber, but the Total Chaos arms I have practically use plastic bushings, they are that hard.

I just crawled under my truck and this might be the culprit. Front driver's side LCA mount. Might have flattened the tab like I mentioned which would explain the toe out I was experiencing. Tab gussets are in my near future.





Another pic of carnage just because:

 

[Inv4drZm]

Any chance you would share your truck model with me? I've got an '05 V8 Limited so it should match yours. I want to design my own bumper. I want something like the Victory4X4 or C4 fab minimalist winch bumper but with a front receiver hitch over the winch.

I have Solidworks files of it, can you use those? I don't have access to Solidworks anymore to convert them to step or another file type.

 

[y=mx+b]

I have Solidworks files of it, can you use those? I don't have access to Solidworks anymore to convert them to step or another file type.

I had a solidworks license for school last year. I just checked and I have 1 day left lol, so I can try to help out before end of day tomorrow if another format is needed.

 

[Inv4drZm]

I had a solidworks license for school last year. I just checked and I have 1 day left lol, so I can try to help out before end of day tomorrow if another format is needed.

Thanks for the offer, I think I can get my brother to do it though. Where he works they use Solidworks.