LBJ: What do you guys think?

[WastedAccount]

Replace them for peace of mind at that mileage and the unknown. Buy Moogs from a local shop and you can usually get them same day or next without paying extra for shipping. I'm happy with mine. Real Moogs though, not the shitty 555s that come in Moog boxes sometimes, return them if they say 555 on them. Real Moogs come with grease fittings, the loctite you need, all the new bolts you need, are coated to prevent rust, install instructions with torque specs and a life time warranty from the retailer. I replace mine for free every other year or so depending on how I feel but I tend to run mine underwater and through sand a lot as I live in Florida and carry a lot of extra weight.

Grease them when you install them as per the instructions which I'm sure many people miss and torque them to the specs in the instructions. I've never had a problem.

They recently redesigned them as well and they come with oversized hardware.

 

[Scramble]

I feel you. It did take me 1 day to downgrade from excited to concerned about my new toy, 1 day spent on this forum, and find out the problem with LBJs

But thank you guys for all your replies, I feel like a member of an exclusive club, now upgraded to confident from concerned.

I wish this Camelback Toyota did have online ordering tho.

Lets find some LBJ now...

I just ordered online tonight & used PayPal.

 

[92Pony]

I just ordered online tonight & used PayPal.

Mine should be delivered (from Camelback) today. As someone else mentioned, the more I read about LBJ failures on here, the more nervous I got. At 226k mi with an unknown history, I decided to bite the bullet and just swap them. Local dealer wanted $121 ea! I had to call Camelback about my order as I have a PO box (and they won't ship to a PO). A lady named Crystal there handles the internet order stuff, and she was very nice to deal with. Here's hoping my install goes as well.

 

[Scramble]

Mine should be delivered (from Camelback) today. As someone else mentioned, the more I read about LBJ failures on here, the more nervous I got. At 226k mi with an unknown history, I decided to bite the bullet and just swap them. Local dealer wanted $121 ea! I had to call Camelback about my order as I have a PO box (and they won't ship to a PO). A lady named Crystal there handles the internet order stuff, and she was very nice to deal with. Here's hoping my install goes as well.

Yep, $170 now is better than a LBJ failure later.

 

[Nelsonmd]

Mine did not have any noticeable play in it with a pry bar, BUT when I got them off, I realized that both boots have slight tears in them, and they flop around pretty easily. Definitely worn...

I went ahead and did the inner and outer tie rod ends, which were shot as well. Hardest thing was renting a good pickle fork to separate everything! I did the steering rack bushings (WHAT a PITA - getting that last C-clamp bolt to start threading in took about an hour of time, and I ended up using a come-along strap to "pull" the rack in towards the front diff / crossmember enough to get the bolt started).

I also went ahead and took off the steering column, and did the tack-weld fix. I got an alignment today and WOW, there is quite a difference in steering. Not sure which component exactly is responsible, because I did everything at once, BUT I think the tack welds actually had a lot to do with the improvement. By the way, PO apparently had been in the steering column before and used JBWeld - did NOT hold up (I know other suggested trying it).

My pastor's 4runner had torn boots but no play, and the LBJ failed within a year. I kind of felt bad for not being more insistent that he replace the LBJ's at the time. DON'T IGNORE TORN BOOTS!!!

For the tie rods, rent pitman pullers, not pickle forks. They tend to work better.

For the steering column, did you confirm that you your steering shaft had play, or did you just "preventively" weld it together? For everyone else here, welding your steering shaft disables an important safety feature, which is the compliance in your steering wheel when your head slams into it during an accident. The tack weld is a desperation solution, and it should absolutely not be done unless you have directly felt the play in the steering column and eliminated all other possible sources of play.

Do your research on the steering column play BEFORE you weld it together, and make sure that you properly verify that the shaft has play, as in you have 1 hand on the slip joint, and 1 hand on the steering wheel and can feel play in the joint as you turn the wheel back and forth. If you didn't do this before, then you made a big mistake (even if the PO JB welded it, don't trust his shitty workmanship, he may have JB welded as a "precaution"). You should be feeling a knocking in the steering wheel if you have play, not just looseness.

I chased steering looseness for a long time when I first got mine and I considered the tack weld, but after replacing the rack bushings, rack guide, and the suspension, my steering tightened up. I had no play in my steering slip joint. Don't fix a problem that isn't there. Just a warning, because people like to blame the steering shaft for steering problems that aren't it's fault.

 

[D Farms]

My pastor's 4runner had torn boots but no play, and the LBJ failed within a year. I kind of felt bad for not being more insistent that he replace the LBJ's at the time. DON'T IGNORE TORN BOOTS!!!

For the tie rods, rent pitman pullers, not pickle forks. They tend to work better.

For the steering column, did you confirm that you your steering shaft had play, or did you just "preventively" weld it together? For everyone else here, welding your steering shaft disables an important safety feature, which is the compliance in your steering wheel when your head slams into it during an accident. The tack weld is a desperation solution, and it should absolutely not be done unless you have directly felt the play in the steering column and eliminated all other possible sources of play.

Do your research on the steering column play BEFORE you weld it together, and make sure that you properly verify that the shaft has play, as in you have 1 hand on the slip joint, and 1 hand on the steering wheel and can feel play in the joint as you turn the wheel back and forth. If you didn't do this before, then you made a big mistake (even if the PO JB welded it, don't trust his shitty workmanship, he may have JB welded as a "precaution"). You should be feeling a knocking in the steering wheel if you have play, not just looseness.

I chased steering looseness for a long time when I first got mine and I considered the tack weld, but after replacing the rack bushings, rack guide, and the suspension, my steering tightened up. I had no play in my steering slip joint. Don't fix a problem that isn't there. Just a warning, because people like to blame the steering shaft for steering problems that aren't it's fault.

yeah the autozone pitman puller is too small to fit over anything. and now im stuck with my truck apart in the driveway.

 

[Nelsonmd]

yeah the autozone pitman puller is too small to fit over anything. and now im stuck with my truck apart in the driveway.

We covered this in another thread, IIRC the OEM one that advance and O-reilleys rents out fits.

They should have multiple sizes too.

 

[gamefreakgc]

We covered this in another thread, IIRC the OEM one that advance and O-reilleys rents out fits.

They should have multiple sizes too.

This makes no sense, but the one O'Reilly's rents does not fit (at least at my store) but the one on the shelves does. After pointing this out to the guy at the desk he was nice and swapped the two and let me "rent" the other one. Worked perfectly. I ended up just buying it since I've had to pull the tie rods a couple of times now.

 

[Nelsonmd]

This makes no sense, but the one O'Reilly's rents does not fit (at least at my store) but the one on the shelves does. After pointing this out to the guy at the desk he was nice and swapped the two and let me "rent" the other one. Worked perfectly. I ended up just buying it since I've had to pull the tie rods a couple of times now.

Why does it make no sense? OEM is a brand of tools sold at Oreilleys and Advance. These places typically will "rent" you any tool on the shelf, where you basically buy it, then return it. If they didn't have a "rental" one of the larger ones, then they usually will just take one off the shelf and rent it to you.

I don't see what was confusing. Just as I said, the one at Oreilleys worked.

 

[gamefreakgc]

Why does it make no sense? OEM is a brand of tools sold at Oreilleys and Advance. These places typically will "rent" you any tool on the shelf, where you basically buy it, then return it. If they didn't have a "rental" one of the larger ones, then they usually will just take one off the shelf and rent it to you.

I don't see what was confusing. Just as I said, the one at Oreilleys worked.

Err I didn't mean your post made no sense, but the fact that the ones they rent and the ones on the shelves are different parts. The "rental" puller had a more narrow opening (same size puller though) and the "purchase" puller was wider. I would just think they would rent out the parts they sell, but was not the case in my experience. It was just enough that I could not fit the rental over the LBJ. Just trying to save someone a few extra trips down to the parts store.

 

[Nelsonmd]

Err I didn't mean your post made no sense, but the fact that the ones they rent and the ones on the shelves are different parts. The "rental" puller had a more narrow opening (same size puller though) and the "purchase" puller was wider. I would just think they would rent out the parts they sell, but was not the case in my experience. It was just enough that I could not fit the rental over the LBJ. Just trying to save someone a few extra trips down to the parts store.

There are 2 different pullers that they sell IIRC, one they called a tie rod puller and the other an LBJ puller. They are basically the same, just the LBJ one is larger.

I haven't seen any shop that rents different than what they have in the shop in a long time, at least not a retail shop like autozone, advance, or oreilleys. Every time I have gone to rent a tool, if they didn't have it, they just pulled it off the shelf, sold it to me, and said they will refund it when I bring it back. I don't know, maybe that isn't the same in all the stores. I have only rented a handful of times, so maybe it was just my stores.

 

[poleclimber63]

Originally Posted by MuddyButt View Post
I need to stay off this forum for awhile... I'm afraid to even drive my 4runner until I replace my LBJ's and radiator. I'm at 155,000 miles now and neither have been replaced. I feel like if I hadn't found this forum I would have driven it until something failed. Not to mention I lifted it at 145,000 miles and put nice duratracs on it, I'm terrified to go offroading with it anymore because as a college student I can't afford the expensive repairs if one of these things fails. So many concerns

I feel you. It did take me 1 day to downgrade from excited to concerned about my new toy, 1 day spent on this forum, and find out the problem with LBJs

But thank you guys for all your replies, I feel like a member of an exclusive club, now upgraded to confident from concerned.

I wish this Camelback Toyota did have online ordering tho.

Lets find some LBJ now...

Great. When I did mine, I did TRE's and LBJs. the hardest part was separating the ITRE's, which really wasn't that hard. The OTRE's and the LBJ's are dead easy. I measured, cleaned and replaced, with beer breaks, all these parts, and I'd say it only took me 1hr a side... If someone was in a hurry and wanted to change just the LBJ's, you could probably do it in 30min a side--- as long as none of the bolts snapped! Separating the OTRE and LBJ is easy--- give the knuckle a tap, on the side (not the threaded shaft of the BJ!), with a sledge and the TRE will pop off. It really isn't hard--- soak the bolts in rust blaster for a few hrs and go for it! If you don't replace the TRE's you don't need an alignment.

MuddyButt: Not to worry! Do the above, for piece of mind, and order the B+M cooler for $60.... this mod takes no more than a couple of hours! Again, easy!! Just follow the orientation/ instructions and it will be great. The only part that's a pain is removing the old hose from the hardline--- work it, and be patient. You may have to buy a little more hose depending where you choose to run the line and mount it. With these two issues completed, you can be assured you've eliminated two big concerns with our aging toys!

Good luck!

 

[airmax233]

Mine need attention real bad they appear to be torned

 

[Nelsonmd]

Uh, yeah. Those are a disaster waiting to happen. Replace them immediately.

 

[airmax233]

Thanks sir :thumb: ,and what about the bolts should I get new ones as well? :noidea:

 

[snivilous]

Thanks sir :thumb: ,and what about the bolts should I get new ones as well? :noidea:

Yea I definitely would... Bad things can happen otherwise :lol:

 

[DiggerT4R]

Just ordered up BJs for mine. I've only had it for 2mo now and have been doing maintenance like crazy before I lift it. It drives nice and tight but due to lack of maintenance from the previous owner I figured I'd get it done. $180 from camelback for oem and bolts. My paranoia should subside afterwards.

 

[airmax233]

Yea I definitely would... Bad things can happen otherwise :lol:

Cool thanks Sniv :thumb3:

 

[Nelsonmd]

Thanks sir :thumb: ,and what about the bolts should I get new ones as well? :noidea:

Yea I definitely would... Bad things can happen otherwise :lol:

Yeah, I mean your spending over $150 on the LBJ's, I don't know why you wouldn't spend another $20 to get bolts that haven't been overtorqued by a shop that just hit it with an air gun.

 

[Rock_Rat]

Didn't change my LBJ's until 311K miles - no problem

I need to stay off this forum for awhile... I'm afraid to even drive my 4runner until I replace my LBJ's and radiator. I'm at 155,000 miles now and neither have been replaced. I feel like if I hadn't found this forum I would have driven it until something failed. (

I bought my T4R new from the dealer and put 311K miles on it since and didn't change the LBJ's until about two weeks ago. Added a tranny cooler back in November - all because of this forum. BTW - ball joints were still in great shape but replaced with OEM anyway. Not bad for the casual offroad driver. My vehicle was never involved in the LBJ recall. OMG - PANIC ATTACK!!!!! Do it for the peace of mind! Guess I got lucky.