Lift overhaul, Want more height.

[Qjake]

I'm planning to overhaul my current lift set-up for the purpose of gaining some more height. I wanted to run my ideas by you guys in the hopes of getting your opinions and suggestions etc. on my plans.

In the rear I'm planing to swap out my current Icon shocks and 2" lift coils for the Metal-Tech long travel rear set up with Metal-Tech's Offset Lower Links. As this set-up only offers 2' of lift and I'm already sitting just a tad ass low, I plan on adding a 1" spacer to the coil. Also I already have a set of the extended rear sway bar links. I'll also be reinstalling the air bags I currently use for towing my camper.

In the front my plan is to adjust my coilovers (Icon ET non resi) to their max and add a 1/4' spacer to the left to correct the lean. According to icon this (max setting) is no more than 2" of exposed thread between the shock top cap and the adjuster ring. I currently have just a tad over 1-1/2" showing so I should be able to coax another inch outta the front.

This leads me to some questions.
In the rear, Will I be able to keep the correct pinion angle/axle housing location with only the lower links? Should I consider adjustable upper links and/or track bar? Will my airbags work with the dual rate Metal-Tech springs?

In the front, I assume the OEM CV joints/axles are going to be an issue? I've browsed the RCV Performance site but don't see their ultimate axles listed for 10+runners. Are there other companies that manufacture high angle cvs? Will I need to get/make some custom sway bar links?

Is there anything i'm missing??

Any and all input is appreciated, thanks

 

[cbielat]

op2: I too am always wanting more height. I was thinking some of the same things you had mentioned while I've been researching. I read somewhere it wasn't good to have a spacer above the coilover top mount. Addressing the lengthened CV axles would be a must. I can't wait to see how much lift you end up with.

 

[thebwlife]

Check out the rear allpro 3.5" springs. They also say their walker evans front coilovers are good for 3.5" of lift.

 

[Bourbonator]

For some reason, I get a nagging feeling in my stomach when I hear ideas about putting spacers in top-of-the-line coilovers like Icon's. You'll probably also be putting your control arms near their maximum angles, and imho, you're going to need to join the realm of adjustable rear link suspension of Icon, Total Chaos, and the like. Both Total Chaos and Camburg have extended travel kits for the front that offer a max of 4" of lift. At that point, I imagine you'll also need drop brackets or whatever they're called for your front diff and extended axles for your 4wd.

Just my opinion, but I don't see a reason behind doing it. The limiting factor for larger tires seems to be the body/frame, and there's only so much you can chop or grind away. Otherwise, you're just raising your center of gravity for no reason.

 

[thebwlife]

That rig from Germany on here has those 315/70/17 and looks great. Why not just do it like his.

Although I can't imagine driving with no regear on 35's.

 

[FERAL 4R]

In my experience with my FJ, going to 3" front lift will play havoc with your CV's. Be prepared for leaking boots, which can be cured with hose clamps, and possible CV failures (get some spares and know how to swap them out on the trail) but the wear and tear involved isn't worth it.

More lift? Get taller tires and re-gear... Or go full on SAS.

Getting adjustable rear links will allow you to adjust your pinion angles. I had the fully adjustable upper and lower links as well as adjustable track bar... They make a difference with fine tuning the rear axle.

Ditch front sway bar.

 

[thebwlife]

I vote to be the first SAS and 37's.

I'd someday like to do a really mild SAS with 35's.

 

[Qjake]

op2: I too am always wanting more height. I was thinking some of the same things you had mentioned while I've been researching. I read somewhere it wasn't good to have a spacer above the coilover top mount. Addressing the lengthened CV axles would be a must. I can't wait to see how much lift you end up with.

Not going to add spacers in the front per se, but a 1/4" trim packer to correct the drivers side lean

Check out the rear allpro 3.5" springs. They also say their walker evans front coilovers are good for 3.5" of lift.

I did look into the AllPro rears and they are an option that i've not ruled out but I like the longer droop that the Metal-Tech kit offers. The front Icons I have are also good for 3.5"

For some reason, I get a nagging feeling in my stomach when I hear ideas about putting spacers in top-of-the-line coilovers like Icon's. You'll probably also be putting your control arms near their maximum angles, and imho, you're going to need to join the realm of adjustable rear link suspension of Icon, Total Chaos, and the like. Both Total Chaos and Camburg have extended travel kits for the front that offer a max of 4" of lift. At that point, I imagine you'll also need drop brackets or whatever they're called for your front diff and extended axles for your 4wd.

Just my opinion, but I don't see a reason behind doing it. The limiting factor for larger tires seems to be the body/frame, and there's only so much you can chop or grind away. Otherwise, you're just raising your center of gravity for no reason.

Again no spacers up front just a trim packer. I already have LR uca's do you foresee an issue with the lowers? The Metal-Tech rear kit includes adjustable lower links do you see a need to also go with adjustable uppers? Track bar? You also pointed out the front diff drop, yes this will be done and I've already been in contact with RCV performance concerning high angle cv axles.

That rig from Germany on here has those 315/70/17 and looks great. Why not just do it like his.

Although I can't imagine driving with no regear on 35's.

Nor could I. Nor can I imagine that it all works as well as he says :shrug:

In my experience with my FJ, going to 3" front lift will play havoc with your CV's. Be prepared for leaking boots, which can be cured with hose clamps, and possible CV failures (get some spares and know how to swap them out on the trail) but the wear and tear involved isn't worth it.

More lift? Get taller tires and re-gear... Or go full on SAS.

Getting adjustable rear links will allow you to adjust your pinion angles. I had the fully adjustable upper and lower links as well as adjustable track bar... They make a difference with fine tuning the rear axle.

Ditch front sway bar.

My plan is to replace the front cv axles with high angle cv axles from RCV, no boots to leak on the outboard joint.

I vote to be the first SAS and 37's.

I'd someday like to do a really mild SAS with 35's.

I would love to....someday maybe

 

[Qjake]

Heard back from RCV on the cv axles. They don't currently manufacture a set for 5th gens but would gladly make a set of custom axles for approx $2500. Add to that the rear kit, adjustable rear links, spacers, diff drop etc and I'm at about $4k. I'm starting to see that this just isn't gonna be worth it, for $4k I can do the Metal-Tech LT rear kit with links and still have enough to add lockers front and rear. Hmm what to do?

 

[Intruder]

Just out of curiosity, why do you feel you need more height? Even adding another inch of lift won't raise the lowest point on your truck unless you fit bigger tires as well. The extra height will just raise your CoG and make the truck more tippy.

 

[Qjake]

Just out of curiosity, why do you feel you need more height? Even adding another inch of lift won't raise the lowest point on your truck unless you fit bigger tires as well. The extra height will just raise your CoG and make the truck more tippy.

Yeah agreed. It all sounded good at first but you guys have pretty much talked some sense into me. If I'm gonna spend that kind of money I should spend it on things that I can use like lockers and the LT rear.

If TRD would have come out with an SC by now then we would never have had this discussion at all. That's wishful thinking too though I guess.

Thanks for all the input guys!

 

[phillyd2]

Agree about the height issue but also liking the idea of LT for the rear only.

 

[mikey's2010SR5]

My dream would be a SAS up front with a three link with a rear setup to match. Then run 37s. A man can dream.

 

[Alex T4R]

[MENTION=76166]Qjake[/MENTION]. I don't know if you remember or not but I have Metal Tech long travel rear suspension and I like it so far, I didn't push it to the limit yet, but when we were in Rauch Creek, SEP was in front if me and one of his wheel was spinning because it wasn't touching the ground until I guess ATrac kicked in, well my didn't even blink on the same spot. Maybe next time we get out you can check it out.

 

[Mick1]

I have not read all the responses yet. But you need to be aware that the distance of threads on the coil over is not 1:1 in what the ride height increase will be.

From my experience adjusting the coil over, and what i recall, 1" of threads should be more than 1" height increase.

When I was making the adjustment I calculated the ratio of thread to height increase. I don't know if it is linear throughout the range. I don't have the numbers available right now.

 

[cbielat]

Not going to add spacers in the front per se, but a 1/4" trim packer to correct the drivers side lean


I want to do that to the rear but now would that mean I should do that to the front?

 

[Qjake]

I have not read all the responses yet. But you need to be aware that the distance of threads on the coil over is not 1:1 in what the ride height increase will be.

From my experience adjusting the coil over, and what i recall, 1" of threads should be more than 1" height increase.

When I was making the adjustment I calculated the ratio of thread to height increase. I don't know if it is linear throughout the range. I don't have the numbers available right now.

You are absolutely correct! While I'm not sure what the ratio is exactly it is close to .5 to 1

I want to do that to the rear but now would that mean I should do that to the front?

Chris you can get them for both the front and the rear. Now whether or not you should use both I'm not really sure.

 

[Intruder]

You are absolutely correct! While I'm not sure what the ratio is exactly it is close to .5 to 1

I'm not 100% sure on this, but I think it's going to depend on the weight of the truck since you're just increasing the preload on the springs and a heavier truck will require more preload. So just to use round numbers, let's say it takes .5" of thread to give a stock weight truck 1" of additional lift, a truck with a bumper, winch, skids, dual batteries, sliders might need .75" of thread to get that same extra inch of lift.

 

[phillyd2]

I think this video is good evidence that you have enough height even considering they took you around a few rocks you should have gone over at a angle, which would have made the trail much easier. On the other hand its also a good video showing how rear LT shocks may have been a welcome friend but rear lockers would have been your best buddy for life.

 

[Intruder]

I think this video is good evidence that you have enough height even considering they took you around a few rocks you should have gone over at a angle, which would have made the trail much easier.

Agreed. Some of the line choices weren't the greatest (no offence to whoever was spotting). A couple other things I got from the video - too much skinny pedal, left foot braking would've helped in spots, and communications could've been better. We always use FRS radios on the trail because they're cheap, have enough range for spotting, don't require a license or any installation. You can pick up a pair for under $100 at places like Walmart and Best Buy. Otherwise, I always go over hand signals with the person I'm spotting beforehand so we're on the same page if we can't hear each other. Any time your spotter turns their back to you or you can't see them, stop.

Also, what psi were the tires at? Not sure if they were running too high or if the sidewalls were just really stiff.

On the other hand its also a good video showing how rear LT shocks may have been a welcome friend but rear lockers would have been your best buddy for life.

Yup, locker would've made that way easier. Locker + LT would've made it a cake walk.