Looks like I am going to the dark side

[brian2sun]

Curious to hear your explanation of why you think a 3rd Gen is "smarter" to build an offroad vehicle then a 5th Gen. soccer mom vehicle as you say.
Other then the 5th being bigger and can't get thru as tight of trails they can both made to be equally formidable with the right add ons.
BTW,I drive and maintain my GF's 97 Limited 4x4 all the time and yes she is a soccer mom.She bought it in 99 with 19k miles and now has 170k miles.
Now the first Gens are a different story.

I totally agree with you. I was saying soccer moms will love the GC, but they'll also love the 5th gen. Meaning to point out that the 5th gen appeals more to off roaders with the available locker, solid rear axle and body on frame constuction, but they also hit the soccer mom market. The new GC really doesn't hit the off road market IMO, but I will say it looks nice and I would consider buying one if I had kids. But it's a smarter move by Toyota in other words.

I think the 5ths being bigger (like you said) than the 3rds is the only thing not as good for tight trails and such, but the more powerful engine means you could probably pull off 35s or maybe even 37s without needing to regear so that's a big plus to me. I love the 5th gens, they're beautiful. :artist2:

I wouldn't decide not to buy a 5th gen because it has KDSS or any other gizmos, that stuff is pretty trivial. I'm just baggin' on Jeeps in a Yota forum!

 

[harper7]

I totally agree with you. I was saying soccer moms will love the GC, but they'll also love the 5th gen. Meaning to point out that the 5th gen appeals more to off roaders with the available locker, solid rear axle and body on frame constuction, but they also hit the soccer mom market. The new GC really doesn't hit the off road market IMO, but I will say it looks nice and I would consider buying one if I had kids. But it's a smarter move by Toyota in other words.

I think the 5ths being bigger (like you said) than the 3rds is the only thing not as good for tight trails and such, but the more powerful engine means you could probably pull off 35s or maybe even 37s without needing to regear so that's a big plus to me. I love the 5th gens, they're beautiful. :artist2:

I'm just baggin' on Jeeps in a Yota forum!

lol!! I thought you were grouping the 5ths in with the new GC's with that soccer mom statement.:hiding:
Your right about the bigger tires rule on the trails as I'm waiting to put in a rear locker on mine as I want 35's when I wear these 33's out but have been researching regearing with 4.56 gears with the ARB locker 3rd member swap from ECGS.

The KDSS sway bars just bolt on and can come right off same as any sway bars.

BTW , Pretty sure Jed's a hEEP guy disguising as a 4runner owner. .....JK!

 

[adkinsadam1]

Really?! I get THAT much cuff for stating how just how much better the 4runner is than the GC on a 4RUNNER enthusiast website - really?! Really!! But, I guess that my post REALLY shows that I know a lot more about the 4runner than the GC. Really.

 

[Jed]

This was an advertising video, which means I don't believe a word of it.

So you think they went through the trouble of producing a video that explains how they have a stricter test regimen, but it's nothing but lies? LOL, come on now....you've got to be kidding, right?

BTW, that was just a short video. They've documented their extensive testing and have said that it is well beyond anything they've ever done before with any new vehicle in the past. I've read about it several times from several different sources. I really doubt it's BS.

 

[Jed]

Not that I think the factory locker is worth the $$, but Toyota did discontinue the lockers in the later 3rd gens and replaced them with electronic traction control and that continued through the entire run of the 4th gens. But then they brought the lockers back with the FJCs and the Trail Ed. 5th gen. It would appear that Toyota does know that sometimes mechanical devices (albeit electronically actuated) are better even if the technology is older. Take the Colt 1911 (M1911 made me think of this). It's almost 100 years old and it's still the most popular hangun sold today. Technology has made many other handguns possible since then, but are they better? No, just different and IMO most (if not all) are still inferior.

Yeah, electronically actuated locking diffs. And a whole host of other electronic nannies. Just look at the new Trail...it's FULL of them. That's my point--there's no going back. If you want old school 4x4, then you have to buy an old vehicle. You simply have no other choice.

Me? I like tech. I don't shy away from it at all, so this is all good!

 

[Jed]

I get your point about KDSS, but I included that as another thing that has a complicated system to break that isn't controlled by the driver and isn't any better than what the older trucks have (whether it's hydraulic or electric).

I still would not want an expensive hydraulic system to replace my lack of sway bars. How much does that cost to fix when it breaks?

It's not really that complicated and it's probably not going to break (but of course anything is possible). But I still don't see how you can't realize the value in it, especially if you took the time to remove your sway bars for better articulation.

Think of it this way---it's the best of both worlds. You get better articulation when driving offroad, but still have good handling while on road. The fact that you removed your sway bars means that you value offroad ability much more than on-road ability. But with KDSS, you don't have to make that compromise in the first place. Don't be afraid of technology...it's generally a good thing and no matter what you do, time marches on.

 

[Jed]

BTW , Pretty sure Jed's a hEEP guy disguising as a 4runner owner. .....JK!

LOL...not at all. I'm just not a hater like several people on this forum. I also keep an open mind and I'm not loyal to Toyota. I buy what I like, plain and simple. I really had high hopes that Toyota would make the 5th gen a vehicle I would like. Oh well, there's always a chance the 6th gen will be more my style. In the meantime, I have no doubt that my 4th gen will carry me through until the 6th gen arrives. Hopefully by that time we'll still have a 4Runner and it will still be a real SUV and not a crossover SUV.

 

[Jed]

Really?! I get THAT much cuff for stating how just how much better the 4runner is than the GC on a 4RUNNER enthusiast website - really?! Really!! But, I guess that my post REALLY shows that I know a lot more about the 4runner than the GC. Really.

There's nothing wrong with rooting for the home team....but try to be realistic about it! If anything, it just shows we have open minds and enjoy the competition.

 

[TOYSTRY]

There's nothing wrong with rooting for the home team....but try to be realistic about it! If anything, it just shows we have open minds and enjoy the competition.

:iagree:

 

[westwind77]

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6:57am

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6:59am

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7:07am

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7:12am

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7:15am

Wow, that is dedication! Way to go! Keep it up, if you can sway just ONE person from buying a new 5th 4R the world will be a better place for everyone! Fight the good fight, man!

 

[Jed]

I guess this guy ^^^^ is still pretending to have me on ignore. The funny thing about it is that he doesn't realize what a person's post looks like when he's actually on ignore.

 

[M1911]

So you think they went through the trouble of producing a video that explains how they have a stricter test regimen, but it's nothing but lies? LOL, come on now....you've got to be kidding, right?

You believe corporate marketing is something other than fluff?

 

[Quentin]

FYI, if you hit the plus button beside quote on the post and hit quote on the last one you want to respond to, it will put all the quotes into a single replay so you don't have to post 5 times. It's handy.

 

[Jed]

You believe corporate marketing is something other than fluff?

I don't believe this is corporate marketing.

Are you always so pessimistic? What is so hard to believe when a company says it is going above and beyond what it normally does to produce a world class automobile?

I have no reason to believe they are lying. Apparently you do...either that or you've just been so burned in the past that you won't believe anything they say.

 

[westwind77]

I don't believe this is corporate marketing.
What is so hard to believe when a company says it is going above and beyond what it normally does to produce a world class automobile?

Actually glad my 'software' is on the fritz....how else would I get such a good laugh this morning......Bwwwwhhhhhaaahahahahahahaha!

A corporation....marketing....well I never.....that is unheard of....just impossible to fathom! 'World class automobile'...are you serious, it is a JEEP! Even the 4R is not a WCA...wow!

Hey...shhhhh...don't tell anyone....I have this GREAT piece of swampland....umm..rrrr....I mean waterfront property that I could sell you for a low low price....just watch my commercial and you will be sold!

 

[Jed]

Actually glad my 'software' is on the fritz....how else would I get such a good laugh this morning......Bwwwwhhhhhaaahahahahahahaha!

A corporation....marketing....well I never.....that is unheard of....just impossible to fathom! 'World class automobile'...are you serious, it is a JEEP! Even the 4R is not a WCA...wow!

Hey...shhhhh...don't tell anyone....I have this GREAT piece of swampland....umm..rrrr....I mean waterfront property that I could sell you for a low low price....just watch my commercial and you will be sold!

Boy, you have the most unreliable software known to mankind. Or maybe you just love to read my words but can't admit it. Yeah, that's the most logical answer. LOL

Do you think that any car company strives to make anything less than a world class automobile? I'm not sure of your definition, but Chrysler Corp. has said that their intention with the new Grand Cherokee is to produce a "world class" automobile. Notice the quotation marks. They are there for a reason. Don't hurt yourself laughing though, because it is you who is way off base here.

And you can keep your land to yourself. I have no interest in anything you're peddling. M'kay? But thanks for the offer. And have yourself a nice big cup of Hater-ade before your next post.

 

[Jed]

Westwind, don't get too hung up on terminology. You may not understand what "world class" means, or you might just have your own warped definition. Either way, apparently other people agree with the whole "world class" goal of Jeep in regards to the new Grand Cherokee:


Chrysler's Jefferson North Assembly Plant Goes World Class to build 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee - Auto News - Truck Trend

2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee: Good Looking, But Is It Enough?

2009 New York Auto Show: 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee One Step Closer to Reality - The Car Connection

Even Hyundai strives for "World Class":

2010 Hyundai Genesis Coupe - The Truly a World Class Automobile for Comfort and Performance | anycarinfo.com

 

[westwind77]

...10:18am...

... 10:27am...

Still laughing, and I paused the 'software' for a bit, btw. Did really really feel the need to waste those 9 minutes of your life to provide me with links that I will never read? I laugh because you addressed your issue with me but then it seems like something was eating you deep down that you felt the need to respond again. Striving for and achieving are two very different things, I would assume you know this. I am still striving to win the lottery, that must mean all the banks would have no problem giving me a few million dollar loan, right? I mean I am striving for it, which mean I obviouslly will achieve it, right? Oh well, I figured you were so easily convinced by the Jeep commercial that I might have a shot with mine, M'kay? Everyone has goals, big and small, does not mean everyone reaches them, just remember that. Based on the Jeep products that I have been in (stranded & moving) and the past chrysler product I owned they have a L..O..N..G way to go....but it is great to want to strive for something....one day they may achieve it!

 

[Jed]

Still laughing, and I paused the 'software' for a bit, btw. Did really really feel the need to waste those 9 minutes of your life to provide me with links that I will never read? I laugh because you addressed your issue with me but then it seems like something was eating you deep down that you felt the need to respond again. Striving for and achieving are two very different things, I would assume you know this. I am still striving to win the lottery, that must mean all the banks would have no problem giving me a few million dollar loan, right? I mean I am striving for it, which mean I obviouslly will achieve it, right? Oh well, I figured you were so easily convinced by the Jeep commercial that I might have a shot with mine, M'kay? Everyone has goals, big and small, does not mean everyone reaches them, just remember that. Based on the Jeep products that I have been in (stranded & moving) and the past chrysler product I owned they have a L..O..N..G way to go....but it is great to want to strive for something....one day they may achieve it!

LOL, do you really think I did that for you? Get over yourself, bud. This is a public message forum and I provided those links for anyone/everyone interested in reading them. Contrary to what your inflated ego says, they weren't specifically for you.

And BTW, I never said they succeeded in producing a world class vehicle. You might want to brush up on your reading comprehension skills (or lack thereof) before you post your next long-winded rebuttal because they tend to lack common sense or factual information. But thanks for trying!

Oh, and since you seem to care so much....don't worry, my post took far less than 9 minutes. I flip back and forth to the forum throughout the day while I'm working. Thanks for caring, but I can assure the information in that post took no more than a minute of my time.

 

[shearerman320]

I looked at the jeep before making the final decision on the forerunner and Ive got to be Honest that was a sharp looking SUV. I keep my vehicles as long as the bumper to bumper warranty is in effect and then I sell or trade the vehicle in So jeep reliability wasn't in question for me. The downfall to the Jeep for me was the dealerships lack of wanting to deal since it was a 2011 in 2010, and the V6 felt rather sluggish compared to the Toyota and I had no interest in a big V8. The interior was awesome and felt very comfortable, but then again so does Toyota's. I know some of or most of this has been covered but I just wanted to Voice my opinion on the matter. On the above posts I kind of like having someone with an outside opinion of Toyota and Jeep makes you look at the other side of the coin.