Lunchbox Locker on the front axle.

M

mexellent

New member
I was about to pull the trigger on a Spartan for the front axle and someone told me it was a terrible idea. Said the front axle is weak and that it cant handle it. I understand that the front axle is very weak compared to the rear but I'm also pretty reasonable on the throttle. I dont gun it unless I ABSOLUTELY have to and I would imagine with a locker on the front I'd have to gun it even less. Thoughts?

:vader:
 
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Yeah he is correct. The right side cv axle is super weak, but the left side is super stout. Lunch box that sh!t, close your eyes, give her hell, and never look back.
 
mexellent said:
I was about to pull the trigger on a Spartan for the front axle and someone told me it was a terrible idea. Said the front axle is weak and that it cant handle it. I understand that the front axle is very weak compared to the rear but I'm also pretty reasonable on the throttle. I dont gun it unless I ABSOLUTELY have to and I would imagine with a locker on the front I'd have to gun it even less. Thoughts?

:vader:
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The front CV shafts are a weak spot. Front locker always engaged is not fun on the street in ice situations IMO.

But like you said it depends on how you drive it. There are a lot of people that run front lockers and never have an issue. Then some others have broken multiple cv's. The cv's can break in an open diff also.
 
If you don't use 4WD on snowy pavement, it's not a horrible option. I'm moving my Spartan from the rear to the front, but that truck won't see icy pavement any more and I'm also adding a twinstick so I can drop out to 2-lo if get in a bad spot and need to steer.

The nice thing about a lunchbox is if you save your parts from the install you can always take it back out as easy as you put it in if you don't like it.
 
I live in Texas so icy weather isnt a daily occurrence but it does happen. Most people can get around in 2wd. There may be a hill or two that require 4x4 but I think I'd probably be fine if in 2wd most of the time. Also I have KO2's and they are winter rated so thats cool.
 
why not a select-able locker? if you're going through the trouble already, seems like any breakage and you'll be spending it anyways...
 
mexellent said:
I live in Texas so icy weather isnt a daily occurrence but it does happen. Most people can get around in 2wd. There may be a hill or two that require 4x4 but I think I'd probably be fine if in 2wd most of the time. Also I have KO2's and they are winter rated so thats cool.
Click to expand...

You can always use the 4x4 for the hills. Its turning in ice that makes it dangerous.
 
I personally wouldn't convert to a lunchbox front locker without also converting to manual locking hubs as well.

Even when off road, you do not want the front locked 95% of the time. You can't steer worth a damn. On the road, I think it would be downright dangerous. Have you ever driven a truck with a front locker?

If you have manual hubs, you can put in a lunchbox locker, leave one hub locked and the other one free and drive around in 3wd for wheeling (this would also work for snow/ice) and then just get out and lock the other hub when you want to "engage" the front locker.

It would be doable, but frankly, the whole thing sounds like a pain in the ass. I would just save up for a selectable locker or forget locking the front all together.
 
white_n_slow said:
If you have manual hubs, you can put in a lunchbox locker, leave one hub locked and the other one free and drive around in 3wd for wheeling (this would also work for snow/ice) and then just get out and lock the other hub when you want to "engage" the front locker.
Click to expand...

The other option is to wire the ADD to be switched and controllable at the passenger side. I believe Kraze did that.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/147372-krazes-mall-crawler-build-thread-11.html#post1594266
 
NHRunner said:
The other option is to wire the ADD to be switched and controllable at the passenger side. I believe Kraze did that.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/147372-krazes-mall-crawler-build-thread-11.html#post1594266
Click to expand...

I like that A LOT! Thats a super elegant solution right there. :jaw:

I actually heard that the hardcore guys put auto lockers like detroit or spartan in the front and put select-able lockers in the rear. Reasoning is the front wheels will pull you in the direction they are pointing which is where you want to go but the rear wheels will push you straight no matter what. That's just in offroad though, I dont know about snow/ice at speed.

Lots to think about...
 
mexellent said:
I like that A LOT! Thats a super elegant solution right there. :jaw:

I actually heard that the hardcore guys put auto lockers like detroit or spartan in the front and put select-able lockers in the rear. Reasoning is the front wheels will pull you in the direction they are pointing which is where you want to go but the rear wheels will push you straight no matter what. That's just in offroad though, I dont know about snow/ice at speed.

Lots to think about...
Click to expand...

I have always heard horror stories about automatic lockers in front, so I've never even considered it. A couple locals who have been wheeling recreationally and competitively for years gave me the same advice you've heard, that it's easier to turn with the selectable in the rear. Those fellows have forgotten more than I'm ever going to know about wheeling, so I'm going to give it a shot.
 
KidVermicious said:
I have always heard horror stories about automatic lockers in front, so I've never even considered it. A couple locals who have been wheeling recreationally and competitively for years gave me the same advice you've heard, that it's easier to turn with the selectable in the rear. Those fellows have forgotten more than I'm ever going to know about wheeling, so I'm going to give it a shot.
Click to expand...
Yeah. Granted, the people who have the auto lockers up front are running Dana 60's or something ridiculously beefy. I feel with a locked front I should be able to creep up tougher obstacles without using as much skinny pedal as I would without it. In that respect I think it's kinder kn the drivetrain. On the other hand if one wheel gets bound up... Game over.
 
mexellent said:
I like that A LOT! Thats a super elegant solution right there. :jaw:

I actually heard that the hardcore guys put auto lockers like detroit or spartan in the front and put select-able lockers in the rear. Reasoning is the front wheels will pull you in the direction they are pointing which is where you want to go but the rear wheels will push you straight no matter what. That's just in offroad though, I dont know about snow/ice at speed.

Lots to think about...
Click to expand...

This might work in a truck with D60's, but that right there is a surefire formula to breaking front end parts in a 4runner :o Every vehicle that comes from the factory with front and rear lockers (land cruisers, patrols, etc), has a switch that engages the rear, and then front and rear. Front only is not an option. I imagine there must be a good reason for this. Probably the same reason 4runners and FJC's only come with a rear locker.

I do like the ADD switch idea, I completely forgot that was an option (I actually wired one up for my '99 a few years back)
 
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white_n_slow said:
This might work in a truck with D60's, but that right there is a surefire formula to breaking front end parts in a 4runner :o Every vehicle that comes from the factory with front and rear lockers (land cruisers, patrols, etc), has a switch that engages the rear, and then front and rear. Front only is not an option. I imagine there must be a good reason for this. Probably the same reason 4runners and FJC's only come with a rear locker.

I do like the ADD switch idea, I completely forgot that was an option (I actually wired one up for my '99 a few years back)
Click to expand...

Hmm, this is interesting, wonder if the rear locker being engaged helps push the front so the cv's dont take as much stress when locked up front.

I do know that ive seen a few on here just get stuck in snow. Activate the front locker and snap, bye bye cv.
 
Paging: [MENTION=53555]Snowy21[/MENTION] [MENTION=91297]Kraze[/MENTION] or anyone else who may know.

Any more info or write ups on this ADD disabling mod/switch? Search function & google aren't giving good results.
 
JayRolla said:
Hmm, this is interesting, wonder if the rear locker being engaged helps push the front so the cv's dont take as much stress when locked up front.

I do know that ive seen a few on here just get stuck in snow. Activate the front locker and snap, bye bye cv.
Click to expand...
I would think, just based on personal experience, that its simply due to the extra rear traction.
you can go a LOT more places easier, with the rear locked. in fact, id say having the rear locked, and in 2wd is ALMOST as good as being in 4wd and open/open.

so when the rear is locked, the front is doing MUCH less work. thus, less parts breaking.
 
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