Need Repair Advice

[theizzardking]

I asked a friend if I could do my ball joints myself and he said I needed that press that your talking about Izzard. However, if the LBJ's aren't that hard, then I will take the job upon myself. My UBJ's both have torn boots, but they don't seem to have play.

Also, thank you Little Caesar for the link, I will look into that. I bought my 4runner from a Driver's World which is like a CarMax or something like that. I will see if my local Toyota stealership would honor that recall. I am warrantied bumper-to-bumper.

yeah lowers are real easy. follow sponger's write up and you'll be golden.

pick one of these up from HF
Pitman Arm Puller & Tie Rod Puller
and make sure you have these as well.....
tool list
Tools:
Jack and jackstands
14 mm wrench or socket
19 mm wrench or socket
15/ 16 wrench or socket
tie rod fork
hammer

write up
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/103217-lower-ball-joint-removal-installation.html


my only tip is and sponger mentions it is don't use the pickle fork on the tie rod end, only use the arm puller , otherwise you'll damage the rod end, in the write sponger was replacing the rod ends as well so that's why it's used in the write up, another thing is hit all of the bolts with pb blaster the night before really well and leave it parked in the garage over night.

 

[Brian757]

It would almost be pointless to do it myself though.
Here it is broken down.
Buy Moog Ball Joint K90262 at Advance Auto Parts
They are $86.00 a piece so roughly $175.00 for just parts. And then maybe $20.00 in other tools. So I am only really saving like $50-$70 by doing it myself. Also, I am not sure I can do it. So it kind of leaves me to have them do all 4.

Please let me know of alternative ways. I like fiddling. I would like to do my own work, but there isn't much cost efficiency here. Plus I am good friends with the owner of this shop, so they cut me deals versus other mechanics.
They are reputable as well and have awesome work and fabrication skills.
Check them out: http://www.etaoffroad.com/

Slide Show of Toyota/Foreign truck work: http://www.etaoffroad.com/i8.html

 

[downpour11]

Yeah but you could use that $50-$70 on a cool LED spotlight and you'll gain experience on your truck - don't :yield: too soon!

 

[theizzardking]

It would almost be pointless to do it myself though.
Here it is broken down.
Buy Moog Ball Joint K90262 at Advance Auto Parts
They are $86.00 a piece so roughly $175.00 for just parts. And then maybe $20.00 in other tools. So I am only really saving like $50-$70 by doing it myself. Also, I am not sure I can do it. So it kind of leaves me to have them do all 4.

Please let me know of alternative ways. I like fiddling. I would like to do my own work, but there isn't much cost efficiency here. Plus I am good friends with the owner of this shop, so they cut me deals versus other mechanics.
They are reputable as well and have awesome work and fabrication skills.
Check them out: Eastern Truck & Accessories: Home of the 6-Door Dually, Double Wide, and Brute Jeeps

Slide Show of Toyota/Foreign truck work: Eastern Truck & Accessories

fair enough, if that's how it breaks down, i'm the same way if i can get a shop to do a bunch of work for a reasonable price i'd much rather have them do it...provided they are good, sometimes it' just not worth it to bash your knuckles,spend and afternoon cussing at rusted bolts and all of the rest....in fact next week i'm getting quotes to get some sucker to deal with my starter as i don't want to struggle with it,, haha, sure i could do the work...but do i really want to?

 

[BrianSD_42]

My shop said they are installing Moog for upper and lower ball joints. I said that I have heard some negative things about Moog from my forum.

Your shop sucks; go find a better one.

A good Toyota shop would use OEM parts or at least NAPA grade.

Moog is owned by NAPA but is their "low cost alternative" brand.

The f-d up part is this:

* Say Toyota sells a part for $200 at dealership.
* Online dealerships sell same OEM part for $160
* Local crap shops sell you Autozone or Moog for $150.
* They tell you it has a lifetime warranty and you are covered.
* They are actually screwing you because they bought the part for like $50 and for only $10 more than they sold it to you, you could have had a real Toyota part.
* 2 years later the part fails. The part has lifetime warranty but does not cover labor. They charge you labor again and install same sh$tty part.
* You sell the car and next year it fails again on next person.

THAT IS HOW IT WORKS!!!!

If a autoshop doesn't do OEM parts by default then bring in your own parts or request OEM. If they won't do it then go somewhere else.

If you were in San Diego I could recommend a good shop. :laser:

 

[Brian757]

Your shop sucks; go find a better one.

Thats weird. When I go to AdvanceAutoParts, they say their "best" is Moog, "better" is Beck/Arnley, and their "good" is driveworks. I do trust my shop entirely, and their work is exceptional. Among other offroad shops in my area, Eastern is known for their exceptional work.

I have heard OEM is obviously the choice, I will look into that.

Moog is owned by NAPA but is their "low cost alternative" brand.

Actually, Moog is not owned by NAPA Auto Parts. NAPA has an almost identical brand in which they purchased from Federal Mogul. That line is called "Master Ride". They are of almost identical craftsmanship but not owned by NAPA. MOOG is owned by Federal Mogul along with Master Ride.

In terms of NAPA quality, the best would be 555 or "NAPA chassis" which is their premium line of products. 555 is another high-end product but thats $120 per ball joint. (I guess you get what you pay for.)

Although, every Auto Parts store will have their high-end, mid-grade, and low-end product lines, all different but the same in certain ways. In my area, AdvanceAuto's are the most abundant. Probably why Moog is more popular in my area.

O'Reillys has "Rare-Parts" which is $150.00 a ball joint, Beck/Arnley for $90.00, Moog for $85, and MasterPro for $40.
AutoZone carries only 1 brand and its DuraLast for $40.00.
AdvanceAuto has Moog for $90, Beck/Arnley for $106, DriveWorks for $45
PepBoys has only 1 like AutoZone and its Prosteer ball joints for $43.00

I guess it is all about warranties and quality. Just do some homework, purchase my parts, and have my shop install them.

 

[downpour11]

Thats weird. When I go to AdvanceAutoParts, they say their "best" is Moog, "better" is Beck/Arnley, and their "good" is driveworks. NAPA in my area is the same way. I do trust my shop entirely, and their work is exceptional. Among other offroad shops in my area, Eastern is known for their exceptional work.

I have heard OEM is obviously the choice, I will look into that.



Actually, Moog is not owned by NAPA Auto Parts. NAPA has an almost identical brand in which they purchase from Federal Mogul. That line is called "Master Ride". They are of almost craftsmanship but not owned by NAPA. MOOG is owned by Federal Mogul along with Master Ride.

In terms of NAPA quality, the best would be 555 or "NAPA chassis" which is their premium line of products. 555 is another high-end product but thats $120 per ball joint. (I guess you get what you pay for.)

You could get away with those sub-par LBJ's with a stock truck, but like I said you are lifted and it's putting a lot more stress on your ball joints which will lead to premature failure of the moogs etc. Either get the 555's or the OEM's and call it good, or get the crappy one's and replace them again in less than a year.

 

[Brian757]

You could get away with those sub-par LBJ's with a stock truck, but like I said you are lifted and it's putting a lot more stress on your ball joints which will lead to premature failure of the moogs etc. Either get the 555's or the OEM's and call it good, or get the crappy one's and replace them again in less than a year.

Very true. And I was not arguing with brianemc by explaining Moog. He actually helped by having me research ball joints. Its good to know that Moogs are sub-par while I was here thinking they were good.

It seems OEM 4runner ball joints are around $90.00
2002 Toyota 4Runner Parts - 2002 Toyota 4Runner Replacement Parts

I am either assuming 555 will be more than enough or I could always just do a nice Stage 5 Icon setup up front

 

[LittleCaesar]

I have used Beck Arnley stuff on both Hondas and Toyotas in the past and would not hesitate to use them on any 4runner. My buddy bought a pair of BA inner tie rods for his T100 in 06, and sold it last year with the BA inners still holding up after 100,000 miles of use.

If we were talking of replacement parts for American autos, I'd say use Moog and not think twice. Maybe it is since their headquarters used to be in the Motor City (not sure if Federated's HQ is now) that their parts seem to hold up well on the Big Three autos.

Buy the OEM if/when you can afford it and save your pennies for the Icons.

 

[Brian757]

What I am actually thinking of doing now is to buy Beck/Arnley upper and lowers from AdvanceAuto, install the lowers by myself and have my shop install the uppers.

I have a coupon for AdvanceAuto
Moog is currently in Southfield, Michigan I believe.

 

[shadow247]

I voted for the LBJ's. I would do the belts soon too though, but if they are still looking in good shape I would wait. When are you planning to do the LBJ's? I would help you out if you need a hand. I did mine last year myself.

 

[Brian757]

I voted for the LBJ's. I would do the belts soon too though, but if they are still looking in good shape I would wait. When are you planning to do the LBJ's? I would help you out if you need a hand. I did mine last year myself.

That sounds good. I could use a hand. Maybe we could meet at a gun show in at the Convention center next time there is one. Seems you are pro-gun
I went to the one a couple weeks ago.
Let me know!

 

[shadow247]

That sounds good. I could use a hand. Maybe we could meet at a gun show in at the Convention center next time there is one. Seems you are pro-gun
I went to the one a couple weeks ago.
Let me know!

Well since all the noise our dear Führer has been making, I have been avoiding the gun shows. We could meet up at the range one weekend though, I've been needing to get out and exercise my PK380 and Ruger 22/45.

 

[Brian757]

Well since all the noise our dear Führer has been making, I have been avoiding the gun shows. We could meet up at the range one weekend though, I've been needing to get out and exercise my PK380 and Ruger 22/45.

Haha, sounds good man! Which range do you go to?

 

[shadow247]

Well I live in Hampton, so I normally go to Superior on Mercury because it's only 12 bucks to shoot, but I have been wanting to go down to the Lynnhaven/A&P Arms range because my wife can shoot for free. I need to pick up some 380 before I go though, I'm down to one 50 round box of target rounds.

 

[Dutch-Runner '99]

Its nice to see there are some other East Coast guys in my area! :wave:

 

[Brian757]

Well I live in Hampton, so I normally go to Superior on Mercury because it's only 12 bucks to shoot, but I have been wanting to go down to the Lynnhaven/A&P Arms range because my wife can shoot for free. I need to pick up some 380 before I go though, I'm down to one 50 round box of target rounds.

Oh ok. I have a membership for Superior Pawn & Gun. Also, Superior bought out A&P Arms and does value the "women shoot free" special. It runs indefinitely and with my membership, I get my field fee's waived for a full year and also a guest is free(male) with my membership. So when I go with my girl and my friend, we all only pay for targets and rounds. The A&P in Lynnhaven is now Superior Pawn & Gun of Lynnhaven.

And ammo prices have skyrocketed in my area and it is hard finding my 45 ACP ammo. A box of 50 used to be around $22.99 and a box of 100 was around $42.99. Now 50RDS are roughly $32.99 and 100 are roughly $49.99 a box.

 

[Brian757]

For all you folks out there who haven't gotten to see my ball joints, here are pictures. Sorry! I'm sure you need these to make your decision!!

Front UBJ(Driver Side):

Front UBJ(Passenger Side):

The lower ball joints look pretty good. Nowhere in the same condition as my uppers. I was informed about a recall on the lower ball joints and looked into it. Apparently my LBJ's were replaced back in '06 when my truck had roughly 30,000 miles on it. Today it sits with 118,000 miles on it.

 

[shadow247]

Holy crap those uppers are toast! Yeah I'd say do them for sure. I haven't tackle the UBJ on these trucks yet but I can't imagine them being nearly as easy a the lowers. I will look up the FSM pages on TS and post them for you. Then you can decide if you want to tackle them yourself or have a shop do it.

 

[downpour11]

I recommend having a table vice ready to hold the pitman arm while you try and press the UBJ out if you plan to do it yourself lol they suuuckk